Best production div. gun for mag changes?

Two Alpha

Two Alpha

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Not having much experience with any of the usual top contenders, do any of them stand out as being noticeably easier to do a quick mag change with?

I've been primarily shooting in Open for a few years now, pretty sure that I can adapt back to production sights and triggers but mag changes that feel like the proverbial "square peg in a round hole" will drive me crazy.

Which production division gun do you guys think is the best for fast mag changes?
 
I like my HK mag release, and the fact that the mags don't just, "drop-free", they actually are under pressure and "spring out". I find the more I practice the easier it seems (go figure).
 
I second the HK mag release. Mag changes are fast and smooth. I also like the position of the mag release. My mag changes with the HK are much faster than with my Glocks, CZ etc
 
HK is definately NOT the way to go.

The mag release on the HK is the slowest of all of them. Sorry guys, the lever is slower than the button.

The real deal, though, is the combination of the shape of the top of the mag, and the contour of the entrance to the magwell.

For instance, mag changes on a Glock are kind fa pain, because the mag is basically shaped like a damned brick, and the rear of the mag well can catch on the rim of the top cartridge... that part of a glock is poorly thought out.

In my opinion, the best production gun I've tried for mag changes was the CZ. Narrow top mags, with a generour front to rear flare in the mag well. It's better than Glock and Berreta, anyhow.

I haven't tried mag changes in a SIG.

Be careful buying a CZ, though. Their quality control is the pitts lately. You will nearly certainly be buying a fur coat for a gunsmith's wife if you get a "friday gun" out of CZUB. Buy one direct from Gunnar, and get hims to go over it with a fine tooth comb, first.
 
to each his own. I can not reach the HK mag release with my thumb without re-adjusting my grip, but because it is ambi- release (nag release on both sides), I just bring my trigger finger back and give a light press and out she goes.
I agree about the brick shape to the Glock mags, but didn't want to flame and upset glock owners.
 
Quigley said:
Double stacks are easier hit the reload so I would look at a Para LDA (nice trigger as well)

Cheers
Click to expand...

I don't know about the LDA... it's got a nice, light trigger... but it's about 3/4" long, for EVERY shot. Plus, on the reset, there is a light but feelable "click" as the trigger goes out before the actual reset point. This could easily make you think the trigger is reset, causing some serious trigger freeze.

I'd go CZ-SP01, if you can get a "hand select", or with an EAA Witness, as tuned by Gunnar at Armco.

Quigley's production gun is a Glock... so is mine, come to think of it... :)
 
didn't you use a Glock at the NB provincials, if I remember correctly, you had no problems at all with you mag changes. I have some of it on Video.
 
i think everyone has their own preference and every gun feels slightly different in someone else's hand, the best is to try a bunch of them...

personally i find mag changes faster in my HK USP than my P99 which has a similar mag release. I also found mag changes faster in my HK than any of the press buttons like SIGs/CZs that i have tried. Also i find the springs in HK mags pretty strong, once you tap the mag release lever, they fly out pretty quick
 
You might want to look at the Beretta Elite or the Vertec...they have aggressively chamfered mag well openings that are easy to 'hit' with a mag change...I find the standard mag release button on the Vertec difficult to 'find', however, and am installing the longer Elite button. (Quite legal for Production, I understand) The Springfield XD models also have wide magwell openings and steel mags with a good taper at the top, along with an ambi-mag release catch as standard equipment.
 
Bartledan said:
Quigley's production gun is a Glock... so is mine, come to think of it... :)
Click to expand...

Speaking of which...think I'll start sporting the plastic fantastic till my Bedell Blaster arrives at the door (Marchish)

This should prove to be fun...or at least humbling :p
 
Quigley said:
Speaking of which...think I'll start sporting the plastic fantastic till my Bedell Blaster arrives at the door (Marchish)

This should prove to be fun...or at least humbling :p
Click to expand...

