Collectable lever action in 357?

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Superchunk

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I recently added a pair of Turnbull restored Colt .357 SAA's to my collection in anticipation of JT's dictatorship laws....

If the fine folks in the Cowboy Action world could be so kind, I'm looking for the perfect lever action rifle( in .357 too???) to compliment them.

Please share your thoughts and experiences, and the proverbial "if I could only have one, I'd buy a _________" .

I've never owned or shot one, so this will be a learning experience.

Much appreciated.
 
The Japanese Winchester 1892's are pretty nice, a 16" takedown case hardened unit would be pretty sweet.

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Superchunk: A Winchester 1873 (either Miroku-made or Uberti), would make a fitting companion to your Colts. At least, in my opinion. Period correct and beautiful rifles. Of the two brands, Uberti is the closest(especially internally), to the original Winchester rifle. If that is important to you. Externally, there is little to no difference. Likewise operation...loading, cycling the action, etc.

Case hardening colours on the Miroku-Winchester rifles are generally darker, bolder and better defined, than Uberti. Which might match better with your Turnbull Colts.
Uberti stocks come varnished. Whereas the Miroku rifles appear to be oil finished. As the stocks do absorb oil readily. I admit to no real preference between the two. But, the grain on the Miroku rifle stocks really stands out, after a few applications of linseed, or other oil. Makes the case hardening colours seem to stand out, even more.

If you plan on competing in Cowboy Action...the Uberti 1873 would be the logical choice. Very easy to modify for competitive use. As there are plenty of aftermarket competition parts available for these rifles. The Winchester not so much. Parts are very limited, though some headway is being made. Still, the Miroku-Winchester rifles are very smooth operating and capable of competitive use, right out of the box. Plus, can be slicked up to run with the big dogs, with a few simple modifications.

Otherwise, if you only want a handsome rifle that nicely compliments your revolvers , my recommendation would be Miroku-Winchester.

Hope this helps:

Al

ps: I own both brands of rifle
 
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Thanks Fellas!

I have a few Miroku(Browning) antique O/U shotguns that I begun collecting years ago, and can attest to the build quality; thank you for bringing this to my attention!

This will likely be a collectible, though the lure of cowboy action is palpable. That said, are there any distinguishing factors of the Win/MK rifles that I should look for? Serial or date ranges? Calibers & barrel lengths? I'd like to keep my "Cowboy" calibers in 357/38 to reduce ammo stores in the safe, but would explore a different caliber if justifiable.

Thanks for all the insight, really appreciate it!
 
Superchunk: Build quality seems to be pretty consistent overall, with all the Miroku rifles. Regardless of model. Excellent, in other words. No particular serial number range stands out. Individual rifles may demonstrate nicer case hardening or stock figure, etc., but that might be it.

Most folks find the 20" barreled version the nicest balanced and easiest to operate(myself included). But, the 24" version is more period correct. Regardless, both versions still handle very well. The 24" version feeling a bit more weight forward, as expected.

My advice is to handle(and shoot, if possible), rifles having both barrel lengths. Then, choose which one you prefer.

As for barrel configuration: Round versus octagon....most owners tend to go with the octagon barrel(Just like they did in the 19th century). Though original Winchester rifles were first available in round barrel form.. So, it all boils down to personal preference. I own both, and don't really pay much attention to that aspect.

It bears mentioning that, Miroku rifles are available in either rifle, or carbine version. I prefer the rifle version, myself. But again, that's only personal preference.

The .357(though not period correct), is a great caliber choice, in this rifle. Very low (pretty much non-existent)recoil and accurate shooting. Factory ammo and reloading components readily available, just about anywhere. Accommodates .38 Special cartridges readily and makes a great plinking/shooting rifle, overall.

Al
 
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Alex McKr said:
Superchunk: Build quality seems to be pretty consistent overall, with all the Miroku rifles. Regardless of model. Excellent, in other words. No particular serial number range stands out. Individual rifles may demonstrate nicer case hardening or stock figure, etc., but that might be it.

Most folks find the 20" barreled version the nicest balanced and easiest to operate(myself included). But, the 24" version is more period correct. Regardless, both versions still handle very well. Frankly, I don't mind those extra inches of barrel at all. A person soon gets used to the weight forward feel. A little trickier negotiating around stage props at times though, when competing. Other than that, barrel length remains a personal choice.
My advice is to handle(and shoot, if possible), rifles having both barrel lengths. Then, choose which one you prefer.

