cold bore versus clean bore

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DoogenBurns said:
Damn! Beat me to it! And really, there's gotta be a point when there's "too much" fouling.
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;) been contemplating this question for a while. These guys speak from experience not really from a scientific perspective. Copper fouling has always been talked about as being bad however these guys are saying some barrels need copper to line the barrel to shoot the same POI and maintain accuracy on a cold bore.
 
when accuracy starts to deteriorate clean it but very important to keep the inside of the receiver, chamber and bolt clean an properly lubed
 
I think you need to determine how your particular rifle reacts to cleaning, heat buildup, "neglect" and treat it accordingly. I'm not convinced all rifles are prone to copper buildup either. I would think that if you are shooting precision, you are somehow keeping score. That benchmark, of some sort of record keeping, should give you an indicator when things are off. I keep some old targets, dated and filed away, because I'm not the greatest at remembering some things.
 
KDX said:
There is such a thing as too clean.
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I wish that were true for some of my best rifles :confused:

Most of them seem to do their best with a brake cleaner scrub for carbon at thirty rounds, and copper cutter back to bare metal at 40 to 50 shots.

Two or three foulers,(offhand or sitting practice),and they're back to singing, for the next box or two.
 
vviking said:
I wish that were true for some of my best rifles :confused:

Most of them seem to do their best with a brake cleaner scrub for carbon at thirty rounds, and copper cutter back to bare metal at 40 to 50 shots.

Two or three foulers,(offhand or sitting practice),and they're back to singing, for the next box or two.
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Are you removing enough copper after 50 rounds to see an indication of it on the patches?
 
Grizzlypeg said:
Are you removing enough copper after 50 rounds to see an indication of it on the patches?
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Oh yeah, Grizz ... 2 or 3 10 minute soakings with CR10, will still colour the patch bright blue on my very worst offenders.
The better ones?, they take only one application till the blue is gone, and the next solvent soaked patch comes out white.
All of 'em shoot their best with a cleaner bore though. Even the match barreled .308 and 6.5.
 
depends on the round, bullet and barrel. factory barrels will foul like a bugger with both copper and carbon. how long that takes is different to each and every gun.

personally, i clean after every match, and in br guns are cleaned after every time up to bat. these use match barrels that are properly lapped and the don't really copper foul at all. with these guns the copper is a few molecules thick and doesn't make any difference. the carbon gets into the corners of the lands. this is where old boots obermeyer though he had everyone beat with the 5r rifling, i don't think it matters at all, but lots of shooters swear by them. problem is the doughnut of carbon that builds up ahead of the throat and these can be a bugger to get out. that is what screws up precision if you ask me.

the whole topic of cold bore shots is a different thing altogether. show me a factory barrel and i will show you a gun that changes poi as it warms up. these barrels are crudely made in an assembly line and i don't care how much you pay for the gun, the insides are all the same.

barrels have to be properly stress relieved and the three best barrels out there for that are krieger bartlein and border. shooting sports generally always allow sighters. killing critters things is a different story. locking down your scope after 20 rounds at the range and trusting it to get you game is a risk. watch where your first two shots hit and then compare it to the rest. if your group changes poi from your first shots but the group is good, then set your scope for where the first shot hit. if its a factory gun don't clean the bugger until you have to. keep if from rusting and leave it alone.
 
2 DIFFERENT goals.

And there is no 1 right answer for every rifle. Each will have its own quirks.

In general, barrels prefer to be fouled to a varying degree for best cold bore shot.

For best accuracy, some barrels want to be spotless, others filthy. Some can go a long time between cleanings (hundreds of rds), other crap out at rd 17.

Only way to find out is to test your rifle under the conditions you want to use it. tune your loads and cleaning procedures to suit

Jerry
 
I wonder if anyone has noticed a difference (if there even is one) by changing bullet brands with these 'picky' barrels
 
All barrels have different likes and that has everything to do with the actual bore dimensions.

Almost all bores vary in the 4th decimal place. Some are small, some are large. Some bullets are fat, some skinny.

That is why we test. In general, match bullets and match barrels are made to close enough tolerances, load tuning gets the job done.

But with factory and surplus rifles, that sizing can vary a whole bunch and "tastes" will vary.

Jerry
 
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