Churchill? Hatsan? Looking for a new pump shotgun.

[gyppo]

Hi CGN shotgunners,

I'm looking for a new short or short-ish shotgun. I like the Turkish pump shotguns because the forend can be grabbed much closer to the receiver. I have a Maverick 88 with the 28" barrel, I love the shotgun and it's been dead reliable, but the forend is too much of a reach for my liking and I want a shorter barrel too.

I'm looking at the Hatsan Marine guard 20", or the Churchill 15" in the "stainless steel" finish (which I'm guessing is a coating like on the Hatsan).

Has anyone used guns from both these gunmakers? What did you like, what didn't you?

I really like the look of the 20" with the added capacity, and I've read a lot of good things about Hatsan pump shotguns. The 20" barrel will also give less blast. On the other hand, I like short compact guns with a stock, and they sound like they're super light for packing around the backcountry, but I'm not sure about Churchill (Akkar's) quality. I've watched one video where the guy is shooting the 15" "shockwave" and the action is opening by itself and ejecting shells when he's shooting slugs... not good!

Thanks for any input!

G

 

[brybenn]

I wonder if its the way hes shooting it? Pumps unlock when fired. Poor form and grip could make it look as though the gun opens. Unless he was shooting one handed
Churchill shortys likely wont have choke tubes as most are fixed cylinder. Thats one reason i went with the canuck regulator. The other was to avoid your motivation for wanting one. The long foreend. I find they are very hard to grasp and slip thru my hand easily even when dry. Itsbthe reason i sold my fedarm pump. Loved the gun except the forend and i couldnt bring myself to cut the forend in half

For the 2 you mentioned i think they are about equal in terms of materials and quality. Choose the barrel length you like or buy both and sell the least favorite

 

[EL34/6L6]

I have a few Hatsan pumps and they have always run smoothly and without a hitch. I've always found Hatsan to be the best of the bunch regarding Turkish shotguns. Although most materials are shared between them, Hatsan seems to have better fit finish and better proprietary designs. They have great barrels and are quite light to handle too.

 

[Raton57]

I was disappointed the Churchill short pumps never had choke tubes as well. They seem like a decent gun for the price but I like the Canucks with the tubes.

 

[Buck1950]

Vote for Hatsan MG

I've got 2x Hatsan pumps - one is 24" and the other is the MarineGuard. I'm impressed with the reliable function on both. So I vote for the MG, except that it doesn't have a threaded choke. On the other hand, at 50yds I can keep 'pie plate' hits with SD 'light recoil' slugs just using the front bead. I haven't run 3" Full Power loads in these, not planning to use slugs for hunting. YMMV maybe can be threaded ??
I also have a 19.5" Daly 601 TAC pistol grip semi (it has th-choke - made by Merak) that shot well in the Summer, but I had it out last week and it didn't cycle the SD 'practice slugs' I was using. Could have been the cold/lube since they were fine in June OR the extra thick (it was -5C) coat didn't give enough resistance for the action to work properly ? I haven't determined which . . . sure that I didn't like the cold, maybe the Daly felt the same . . .

 

[gyppo]

Thanks for the input guys. I was really leaning towards Hatsan as a company but ended up getting a Churchill 15" for camp and bush use because of the short length. The included scabbard is great too, not sure if I'll try the "shockwave" type grip. IT seems awkward, but then again the gun is 4.8 pounds with it on!!! I will probably get a 20" Hatsan as well to compare given that it gets top marks from most owners, and sell the one I like least. Or maybe give it to my wife, hehe!
The Churchill has great fit and finish, except for the stock which is a bit crooked. The recoil pad is also pretty hard, so this will be a "fun" shooter. The cerakote finish is excellent, everything fits together tightly. The action is very smooth and although I haven't shot it yet it looks well built. At 5.6 pounds it will make a great hiking shotgun for when I choose to take one along, if it proves reliable of course. Compared to the Norinco break actions I've shot this is significantly better craftsmanship.
I'll update this thread once I've shot the Churchill/Akkar so as to provide future readers and search function users with some more info.
Cheers!

 

[gyppo]

Quick update after shooting about 45 rounds through the Churchill 612 15". One short shuck and I failed to feed one round, otherwise it fed every 2 3/4" shell no problem. Recoil was not a problem with target loads or buck shot, but full power slugs are brutal with the hard butt pad. Score slugs shoot softer and were not bad.
The gun carries very well with the stock on, it balances right in front of the trigger guard.
Velocities are still fairly high despite the short barrel. Winchester 2 3/4" 1-oz slugs going 1,430fps, federal 1 1/4-oz 1,290fps (absolutely brutal recoil), score 00 buck is going 1,210 fps. I don't know if I'll try magnum slugs until I set this gun up with a better recoil pad; I shot 5 of those federal slugs, 3 winchester and 3 of the softer shooting score slugs, plus a box of target loads and a handful of 00 buck. Ouch!

The gun handles very well and fast with the possibility of holding the pump forearm just ahead of the receiver. I find it shoulders very quickly. So far the only issue that has come up is the cerakote on the front sight is already starting to peel off. I'm still not disappointed, for the price. I'll try to update again after I fire it a bunch more.

Thanks again to those who chimed in. The Hatsan is still on my radar, I like these Turkish shotguns.