As for barrel configuration: Round versus octagon....most owners tend to go with the octagon barrel(Just like they did in the 19th century). Though original Winchester rifles were first available in round barrel form.. So, it all boils down to personal preference. I own both, and don't really pay much attention to that aspect.

The .357(though not period correct), is a great caliber choice, in this rifle. Very low recoil and accurate shooting. Factory ammo and reloading components readily available, just about anywhere. Accommodates .38 Special cartridges readily and makes a great plinking/shooting rifle, overall.

Al
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Thanks Al. I spoke with Turnbull; they can do a matching 1873, and potentially a SXS 12 ga for me. Much appreciated!
 
I have a brand new Winchester 1894 Trails End Takedown chambered in 30-30 that I am looking to sell. Send me a message if you are interested in taking a look at it.
 
Alex, a well-known Cowboy Action gunsmith on the left coast, worked on 2 of my 3 Uberti's and my wife's Miroku. Results, she likes the results on my Uberti M73 .357 Carbine (19" barrel) better than her Miroku M73 Short Rifle in .357 (20" barrel). I personally can't tell the difference but "she who competes with me," must be believed. To the original poster if your looking for an easy flawless functioning pistol caliber carbine, you won't go wrong with a clone of the M73. The Winchester M92 and clones are nice starter guns but eventually with practice you will be capable of running the rifle faster than it was designed for, resulting in problems like stove piping, etc
 
Garand: We likely both know the gunsmith in question. Best cowboy gun tinkerer in Canada, in my opinion. I tend to prefer my Uberti just that little bit more, too. Both rifles feel remarkably similar in action. Both, chambered in .357. But....most likely because the Uberti has a 5th generation short stroke kit installed, rather than the stock (about 2nd generation) stroke, in the Miroku. All things being equal(with identical set ups), I doubt there'd be much difference if any, between the two. Hopefully, Pioneer Gun Works starts building Miroku kits again, so that theory can be tested.
But, as it stands now that little shift in lever throw makes enough of a difference in timing(especially, where there's some "bling" to be won) that the Uberti gets the nod, most of the time. Though I do like the Miroku, and run it a fair bit, too. Once it hits its stride, that little rifle can make those plates dance. Just have to adjust my technique a bit. I'm told that hitting the plates helps, too.
Funny thing, you mention the 19" carbine. I know another shooter who prefers that configuration over the 20" rifle, too. Perhaps the carbine feels livelier between the hands? Dunno. I couldn't detect any real difference between the two. A debate left for those wiser than any of us, I suppose.
I share your thoughts on the Model 1873. "The Gun that won the West". A timeless, classic rifle that deserves a place, in every gun cabinet.
Al

ps: I also have a "She", whose opinions on most things I pay careful attention to.
 
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Superchunk:
Welcome to the fun of CAS.
The toggle action of the 1860, 1866 and 1873 rifles is a nice for the kind of pistol calibre loads we shoot in our rifles.

A couple of things found out the hard way:
Make certain the rifle you choose will hold 10 rounds in the magazine;
Consider a magazine tube insert to keep the smaller diameter .38/.357 cartridges straight in the mag tube. Many .38/.357 rifle tubes use the same diameter mag tubes for their .45 and .357 rifles and some rifles become jamb-o-matics when the the cartridge enters the receiver, (especially in '92s and '94s)
Just just my limited experience. YMMD.

Join a Posse and have fun.
 
Lever Action Horrors!
Virtually everyone has a horror story about 1 or more firearms that they have owned. He's my lever horror story;

In '94 I was looking for a lever in .357 because I was doing alot of .357 shooting out of my S&W M66 and wanted a cheap and easy round that I could reload in abundance. After looking around for about 6-8 months I couldn't find one, I even phoned Winchester! The nice lady said that they didn't have enough calls at that time to start manufacturing them again. Remember this was before Cowboy Action got bigger.

I finally gave up on .357 and found a Winchester Wrangler in .44 Magnum. Shades of John Wayne that large loop lever was kewl! Little did I realize that with 2 years, I'd start shooting Cowboy Action. I did lots of testing and came up 7.2 grains of Unique pushing a 240 grain LSWC bullet as an accurate target load.

Within the first 20 rds down range, the pot metal feed ramp broke. Off for warranty work! Eight months later I get the rifle back. After every 50 rds the rear sight elevator would fall off. So we have to install a Williams rear sight! Shooting again after every 50 rds the screws in the receiver would work loose. Locktite!! After 1,500 rds the tubular magazine spring gave up the ghost! Wolfe Gunsprings to the rescue. After this the Lever Link broke, 3 months and 5 nasty letters later, Winchester told me they would sell me the part but without warranty! They wanted me to send the gun to the warranty center again!