Cue the joke about the comparative levels of plastic and metal in my gun vs. my holster :)

Bring it to the RA on Saturday!
 
I find that a Para standard division gun is a little more demanding on the mag changes than an STI.
That makes me think that the Para LDA might not be the best choice in Production for quick and smooth mag changes.
Anyone have any more comments on the LDA vs the SP01 for mag changes?

How does the Baby Eagle stack up, is it in the ballpark?
 
Two Alpha said:
Which production division gun do you guys think is the best for fast mag changes?
Click to expand...

Actually , all the Productions guns are so close in that field that it would come down to feel and preference. All the mags drop fast when selected, and I have seen guys do fast mag changes with all types of pistols.

Practice is the key, naturally having a pistol the feels good in your hands would be hugh advantage. Some will just hit the mag release and let gravity do the work, others will flick the butt of the pistols out wards forcing the mags to be thrown faster out of the mag well. Other than using centrifugal force to speed the mag exit... all magazine only drop at the speed/weight of gravity exerted on the magazine... thus when selected, it would be very close to the same speed. There will be other variables involved as well... friction of mag vs mag housing and weight of magazine when ejected (empty vs full) etc

For anyone to say one is faster than another particular brand of pistol would be purely subjective. The pistol that feels the best for you will be the fastest with some practice.
 
hey,

Listen, unlike in Open, there is a HUGE variance in the general size and shape of guns which can take you the top in Prod... Personally, I'd suggest you find one that works with you, your hand, your finger length, etc - that will be far more important than tiny differences in mag well shape or design. Everyone's comments will be biased by their own personal preferences, find out for yourself. Remember, you can't count on modifying the grip/trigger (the physical trigger, I mean), etc, you'll be stuck with the default configuration. The GUN needs to fit your hand, first, before you worry about mag changes.

personally, I can't reach the HK/P99 mag release, but I have a friend who loves it. Each to his/her own...
 
Looks like Travis lets gravity do the work while he's busy elsewhere!

It's not release of the mag that I'm concerned about, a little tuning of the mags etc. within the rules should eliminate that as a problem.

It's more the margin of error as the incoming mag enters the gun.

The variations in margin of error will pretty much guarantee a difference of a point or two over a match and may cost you a lot more if you have to go for another mag because the last one has ended up on the ground rather than in the gun!

What's a blown mag change on a comstock stage worth? How about on a fixed time stage?

I'm already pretty sure that the Para LDA is further down the list than I want to go. From what Bartledan says, the CZ SP-01/Tactical is very close to the top of the heap. What else is in the running?
 
IMHO, you're overthinking this issue.....While quick mag changes are certainly an integral part of one's "performance", it's not as critical an issue as that which Omen has said in his post above...If you can't shoot the gun properly because it doesn't fit you, then the fastest mag change in the world isn't going to help your scores. You are concentrating on the mag insertion...that's really your job, not the gun's... ;)
FWIW, the only gun I shot in IPSC that dropped full mags right after the first shot was fired after the mag was inserted was with my Glock G35....A Glock's mag has to inserted "just right"...not too hard and not too soft.
 
It's certainly not the "out" part that is the area of concern. Gravity is gravity, and if you find yourself trying to push a mag into a hole that already has a mag in it... that's not gravity's fault. Push the button a little harder, and a little earlier in your mag change sequence of movements.

The fastest mag changes are the ones where you *don't* flick your wrist. The wrist flick is the "Phillipino Flip", and it is used to make sure you don't step on a mag as you run downfield. Isn't it faster to economize on movement? I practise two mag changes: My moving change, with the "Philipino Flip", and my static (speed shoot) mag change, where they just drop straight out.

If you hit the button before your weak had reaches 1/2 way to your belt, the mag will be awfully far down before you have another mag ready to go in. (get your weak hand moving before you hit the button... it's faster. Too many guys sit there with both hands on or near ther gun, waiting for the mag to start coming out... slow)
 
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