Just wondering if anyone else has run into this. 223 using 65gr game kings and IMR 4895 powder. Consistantly throws 2 out of 3 shots almost touching and the 3rd 1 inch left, not in the same order of shots sometimes first sometimes third sometimes second. Same brass, same everything. I'm bewildered. Any help would be great.
Consistant patern
- Thread starter threecentsolution
- Start date
Mystic Precision
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Summerland, BC
What type of rifle? What type of scope? What type of rests?
What are you shooting off?
How hot is your load?
What is the case length?
Jerry
What are you shooting off?
How hot is your load?
What is the case length?
Jerry
- Location
- Western Manitoba
How many times did you experience that - two times or 11 times? Might truly be an issue with your shooting causing that, or with your rifle or loading procedure - or simply a normal result of three shot groups from a 1.5" capable 10 shot group rifle - will be many three shot groups - 2 shots touching and one shot an inch away, in a 10 shot 1.5 inch group.
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Instead of shooting one of them to the left, just shoot all three into the same hole.... lol but on a serious note, for target shooting you should be doing 5 shots minimum to learn more about your load and rifle. Then confirm your load with a 10 shot group. Like someone said you might have a 1.5 moa rifle. Try different powders or bullets too. Bullet could be picky on case capacity. I'd go for one ball powder, one extruded like your 4895 at diff burn rates. For each cartridge I try 3 powders minimum atleast, fast, medium and slow burn rates. So for 308, imr 3031, imr 4064, N530 and then ramshot big game for slower end. Lastly play with seating depth I guess.
Shooting off solid bench at the range, solid one piece rest that I have used for years, load is warm not max but close no signs of over pressure, cases all same length and within spec. And I agree I should shoot more and larger groups but with the availability of components it's a bit tough. Rifle is a cz 600 with vortex diamond back.
Mystic Precision
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Summerland, BC
check bedding... change scopes (check for anything loose)
Work up the load if you didn't... some rifles don't like going hot.
223 small changes in powder charge lead to huge change on target. What type of scale?
How long is the throat?
See if things improve
Jerry
Work up the load if you didn't... some rifles don't like going hot.
223 small changes in powder charge lead to huge change on target. What type of scale?
How long is the throat?
See if things improve
Jerry
- Location
- Blaster land, Okanagan BC
Is the barrel heating up, how long between shots are you waiting. I notice groups open if I don’t allow barrels to cool on anything I own that doesn’t have a heavy varmint barrel, once I let things cool properly groups are back to moa/sub moa depending on the rifle and ammo combinations. Factory hunting ammo, haven’t started hand loading for them yet.
Did you remove the action from the stock and remove all traces of oil off the bottom of the action and the matching bedding surfaces?
Did you remove the scope mounts and degrease those as well?
Oil on these critical surfaces will give you fits trying to shoot groups.
Did you remove the scope mounts and degrease those as well?
Oil on these critical surfaces will give you fits trying to shoot groups.
Once upon a time I had a job of testing ammo for accuracy.
The rifle was excellent. the barrel was top quality and heat treated.
My set up was solid and I had a 36X scope on the rifle.
I could easily see the group for, The first 3 shots might be in the same hole - or well spread out. many 5 shot groups looked fantastic. But tests were either 10 shots (minimum) or 20 shots.
I saw many, many fantastic 5 shot groups grow into perfectly ordinary 10 shot groups.
What I learned was that 3 and 5 shot groups don't mean much. and those "fliers" you see are actually legitimate parts of the group.
When I worked at CIL, my boss (an engineer) would always comment on "statistically valid". A good 10 shot group meant less than nothing. he would want to see 4 consecutive from that rifle and then similar results from several different rifles before he would even consider if we were on to something.
The rifle was excellent. the barrel was top quality and heat treated.
My set up was solid and I had a 36X scope on the rifle.
I could easily see the group for, The first 3 shots might be in the same hole - or well spread out. many 5 shot groups looked fantastic. But tests were either 10 shots (minimum) or 20 shots.
I saw many, many fantastic 5 shot groups grow into perfectly ordinary 10 shot groups.
What I learned was that 3 and 5 shot groups don't mean much. and those "fliers" you see are actually legitimate parts of the group.
When I worked at CIL, my boss (an engineer) would always comment on "statistically valid". A good 10 shot group meant less than nothing. he would want to see 4 consecutive from that rifle and then similar results from several different rifles before he would even consider if we were on to something.
- Location
- Nova Scotia
Is it a known load? Run factory ammo and see if it does it. If it doesn't then it's something you are doing while reloading. Maybe different neck tension, or powder scale walked.
Ummm maybe.
I have a Ruger #1 that shoots the first shot 1 inch high at 100 yds and the next ten or so to point of aim in nice tight groups.
Start with the simplest fixes first. Remove the mounts and rings, clean and re-torque. If that doesn't fix it, try a different scope. If no success, try loading a half grain more powder, and then a half grain less.
Mounts and scope are the most likely culprit but it's possible this is as good as your rifle can do with that loading. Some rifles don't like boat tails. The Sierra Prohunter is a plain base bullet about the same price as Gamekings.
Mounts and scope are the most likely culprit but it's possible this is as good as your rifle can do with that loading. Some rifles don't like boat tails. The Sierra Prohunter is a plain base bullet about the same price as Gamekings.
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