Anyone else in Canada having this problem?

I think what you posted just proves my point regarding logging companies not being permitted to just close a road:


Traffic control devices
6 (1) A district manager or an official may cause a traffic control device to be erected on a forest service road if, in the district manager's opinion, restrictions on the use of the road or the traffic on the road are required to achieve the purposes of section 4 (b) and (c) of the Ministry of Forests Act.

(2) Without limiting the generality of subsection (1), a traffic control device may be used in any of the following ways:
(a) to close the road to all traffic or to specified categories or sizes of motor vehicles including those not engaged in commercial activities;


It says the district manager can close a road. Which means a pubic official has the authority to do it, not a company. The company can ask to have it closed and presumably members of the public can have input if they wish.
 
hmm, well been a buisy day round here and I thought 13 hours in my truck was good ...... well Stubble and Clarke Ill start debarking my logs when you get hay trucks to start wrapping hay and cattle trucks to shrink wrap cows so there SH!T dosnt fly out of the sides of the trailer and all over my porche :eek: and when fish trucks use air fresheners and when some races are banned from cutting holes in the floors and using the highway as a toilet !
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I must say that I am not in favour of anyone transporting thier goods on public roadways wihtout securing them properly, especially if they are potentially hazardous such as bark or chunks of wood and branches that often come off of logging trucks.

oh yea and there is no way a peice of BIODEGRATABLE bark would fly back far nuff to hit you unless you were following to closly.....2 seconds @ 100kmph is 2 power poles which is 200 meters ;)
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Lets see what the BC MVA says abotu following too closely:

Following too closely

162 (1) A driver of a vehicle must not cause or permit the vehicle to follow another vehicle more closely than is reasonable and prudent, having due regard for the speed of the vehicles and the amount and nature of traffic on and the condition of the highway.

(2) The driver of a commercial motor vehicle or a combination of vehicles, when driving on a roadway outside a business or residence district, must not follow within 60 m of another commercial motor vehicle or a combination of vehicles, but this must not be construed to prevent one commercial motor vehicle or a combination of vehicles overtaking and passing another.
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In (1) it says that you shouldn't folow more closely than is reasonable. I guess the question is: SHould you determine how close is reasonable to follow based on an assumption that the professional driver ahead has properly secured his load? Or should you assume that the driver has a somewhat unsecured load, and debris will be airborne?

From experience with logging trucks and thier airborne debris, I try to keep well back form these trucks, since I don't want my windshield to get hit with crap. People that are unfamiliar with these trucks may not be so prudent.

Not only that, but there are passing lanes to think about, when vehicles are in much closer proximity.

(2) States that commercial vehicles cannot follow each other more cosely than 60m, not 200.

@ 58,000kgs your dam rights I am superior on the road
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I will leave that one alone.;)

and thanks Foxer for the laws on road use, guess we can close em down
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Nope, according to Foxers post, the district manager, a public official can. A company cannot without authorization.

:)
 
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I think what you posted just proves my point regarding logging companies not being permitted to just close a road:

It says the district manager can close a road. Which means a pubic official has the authority to do it, not a company. The company can ask to have it closed and presumably members of the public can have input if they wish.
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No, that's just what's spelled out for THAT act, and with respect to certain roads. That doesn't mean others cannot close roads.

And there's very little allowance for public input. It just allows for other agencies to deal with an agent as well - for example imagine WCB had some sort of concern over the road, they could get it shut down as well. It shouldn't be confused with a municipality changing the zoning of an area or something where there's a tradition of public input first.

It's pretty much guaranteed if a leaseholder goes to the agent and complains about problems and asks for the right to close that road that they'll get it. That could apply to roads not currently in use for example, but where gear or structures left behind or such will be retrieved later or used later and is being damaged.

Bottom line - the roads are there to harvest lumber and if there's 'problems' that are interfereing with that the companies will have the roads closed. So, it's important to look at how we can have fewer problems with the forest companies and work with them to make sure they haven't got a cause to do that. Otherwise, we'll see more road closures in the future.
 
Nope, according to Foxers post, the district manager, a public official can. A company cannot without authorization.
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No, that's not what i posted. What i posted is that it's within the manager's right to close a road. I did not post that it's EXCLUSIVELY his right and his alone.

There's a difference.

