C3A1 used stock

[QueensHorseman]

I have a used C3A1 McMillan stock from back in the day. Many times I thought that I would buy and fit a parker hale target rifle action to it for some old school fun but the proper bottom metal and mags are unobtanium. Wondering what the used stock is worth if I decided to sell or use it for trade value?

Thanks

 

[onthehunt]

I would start at 2k

 

[gordonlbyrne]

post a picture of the stock,i have the action that fits it.

 

[Robbs]

You may have a small fortune on your hands.

 

[gaff]

you can buy them new from McMillan, I would think 60%-80% of the new price.

 

[njohnson]

As you noted getting the rest of the rifle to go with it is the hard part. The bottom metal and mags, a M85 type receiver etc.

If it is somehow original CF issue it may be worth it may be worth a bunch to the right person, otherwise they are a stock that can still be ordered from McM for under $1k USD. Add more for the PH hand stop with bipod spigot and a legit PH bipod.

It’s a nice item to have though. Good luck with the sale.

There was one on eBay a few weeks ago for sub 1k if I recall correctly, not CF issue but a proper spec stock with correct options.

 

[QueensHorseman]

I've offered to send some pics to someone tomorrow for the purposes of posting here and our discussion. Thanks for those that sent me a pm but not sure about selling it just yet. Let's have a discussion about whether it could be an ex CF piece or not. When I bought it years ago the guy had two, perhaps I should have bought them both!

 

[Pblatzz]

I think the going price from McMillan is $899 USD.

 

[njohnson]

Looking forward to seeing it, I’ve always wanted to build a decent clone but it seems like the rest of the rifle and all it’s accessories are very hard to get.

Here’s a couple of pictures with two different iterations of optical platforms used, both the original Unertl day optic, and what appears to be a Cadex scope mount, unidentified picitanny rail and a more modern S&B day scope.

 

[StrelokM38]

Are there aftermarket/clone versions of these stocks available?

 

[njohnson]

Are there aftermarket/clone versions of these stocks available?

Yes, the CF bought an off the shelf stock offered by Mcmillan, it wasn’t a proprietary item just an existing model they offered:

-Mcmillan A2 stock, PH inlet presumably unless CF weapons techs inlet blanks as supplied,
-Moulded in camo finish, OD Green/ Grey marble finish
-Spacer system
-Saddle cheekpiece with single screw
-Fore end accessory rail
-Likely “sniper fill” ( solid f/g fill in butt stock fill no lightweight fill ) but that is an assumption on my part

That’s it.

Same pattern stock available as a regular catalog item, used by the FBI HRT on some 1990’s rifles and the late 90’s Mk13 Mod 0 NSWC 300 Win Mag rifles built at Crane for the US navy.

The biggest hitch is getting the correct barrelled action and accessories, and optical platform. It’s not a 1200TX action like the C3 used and that many PH hunting rifles in the EE use.

 

[Pblatzz]

 

[Pblatzz]

Note the PH mount

 

[njohnson]

Note the PH mount

A vendor had one at the HACS show in Chilliwack last spring for $1000. I could only think of the financial commitment needed to do one of these anywhere close to issue and passed on it.

It’s a rifle I would love to build one day though. After seeing the Cadex S&B combo I will go that route if I ever attempt one, one MST-100 is enough pop can collection for me! And even at that the MST’s as reissued aren’t quite the same as the issue C3 Unertl.

Great photos by the way.

 

[Pblatzz]

That mount and optics are, what you say is Unobtinium...

 

[njohnson]

So I’ve got photos from Queenshorseman to post up on his behalf of the stock in question. Out of the gate I’ll say that while I study these rifles, I’ve never seen a real one up close and only know what’s out there in terms of open source photos. There are some members with first hand knowledge who will hopefully offer an opinion.

To my limited experience it has a lot of hallmarks of a legit item, save for the fixed LOP-but who knows if the CF had some trials stock for T&E prior to choosing the Mcmillan A2 with all the bells and whistles. I don’t know the action and floor plate footprints by sight but the inlet for them as well as as the basic action inlet at the sight line and accessory rail look correct. This is as compared to available photos which is all I have to go on.

I’m more up to speed on US issue late 20th century rifles so looking forward to the input of others.

 

[Robbs]

There was a nice complete example of the C3A1 rifle on display at the Canadian War Museum the last time I visited a few years ago. It was in a case with an early C7, C9 etc.

 

[QueensHorseman]

The M85 action is what intrigues me. The solid top and longer front shank made it about as rigid as a '98 Mauser action can be and helped the action support a heavy, free floated barrel. These rifles were really built with old style but improved components. The components worked well together and were clearly well built but its still surprising that they gave the AW a run for its money and in fact pretty much matched it in accuracy. PH was also about the only one that was able to make the M14, double stack mag work well in a bolt gun. One great thing about a good Mauser '98 style action is the reliability. When a Mauser firing pin hits a primer its going to ignite or it never will. A few milliseconds don't mean a damn if there's no go when needed.

 

[Parker-Hale Mike]

That looks like one of the original test rifle stocks for the trials that lead to the C3A1. Send that picture to Keith Cunningham, he would know.

 

[rgg_7]

QueensHorseman - your stock is definitely a McMillan A2. To confirm if it is C3a1 I would need the following information:

1. Is the stock painted?
2. Is there a visible area that shows the base colour of the stock? Perhaps there is a scratch, under the cheek rest or under the recoil pad?
3. Is the recoil pad marked "Mcmillan"? "Black" in colour?
4. Stock weight?

The stock inletting is not crisp which would indicate to me that there's been another action in the stock (see area around the trigger). Looks like exposed fibers in the barrel channel as well - original are gel coated in this area.

C3a1 action used a M87 receiver. M85 has a longer front ring and I'll take a measurement and post later.

You don't see very many original C3a1 stocks or components out there. The C3a1 stock sold on eBay a few weeks ago was one of a limited rerun - colour was off - and when compared to an original you could see the difference.

If you want to send me a couple more pix's or any info you can PM and i'll give you my email.

Ron