Barrel Indexing
- Thread starter abalas
- Start date
in the case of the m14 rifle, indexing the barrel is placing it in it's correct rotational position to the receiver. The "spline ways" that the flash hider slides onto and the same for the gas assembly , as well as the gas port are all machined in relation to the top dead center of the barrel. If your barrel is not rotationally aligned so that top dead center of the barrel is "out of index", then your front sight may not align with the rear correctly, your oprod may have a twist to it's travel...... ect ect. Generally, a slightly out of index barrel will not cause a rifle malfunction but may cause the shooter to have to drift the rear sight far to one side.
I see.....that explanation makes sense...now, how easy it is to rotate the barrel to align it with the receiver? Would I need to see a gunsmith to do that?
Does this meant that all M14 have this issue? Hmm...I was hoping once I receive my M14, a bit of cleaning and I would take it to the range but I guess not. It sure is a nice rifle but the low price does provide some indication of the later time investment necessary to get the file to full operational status.
Does this meant that all M14 have this issue? Hmm...I was hoping once I receive my M14, a bit of cleaning and I would take it to the range but I guess not. It sure is a nice rifle but the low price does provide some indication of the later time investment necessary to get the file to full operational status.
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gunsmith's services are generally required, or at least someone with the appropriate barrel vice and action wrench.
Depending where you are located, you may find local support, Hungry hosts his "road trip" M14 clinics, and I host m14 clinics in the Vancouver area. Barrel indexing is a snap at the clinics.
There are also many fellow CGN'ers across the country who may be able to help you out, depending on your location.
Not all have indexing issues...... maybe a ballpark "might" be 30% or less.
Out of the well over a hundred I have serviced I have seen only ONE that had an indexing issue that made it not cycle properly. Many m14 owners simply scope or mount forward optics on a handguard rail and the sights become moot and the minor amount of "out of index" becomes moot as well.
Depending where you are located, you may find local support, Hungry hosts his "road trip" M14 clinics, and I host m14 clinics in the Vancouver area. Barrel indexing is a snap at the clinics.
There are also many fellow CGN'ers across the country who may be able to help you out, depending on your location.
Not all have indexing issues...... maybe a ballpark "might" be 30% or less.
Out of the well over a hundred I have serviced I have seen only ONE that had an indexing issue that made it not cycle properly. Many m14 owners simply scope or mount forward optics on a handguard rail and the sights become moot and the minor amount of "out of index" becomes moot as well.
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As mentionned, the proper tools are needed, but indexing is not particularly difficult. Sometimes the most challenging part of the job is removing the stupid and unnecessary setscrew that the Chinese install on the right hand side of the receiver ring.
Also, you shouldn't assume that just because you have a front sight that requires you to crank the rear sight way over, your barrel is poorly indexed. In my case a new flash hider completely cured the problem.
- Location
- In lalaland, that is Ottawa.
Barrell Indexing...for a Sten
During the days when I was permanently damaging my ears. on the ranges, for the Sten, I would try and get 3rd or 4th behind one firing point. I would observe the first 2 or 3 targets and if the group was not well placed, that is right on or slighty high, I would loosen the barrell nut and turn the barrell sufficient to hopefull correct the windage. Seemed to work pretty good.
SOF
During the days when I was permanently damaging my ears. on the ranges, for the Sten, I would try and get 3rd or 4th behind one firing point. I would observe the first 2 or 3 targets and if the group was not well placed, that is right on or slighty high, I would loosen the barrell nut and turn the barrell sufficient to hopefull correct the windage. Seemed to work pretty good.
SOF
So, once I get my M14, I have 3 options:
- before I shoot it, get it to a gunsmith to have a look and correct whatever needs correcting, especially barrel reindexing, or:
- notice if the rifle shoots off center, if I need to excessively crank the rear sight off to one side, this means that barrel needs reindexing, thus, take it to a gunsmith, or:
- shoot it and all seems in order, keep shooting and enojoying the rifle.
Would ammo type, commercial 308 vs. milsup 7.62 incorrectly lead to a conclusion that barren needs reindexing where, in fact, it is the ammo that causes it? Can ammo type cause such off centre shots at all?
- before I shoot it, get it to a gunsmith to have a look and correct whatever needs correcting, especially barrel reindexing, or:
- notice if the rifle shoots off center, if I need to excessively crank the rear sight off to one side, this means that barrel needs reindexing, thus, take it to a gunsmith, or:
- shoot it and all seems in order, keep shooting and enojoying the rifle.
Would ammo type, commercial 308 vs. milsup 7.62 incorrectly lead to a conclusion that barren needs reindexing where, in fact, it is the ammo that causes it? Can ammo type cause such off centre shots at all?
I don't think ammo type will cause your shots to be off to the left or right.
However, the M14/M1A rifles were designed for 157 (I think) grain military ammunition. Using heavier rounds can "batter" the action, and may eventually cause problems.
You might be OK using 168 grain rounds, but it might be best to avoid anything over that.
7.62 is not the same as commercial 308. I think there have been some threads on that in the past.
APG
However, the M14/M1A rifles were designed for 157 (I think) grain military ammunition. Using heavier rounds can "batter" the action, and may eventually cause problems.
You might be OK using 168 grain rounds, but it might be best to avoid anything over that.
7.62 is not the same as commercial 308. I think there have been some threads on that in the past.
APG
Get the rifle.
Clean it.
Inspect it carefully.
If the barrel index is way off, you will be able to see it. With rifle action level, the sight will point slightly left or right. Do not assume that you are going to have a problem. In all liklihood indexing will be fine.
Crank the rear sight to high elevation. Push on the aperture with your thumb. It should not easily shift down. Turn the windage. See if the sight is moving smoothly and uniformly.
Take the rifle out and shoot it, before you do anything to it, or spend any money on it.
Do a search here, and you will find a LOT of information about these rifles.
Clean it.
Inspect it carefully.
If the barrel index is way off, you will be able to see it. With rifle action level, the sight will point slightly left or right. Do not assume that you are going to have a problem. In all liklihood indexing will be fine.
Crank the rear sight to high elevation. Push on the aperture with your thumb. It should not easily shift down. Turn the windage. See if the sight is moving smoothly and uniformly.
Take the rifle out and shoot it, before you do anything to it, or spend any money on it.
Do a search here, and you will find a LOT of information about these rifles.
abalas, If I knew my gunsmith stopped machining my barrel to have a look at your imaginary problems on perfectly functioning brand new M305 I'd be pissed. Even barel being out of index so that oprod is binding may be fixed just by smearing some lapping compound and running it back and forth till is becomes smoohtest action ever. 10 minute fix.
- some sort of biodegradable vegetable oil based or whatever it is. Not something I would look forward. Well, I guess you really are new.
