Caliber choice

Max-x....very wordy but your defense is wrong as well. Thats why I added that my scores would put me mid pack in F-O. Against every cartridge choice imaginable (short of magnums) the .223 is holding right in middle of the scoring.

And FTR .308 is not limited to 155gr...
 
max-x said:
I don't believe I specifically indicated that the 223 max range is 300yd, and I'm not sure how my apparent lack of experience should preclude me from spouting vile heresy on a forum. I will however note that beyond 300 yd, it is an inherently handicapping cartridge, even with a berger heavy. If your rules indicate you may only use a 223/ 80.5gr or 308/155 gr, then you aren't in bad shape as the two choices are close to ballistically identical. If you aren't restrained by such rules, there are much better options. Yes, 223 will teach you how to read wind. Yes, it will drop like a 155 308 bullet at range. Absolutely, you can shoot it at extreme ranges accurately. But, in order to shoot at any extended range, and do it well, you begin to encroach the cost bracket of higher performance cartridges, in which case you might as well pick one of those better performers because either way you're going to be paying for it. For an extra ten to fifteen cents per shot compared to 223 you can now have a cartridge with remarkably better performance and usability.
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Read this
http://www.mysticprecision.com/wp/1166/shooting-a-223-accurately-to-a-mile/

But by all means continue to spout that 223 is a 300 yard round.
 
max-x said:
Just trying to save the OP time. It's absolutely an accurate cartridge, and most serious folks go thru a 223 phase- it happens. I did. You'll save money they said. You'll learn lots they said. The last thing I learned from my 223 foray was that it's a waste of time because the real world performance will never be there, and time is the most irreplaceable factor in the whole equation. Shoot inside 300y on paper and the 223 does a good job- the same job the 22lr will do, but the 22lr will teach you more about fundamentals and actually save you money.
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This! 223 will go much farther then 300 but you will learn more with a 22lr at 300.


Then learn to load and look at building a good 6 or 6.5 mm something
 
Breu said:
I'm researching a medium range target rifle. I've been shooting .22lr bench for about 2 years, and want something bigger. I will get into reloading, and will probably start out with a .223, however, if I want to start with a less common round, like a 6.5 for example, is there a place that you can buy less common ammo in bulk to hold me over until I'm proficient at reloading?
Thanks guys
Brent
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Well I will throw out the 7.5x55 since no one mentioned it. The are many better options but since you want bulk to tide you over while you gain experience reloading it is an option. 480 rnd surplus packs are available still. Not the simplest to reload, but has good quality brass. The 7.5x55 is an excellent performer to 800m, im not sure what distance you are hoping for. Goodluck
 
max-x said:
223 is a poor choice both for performance and for developing confidence in reloading. Simple put, it is so small that it is too sensitive in every aspect. Lots of folks tout the championship "mouse gun"; most of those same folks are gunning for top spot with a different caliber.
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HUH ! :onCrack: your KIDDING right ? H:S: f:P: RJ
 
Not quite sure why people buying a rifle,accurizing it until a decent amount of precision has been reached, would want to shoot garbage bulk ammunition.
I see it all the time at our ranges as well, and their results with bulk ammunition are dismal compared to those that reload to a higher quality. I would guess
the latter people might see their accuracy last longer as well. I mention this because several posts here used this to justify the .223 and .308.

Personally I really enjoy my .308 and would not consider pushing junk bullets down range with it.
 
blwebster said:
Not quite sure why people buying a rifle,accurizing it until a decent amount of precision has been reached, would want to shoot garbage bulk ammunition.
I see it all the time at our ranges as well, and their results with bulk ammunition are dismal compared to those that reload to a higher quality. I would guess
the latter people might see their accuracy last longer as well. I mention this because several posts here used this to justify the .223 and .308.