That was the last straw, I found a sucker to buy the Winchester and bought a Marlin M1894S, after 8,000 rds through it, it broke the front of the 2 piece firing pin. About 1,500 rds later the rear portion broke and I replaced it with a 1 piece firing pin. I used that Carbine as a main match rifle for 14 years, before I up graded. I love the quality Marlin builds in.

P.S. My Wrangler was one of 4 Wranglers in town with the same problems.
 
All I have to say is I’m jealous, I really want to get into CAS, but I have no SA pistols… I bought a nice case hardened 1892 recently, absolutely gorgeous Winchester, but it appears that’s as far as I’ll ever get… what a bunch of bs, like, just let us have our gun and enjoy our hobbies!! I’m pissed I can’t get into the sport..
 
Hihi962 said:
All I have to say is I’m jealous, I really want to get into CAS, but I have no SA pistols… I bought a nice case hardened 1892 recently, absolutely gorgeous Winchester, but it appears that’s as far as I’ll ever get… what a bunch of bs, like, just let us have our gun and enjoy our hobbies!! I’m pissed I can’t get into the sport..
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I've started looking at antique status SAA's, they're out there.
 
Hihi962 said:
All I have to say is I’m jealous, I really want to get into CAS, but I have no SA pistols… I bought a nice case hardened 1892 recently, absolutely gorgeous Winchester, but it appears that’s as far as I’ll ever get… what a bunch of bs, like, just let us have our gun and enjoy our hobbies!! I’m pissed I can’t get into the sport..
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I don't know what posses in your area are doing, but some of us are considering loaning our SAAs on the site of the matches and allowing the use of double actions using single the action feature only, until we can vote Trudeau from office and get things changed.
 
Hihi962 said:
All I have to say is I’m jealous, I really want to get into CAS, but I have no SA pistols… I bought a nice case hardened 1892 recently, absolutely gorgeous Winchester, but it appears that’s as far as I’ll ever get… what a bunch of bs, like, just let us have our gun and enjoy our hobbies!! I’m pissed I can’t get into the sport..
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"That really sucks" to quote Black Face!
I wouldn't let it take you away from getting geared up for Cowboy shooting though, you can still get yourself a nice shotgun, all the duds and holsters etc and then maybe get yourself a colt SAA pellet gun to practice with till we can get rid of the Liberals! Oh and don't forget to convince your friends to vote Conservative or not at all... :)

Not sure where you can find one in Canada right now but here's what the Umarex Colt Peacemaker Revolver Single Action Army Six-Shooter .177 Caliber Air Pistol looks like, I've never handled one but it says it weighs 2 pounds and is "metal". No Case Hardened option though.... :(
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Where does one even start with that? Do any shoot current ammo? I have no clue on models or where to look? I assume no transferbars and such , lol!
 
Hihi962 said:
Where does one even start with that? Do any shoot current ammo? I have no clue on models or where to look? I assume no transferbars and such , lol!
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It starts with electing a Conservative majority and slowly getting the senate back.... Borrowing some 6 shooters for training and shoots is about the only option and really sucks.
 
Can-down said:
"That really sucks" to quote Black Face!
I wouldn't let it take you away from getting geared up for Cowboy shooting though, you can still get yourself a nice shotgun, all the duds and holsters etc and then maybe get yourself a colt SAA pellet gun to practice with till we can get rid of the Liberals! Oh and don't forget to convince your friends to vote Conservative or not at all... :)

Not sure where you can find one in Canada right now but here's what the Umarex Colt Peacemaker Revolver Single Action Army Six-Shooter .177 Caliber Air Pistol looks like, I've never handled one but it says it weighs 2 pounds and is "metal". No Case Hardened option though.... :(
612+YO41CtL._AC_SL1500_.jpg
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I think Princess Auto had them earlier this year.
 
HiHi962, what part of the province are you located in, I'm in the SE part and I shoot a lot of matches annually in Granum Alberta. Most serious shooters have a set of backup guns , in case.....
 
Superchunk:
Another recommendation for the 1873 copies, I prefer the Uberties personally and anything tuned by Rusty Wood is super fun to shoot. I have multiple Uberties and to me the the Deluxe Rifle with the checkering and pistol grip is the most attractive. For competition the shorter barrels are more effective.
Just my 2cents.
 
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