And from a practical point of view, if a company decides a road should be closed, and it's not within their power to close the road in question by themselves, and they go to the agent asking for that road to be closed citing saftey concerns and interference with business, the road is going to be closed. So it amounts to the same thing in the end anyway even where they don't have authority.
 
I must say that I am not in favour of anyone transporting thier goods on public roadways wihtout securing them properly, especially if they are potentially hazardous such as bark or chunks of wood and branches that often come off of logging trucks.
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I have to ask - couldn't they just throw a tarp or something over it to resolve the problem? It does seem a little silly to have junk flying off the vehicle. I've not had that problem with logging trucks specifically, but i can see where it'd be a concern.
 
Well to contain the load,they would have to completely encase the logs which would take time.However I don't see why logging companies aren't forced to be responsible for their loads like everyone else.Almost every time I meet or pass a logging truck on the highway my vehicle gets struck with some debris from the load.
 
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There is always room for public input if your point is a valid one, and you can organize enough people (or organizations) to support you.

You woud be amazed at how many gates have been opened up after people made a stink about it.
 
There is always room for public input if your point is a valid one, and you can organize enough people (or organizations) to support you.

You woud be amazed at how many gates have been opened up after people made a stink about it.
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Well I can tell you this isn't a thread about how many roads we're getting OPEN :D So it's not working for us as a rule.
 
Foxer said:
I have to ask - couldn't they just throw a tarp or something over it to resolve the problem? It does seem a little silly to have junk flying off the vehicle. I've not had that problem with logging trucks specifically, but i can see where it'd be a concern.
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I am on the road with logging trucks daily. Some of my good friends drive them.

They leave debris on the road reguarly, and they regularly have debris airborne, where it could hit windshields, and cause a motorist to be alarmed enough to crash.

As SJ says, they should simply be responsible for thier loads.
 
Foxer said:
Well I can tell you this isn't a thread about how many roads we're getting OPEN :D So it's not working for us as a rule.
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Private propert roads notwithstanding....:)

It's probbaly not workign becuase people are more interested in ranting on the internet, than getting local organizations to support thier cause. Or thier cause isn't valid to begin with. (like if they wated to have full acess to a area that is being intensively logged, as opposed to getting a gate opened that hasn't had any activity in 6 mons);)
 
It's probbaly not workign becuase people are more interested in ranting on the internet, than getting local organizations to support thier cause. Or thier cause isn't valid to begin with. (like if they wated to have full acess to a area that is being intensively logged, as opposed to getting a gate opened that hasn't had any activity in 6 mons)
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Well the fact is i don't think we've had a major problem here - most of the areas have enough open roads that people are happy. But that could change.

If a company has anything close to a valid concern about their business or people's saftey, there's little doubt we wont' be getting roads opened. Gov'ts could get sued left and right over that. I'm thinking a little education now and working with the companies a bit might prevent any kind of future problems. Especially where they own the land (like on the island).
 
Yet they are blocking legal hunting rights (which is illegal to do) to have access to harvest the Critters within, while in many cases letting their subcontractors take the gate keys home so they can come back on their days off, and fill their hunting tags. :mad:
 
Yet they are blocking legal hunting rights (which is illegal to do) to have access to harvest the Critters within, while in many cases letting their subcontractors take the gate keys home so they can come back on their days off, and fill their hunting tags.
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They are not interfereing with a legal hunt sealing off the road if you're not allowed on that road, any more than a landowner is by denying you permission to hunt on his land.

Of course you can still hike into an area that's not private property, even if you're not allowed to use the road. There's a big difference between being allowed to close the road and deying access to the whole area.

Those roads are there to allow the company to do it's buisness, and if they feel that business is threatened (by hunters or others) then they'll deny access. If they own the land, they may deny access for purposes of liability (people getting hurt on their property can sue).

We need to be working with these companies. That's worked in some parts of bc, where local hunting clubs are given keys to gates.
 
