Considering this for skeet...help please

Necroman99

Necroman99

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Hey guys.
CGN is always a great resource for people way more experienced than my newbie a$$!
Anyway. I'm a reasonably new skeet shooter...about a year now. I play the other games (trap, sporting, 5stand) but I love skeet. After a few months of shooting I decided I needed an O/U and bought a ruger red label. The gun works for me, but using it for most of the last year has shown me what it's gonna take to get a gun that really fits. I'm 6ft tall with longer arms and a long neck and face. When I mount my ruger, to get the gun up high enough to get the proper sight picture (no rib...just bead) I have to bring it up so high only half or less of the recoil pad is on my shoulder...and I still need to kind of "squish" in. I'm ready to spend a little money and get something that fits right. My initial thought was a 686 or 682 with a PFS stock (highly tunable)...and posted on the EE for one. I got a reply from a fellow member offering me the gun shown below. A 686 xtrap. You can see that it has a high rib, but also a highly adjustable stock (adjustable comb, and that recoil pad will move in all directions). Initially I felt like I might really be on to something. That high rib helps me keep my giraffe neck more comfortably up...the comb should let me position my head just right, and the recoil pad should give me correct LOP and if necessary will hang off the back of the gun to help "weld" it into my shoulder if this needs to be held high.

I touched base with some friends from my club who are all excellent resources and knowledgeable people and searched a little online.
Some data/people are saying this is not going to work. That because it's a trap gun it will have a higher POI, maybe different POIs top and bottom...that trap guns/skeet guns have different POIs.
Some data/people are saying it will work fine...especially for a guy with a long neck. That with the adjustable comb I'll just put it up or down until I get the 50/50 or 60/40 (or whatever) poi i want for skeet.

I spoke to current owner...he really only shot trap with it so doesn't know...but he's willing to come out with me and let me shoot it to see. Ultimately that is what we will need to do before I'll fork over the amount of money on the table (which is between he and I and is not relevant to this discussion), but he's a little ways away and before I waste his time I want to do all I can to make sure I don't waste his time...to make sure we expect it has a good chance of working...so...thought? opinions?

I shoot every week with a guy who is a AA skeet shooter. He shoots a kolar with a very high rib (maybe adjustable though?) and bust the hell out of them...would there be high ribs for skeet and different ones for trap? would the rib on a trap gun be sloped such that it produces high POI for trap?

help out the novice!

 
That's the beauty of the adjustable comb: you can set it low for a 50/50 skeet day and then bump it up for your trap days at 60/40 or whatever.

Your build sounds similar to mine. I'm 6'2 with a long neck and love my 682 gold xtrap with adjustable comb and buttstock. I have the buttstock dropped a good inch and set the comb to get the PoI I want for the day. Being a trap-first gun it is 32" long doubles and heavy, but imo as long as you are OK with those two things it will work great. Honestly ATA skeet you know when and where every bird is at all times and can start with an ideal mount, so there is no reason to be making quick movements that would play into the hands of a guy with a light, short gun. The only time the dynamics of my gun clearly put me out of the game is in international skeet where you have to make big, sudden moves with the gun that mine just won't do.
 
So we don't think the high comb would have a built in "design" to get high poi? If I put the comb low enough to see no rib and only bead (like I do with my current gun), I'll get a poi around 50/50 for use on the skeet field?
 
Trap guns have a parallel comb, which is good and even the skeet guys are going to a parallel comb. The high "X" rib on the Beretta you are looking at is a trap gun. The way you adjust the POI up and down is to raise and lower the comb the direction you want the POI to move. I have found most Berettas shoot flat if you stack the beads, at least the older ones did. Most O/U trap barrels were set up to shoot the bottom barrel higher than the top. This is because your first target in trap doubles is shot rising quickly and the second target is usually leveling out.

If you look at the muzzle end of the O/U barrel, the barrels will likely be closer together than they are at the mono block end. If this is the case, then it is very likely that the bottom barrel will shoot higher than the top and probably by 10%. However, this difference in POI, may have little or no effect when you are shooting the gun.

You really need to shoot the gun to see if it will work for you.

That Kolar you liked, if it is a skeet gun, the POI is adjustable from 50/50 to 70/30. It used to be that everyone shot skeet with a 50/50 POI. Many are shooting higher POIs than they used to and you just float the bird above the rib. Works for some and not for others.
 
If it fits and you shoot it well, it's a keeper. One of the best shooters at our club uses a high rib trap gun for all disciplines and does very well.

Let us know how you make out.
 
Since the owner is giving you the opportunity to try it out, take advantage of it. Make the stock adjustments to suit your body, then pattern the gun this will be the and most accurate way of determining POI.
 
mrgoat said:
Since the owner is giving you the opportunity to try it out, take advantage of it. Make the stock adjustments to suit your body, then pattern the gun this will be the and most accurate way of determining POI.
Click to expand...
I definitely agree, but before I make him drive over an hour to do that with me I wanted to see if anyone had intel that would disqualify this gun outright...thus saving him the trip.
 
For a $ 200 gun an hours drive (and gas) is a lot. For what you are about to potentially spend... it's zip.

Take him up on the offer ... and buy him lunch at the Club for his troubles !
 
I agree with Beretta boy. You have the opportunity here to do this the RIGHT way. Buying a gun worth thousands of dollars just to find it doesn't fit/work is costly in terms of time and money. You have a chance to skip that risk.

Have the Gentleman bring the gun up. Adjust it to suit you, taking note of how much it was adjusted so it can be easily set back if needed. Test POI with both barrels. If you can't quite adjust it to 50/50 don't discount it yet. It won't take your subconscious long to adjust to a slightly different sight picture. You may even find that you like having a clearer view of the bird, which is never a bad thing. Shoot a couple of rounds to see if you like the way it swings. Remember a heavier gun might need a starting point further out from the house to compensate for the slower start.

Buy him lunch or something similar to show you appreciate him taking the time and $ to let you thoroughly evaluate the gun.

Let us know how the testing went ;)
 
Good advice above... can't add much, except to say that, in general, a flat comb is a good idea. It allows for small errors in cheek placement to only minimally affect the POI. I shoot both sporting and international skeet with a Winchester Pigeon Grade XTR O/U. It has an after-market adjustable comb which I've set fairly high and as flat as possible (drop at front of comb is 1 7/16 in, drop at rear of comb is 1 15/16 in), not flat but flatter than the factory stock. Result when mounted is some rib seen and about 60/40 high shooting (as patterned years ago!) I don't change it between sporting and international skeet.
Cheer,
Roger
 
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