Personally I really enjoy my .308 and would not consider pushing junk bullets down range with it.
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YUP ! Spot on MAKES no Sense ! RJ
 
Hi, I'll add my experience to this as well, for what's it's worth.
I would suggest you jump right to 6.5 Creedmoor from 22LR. Why? Because great factory ammo available and if you are going to get into reloading, the 6.5 is easy to reload for, and you will already have tons of factory once fired brass waiting for you. The 6.5 is soft shooting, very accurate and is truly a 100 yard to 1000 yard caliber all day long, and just may be the last gun you need to buy? If you buy the .223, it is a great round and fun to reload for, as there are tons of different loads to try, you may find it isn't enough for you for longer distances or really windy days.
I have a couple of both, and really do enjoy shooting my 223s, but for longer distance stuff, the 6.5 is the ticket, with less recoil, and more accuracy then the 308.
I do still shoot my 223s a lot but glad it isn't my only go to caliber.
There really is no wrong answer here, but to shoot 22s at 100 yards does start to introduce lots of other errors beyond shooter input and while its a fantastic place to start, I did not find it that rewarding after a certain point. I did have a very accurate Ancshutz target 22LR, and it was great and cheap to run, but now with my 223/6.5/308 rifles, it never gets used anymore. And once the reloading bug gets you, there's no going back and it really is great fun to experiment with loads and components and tune in each rifle.
I do also agree that shooting cheap bulk ammo gets real old, real quick and most people move on from that stage fairly quickly.
Just my thoughts....
 
OP is talking about his first centerfire. He doesn't even reload yet. A used 223 is far more use to his shooter development than a specialized or "boutique" long range cartridge. Let's stop pretending that the gear($$$$) makes the shooter. There is no way he has enough experience to know what he will actually want later. Buying more than a used 223 will probably just cost him more, especially when reselling to buy what t his experience tells him what will meet his needs.
 
guntech said:
Your first box you load can be more accurate than factory rounds... make the leap and get into reloading, the sooner the better... a small cartridge (like a 223) is always cheaper to shoot than a larger one...
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Sage advice from a guy that knows that the hell he is doing. FWIW, go 6BR and never look back.
 
So there are people who don't think the 223 can cut it pass 300 yards, we'll come out to a 600 yard F/class shoot where there are a few 223's shooting on the line and get a lesson. Yes they can be harder to tune then other rounds but you can load for half the cost of a 308 win. At the end of the day if you can tune a 223 to shoot well you are on your way to be a good reloader. I to shoot a 22 LR out to 300 yards, that round will teach you a great amount about shooting. The 6mm BR another top round.

If F/class was limited to 600 yards you couldn't go wrong with the 223 in F/TR and the 6mmBR in F/open
Just the way I see it.

Cheers Bill
 
The OP asked where to find less common ammo in bulk. He didnt ask what caliber he should shoot lol. Everyone here is talking about what caliber he should shoot.
 
I shoot a lot of precision bench .22lr. I did shoot .223 also at some point and enjoyed it a lot. But personally, I prefer .308

Gilbert
 
You can buy 6mmbr and 6.5x55 ammo from Hirsch Precision. The nice part about it is when you are ready to reload you have good brass already saved up.
 
If you shoot RF benchrest and are interested in shooting centerfire BR, then you want a purpose-built 6PPC. If you want to shoot both 100-200 yd BR, you want a Light Varmint 223 with two barrels. One a 14 twist for 100-200 and the other a 7.5 or 8 inch twist for heavy bullets. The second barrel would also be longer since it won't hurt to add weight. In both cases you MUST reload and must also learn advanced loading techniques. In truth, you could do the same with a PPC or a 6BR with the PPC having the edge at close range and the BR having the edge at long range.
If you just want to shoot a centerfire and wish to use factory ammo, the choices are either the 223 or a 308 since ammunition is more plentiful and the choices more varied, for these than any other.
If you are considering hunting, the 308, in the right configuration, can become kind of a hunting/target rifle and work reasonably well for both.
In the end, it all comes down to just where you want to go from here. I think I would be inclined to go woth a 223 if I intended to shoot targets. It would be possible to build a dual purpose 223 which would be quite competitive in both BR and F/tr. If I had no intention of shooting in competition, I would still go with a 223 with the knowledge that I could shoot it a lot for a little.
 
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