People need to realize that that these loaded trucks take alot to stop and yes they deserve alot more respect then a pick up. I have drove truck and know what it takes to stop one and manuevere one, if I had my way everyone should drive a big truck for a week. This would maybe help people realize what happens when you get in front of them and cut them off.
I don't agree with banning hunting on logging roads etc but joe public should follow the rules of the road (radios, speed limits) and realize that the logging traffic has the right of way. Remember also that a logging truck can pull you out but you will never pull out a logging truck. If you get stuck avoiding a logging truck they will pull you out if you were being courtious if you were being a jack a$$ they probably won't.
And remember for everyone that doesn't like logging, oil companies etc everyone needs these comodities and if you figure you don't just look at your house, truck, gun etc and then tell me you don't!!!
Everyone has the right to come home to their families at the end of the day in the same state as they left in the morning. This is the reason for the signs, gates and rules. Safety is a big part of everyones day!!!
 
so now we are not securing our loads properly ? thats funny the DOT seems to aprove of it and there the guys that matter ;) trying not to laff but BULLS!T that every truck has bark and debree falling off of it , our highway here would look like a lumberyard seeing we are the logging capitol of BC and about 1200-1300 trucks a day cruise the highways, now granted in Alberta they dont have length laws so logs can drag on the ground and shatter etc , in BC we have severe laws on lengths and are enforced , it is also illegal to have debree in a load (loose branches etc) and the mill fines a company for hauling into there decks here , so lets think before we all jump up and down and beg to be on the bandwagon, I travel 700kms a day on highway and have yet to see a chunk of log on the road, bark yes , mud yes at logging road entrances

saying gravel trucks run tarps to stop debree..BS my 2 best friends are in alberta hauling gravel by grande cache and they dont tarp up atall and they didnt in grande prairie when I was there last spring either, its the paving crews that tarp hot assphault to keep it hot .
If your gonna argue make it a valid one thats a law breaking ONE not something you think should be a law , but then maybe we could change some laws , seeing there are some pretty steep fines for truckers over silly little things like a balding tire or a headlight out or a offroad light not covered , speeding on logging roads, not calling posted km signs mud on the truck on highway, .....maybe we could impliment these same fines to hunters and other public and enforce it as strongly as they do to us, that would be fair ?

Yet they are blocking legal hunting rights
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yup and your messing with MY legal rights to make a living so who wins here?

the funny thing is I haul logs 8-9 months of the year but this argument only comes up for about a month and a half a year? whats up with that? oh yea my bad its your month to play rambo and to hell with everyone else !
 
bone-collector said:
yup and your messing with MY legal rights to make a living so who wins here?

the funny thing is I haul logs 8-9 months of the year but this argument only comes up for about a month and a half a year? whats up with that? oh yea my bad its your month to play rambo and to hell with everyone else !
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Yah check the regs hunting season is 3 months of the year, and happens at the same time every year...go figure.
Also I never said to hell with everyone else, and leave the "Rambo" references to the antis. :mad:

Besides it was the Logging companies that put the No Hunting signs up just in time for Hunting season, yet I'm still seeing their contractors hunting in the Bush...so your safety can't be a real issue to the companies. :rolleyes:

Well like many others in my area I was all for helping the logging companies, but now if I see someone suspicious walking into the bush It's no longer my problem...enjoy the Tree Spikers, Poachers, Vandals, Arsonists, and Grow Ops, and when you roll your truck, enjoy the long wait in the brush pinned in your cab...Not my problem, no more free security from me, and many others in our area. :mad:
 
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once again , if we do hunt, and thats a big IF , here we dont get gate keys, there open in the morning closed at night , but if a crew member from any company is hunting, they A have a radio and can call there kms, B know the road rules and stay out of the way , C do not hold up traffic, now I relise Calum that you probably follow the same rules as I just said, but many dont and its easier to just shut it all down than to chase 1 or 2 bad apples around

there is no 1 person has more rights to hunt there than another , it just comes down to numbers in the end and like I said there are gates here that we do NOT have keys to there only open during hours of opperations so hunting for us is out as well 99% of the time , van isle I dont know about
 
Quit your cryin Calum.
Find a new place to hunt for the time being.When the logging is done and road opens up again I am sure the new foliage growth will enhance your hunting success for some years to come.
 
trying not to laff but BULLS!T that every truck has bark and debree falling off of it , our highway here would look like a lumberyard seeing we are the logging capitol of BC and about 1200-1300 trucks a day cruise the highways, now granted in Alberta they dont have length laws so logs can drag on the ground and shatter etc ,
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I am talking about northern Alberta near Fort Mcmurray where almost every logging truck that I meet has bark and debris falling off of the logs.Of course by the time they travel 200km to the mill,most of it will have fallen off on the highway,so there won't be much left on the road..
 
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