Can 38 Special Brass Be used for 357 Mag Rounds?
- Thread starter Cammy7s
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unstableryan
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I wouldn't. I have a .357 mag and .38 special brass is for the 700 fps loads, not the 1200+ loads.
Hodgdon loads for 38 special, although people say they are conservative, say 3.2 to 3.8gr of titegroup for 815-920 fps.
5 gr is a full 5-6k psi above the top .38 special loads.
.357 mag brass isn't too expensive for a few hundred. I would just go with those.
Hodgdon loads for 38 special, although people say they are conservative, say 3.2 to 3.8gr of titegroup for 815-920 fps.
5 gr is a full 5-6k psi above the top .38 special loads.
.357 mag brass isn't too expensive for a few hundred. I would just go with those.
Well,... like so much else... it depends. You'll probably be just fine, provided that you load to the same overall length, thus making the interior space about the same for both cartridges.
In fact you might even get away with doing that in your gun for full-house loads.
Maybe. Work up to it, don't just open your manual and pick a max load, thinking "Splatter said it'd be Okay!"
In fact you might even get away with doing that in your gun for full-house loads.
Maybe. Work up to it, don't just open your manual and pick a max load, thinking "Splatter said it'd be Okay!"
You can use 357mag case to load 38spl or 38+p but cannot use 38 case to load 357, sometimes over pressure will result primer back out and blind the cylinder.
Trigun
easyrider604
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
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While that load doesn't look particularly hot in .357 magnum terms (1,000 fps as shown in Handloads.com), it is a very hot .38 spl load.
I wouldn't suggest that anybody do this and I would not do it now because I have enough .357 brass. However if I had no choice, like in a SHTF situation and I needed a hunting load, I would try light to medium heavy Magnum loads. I'd use Unique, Herco, Universal or 2400, rather than Titegroup which is a rather fast burning powder.
I have been loading my 38 spl ammo to 1,000 fps, chrono'd out of my Ruger GP100 6 incher, using homecast 158 grn RN and SWC from WW in Lee tumble lube molds over 4.6 grains 700X which behaves somewhat like TG. There are no signs at all, of over pressure like difficult extraction or flattened primers, although some experts will say that these two criteria are not conclusive indicators of over pressure. So it is quite likely that 5.0 TG under 158 grn LSWC is within reason.
BTW, I routinely load 125 grain Rainier PHP over 5.1 grains TG. Very comfortable but satisfying and accurate load.
For experimenting using .38 spl brasss, I would start with a .38 spl+P powder charge and work up very slowly from there while using a slow burning magnum powder. Again, this is only a discussion and not an endorsement that we should all experiment...we all got to make a mature decision and that is....DO NOT TRY THIS AT HOME.
Having said that, the 357 magnum was developed from the .38 spl cartridge back in the early 1930s. Elmer Keith and whoever else were experimenting with hotrodding the 38 spl were using .38 spl brass to achieve magnum velocities and pressures. Keith and company were firing these high pressure .38s in large frame S&W revolvers when they were developing what was to become the .357 magnum.
The reason a .357 mag casing is longer by about .125 inch is so that they would not be chambered and thus fired accidentally in .38 spl revolvers which will likely result in catastrophic cylinder failure.
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You guys sure shock me!
One of the best bullets for a 357 is the Keith designed, semi wadcutter, weighing about 168 grains. It has a crimping groove. When it is crimped in the proper groove in 357 brass, it is too long for the cylinder to turn in many 357 revolvers, such as The S&W Model 27 and the Colt Cobra.
Back in the 80s and into the 90s, Skeeter Skelton was the Handgun Editor of a major shooting magazine and a considered expert by the revolver shooting comunity. He talked of this many times, and here was his reccommendation for shooting the long cartridges in shorter cylinder guns. There were two things to do.
1) Use 357 brass and crimp on the shoulder of the bullet, so the over all length was shorter.
2) Use 38 Special brass and crimp in the proper groove. Skeeter actually preferred using the 38 Special brass and crimping properly. The loads he was talking about were for full blown 357 loads.
At the time I had a 357 S&W, so required the shorter cartridges and I also preferred using 38 Special brass.
One might think that the same load would be heavier in 38 brass, but here are the results of chronographing the two loads, same day.
In my gun, 13 grains of old Hercules 2400, in the 38 special brass, 1247 fps
In 357 brass, 13 grains of 2400, 1335 fps. Don't ask me why.
The point is shooters of the day were firing millions of rounds of full power 357 loads in 38 special brass.
One of the best bullets for a 357 is the Keith designed, semi wadcutter, weighing about 168 grains. It has a crimping groove. When it is crimped in the proper groove in 357 brass, it is too long for the cylinder to turn in many 357 revolvers, such as The S&W Model 27 and the Colt Cobra.
Back in the 80s and into the 90s, Skeeter Skelton was the Handgun Editor of a major shooting magazine and a considered expert by the revolver shooting comunity. He talked of this many times, and here was his reccommendation for shooting the long cartridges in shorter cylinder guns. There were two things to do.
1) Use 357 brass and crimp on the shoulder of the bullet, so the over all length was shorter.
2) Use 38 Special brass and crimp in the proper groove. Skeeter actually preferred using the 38 Special brass and crimping properly. The loads he was talking about were for full blown 357 loads.
At the time I had a 357 S&W, so required the shorter cartridges and I also preferred using 38 Special brass.
One might think that the same load would be heavier in 38 brass, but here are the results of chronographing the two loads, same day.
In my gun, 13 grains of old Hercules 2400, in the 38 special brass, 1247 fps
In 357 brass, 13 grains of 2400, 1335 fps. Don't ask me why.
The point is shooters of the day were firing millions of rounds of full power 357 loads in 38 special brass.
The brass is just as strong - but the reduced volume of the .38sp case can make the pressure go higher if you are using one of the faster burning powders.
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easyrider604
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
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- Greater Vancouver, BC
H4831 is correct. I didn't want to say what he did because somebody who doesn't really understand reloading or the consequences of a mistake in the use of the reloaded ammo, might get the wrong message.
Therefore, my last statement in post #5 above is critical. If a 38 spl case is loaded to heavy 357 magnum levels, and it is fired in a 38 spl only rated gun, ....KABOOM!
.38 Special brass is just as strong as .357 Magnum brass and will withstand the same pressures. The direct ancestor of the .357 was the .38-44, which was simply a hot loading in .38 Special cases made for N Frame S&W revolvers. The only thing to watch out for is that the maximum load might be lower in the shorter case.
5 grains of Titegroup with a 158 grain lead bullet will likely work just fine out of .38 cases in a gun of appropriate strength. It is a mild load for .357. It is interesting to note that Hodgdon's lead bullet data doesn't really push the envelope, even though cast bullets will give a lower pressure for the same velocity or a higher velocity for the same pressure compared with jacketed ones.
5 grains of Titegroup with a 158 grain lead bullet will likely work just fine out of .38 cases in a gun of appropriate strength. It is a mild load for .357. It is interesting to note that Hodgdon's lead bullet data doesn't really push the envelope, even though cast bullets will give a lower pressure for the same velocity or a higher velocity for the same pressure compared with jacketed ones.
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- Niagara Region, Ontario. For now
Once again I will say, you should listen to this guy!
Just start low, and go from there.
There is so much more to reloading than sticking to published data, and that goes both ways, hot or light loads! You just have to understand what you are doing and be careful.
Have fun!
I should make note that I am using a .357 magnum firearm(Ruger GP100) in my pursuit of the perfect reloads! I would never try a 357 mag load in a 38 spl. firearm! Lots of good info coming in...anything else I should know?
