Dumping MN components in .303Br safe?

H

h.letourneau

CGN Regular
Rating - 100%
157   0   0
Location
Quebec City.
Hi.
I have 200 rounds of 7,62x54R but the gun is sold . So I was thinking of dumping the powder in a .303"Br case and put the pulled bullet (.311") steel core

on top.The steel case with the corrosive Berdan primer would be discarded.

Would it be safe to shoot in my Lee Enfield NoImkIII* ??

Thanks .
Hugues.
 
The short answer to your question is yes the bullets will work but no you shouldn't just dump the powder in.

Here are some rough specs on the 2 cartridges to show why I wouldn't just dump in the powder.

7.62x54r has a case capacity of about 62.4 grains of H2O and a max pressure of 51,000 psi.

The 303 British on the other hand has a case capacity of approx 55.7 grains of water and a max pressure of 49,000 psi.

So with above numbers we know that the 54r holds more powder and works at a higher pressure. I load for both cartridges and they both work well with similar powders. I have yet to pull down surplus ammo to load a 303 but if I did I would most likely weigh the original 54r charge and reduce it by 10% based on notes I've written while testing both cartridges with the same bullets and ammo.

The biggest problem with pulling surplus ammo is you can't be entirely sure what type of powder you are working with so you are pretty much guessing. As we all know guessing can be a bad idea when dealing with handloading. But I know both cartridges use pretty much the same types of powder so in this case I'd be comfortable using powder in one for the other.

I'm sure others may chime in and say they've done it and know the rough math on how many grains to drop the charge, I'm just guessing roughly 10%.

One thing I am sure of is all of the surplus 54r I've shot is loaded fairly hot so if it's fairly hot in a 54r Im sure it would be over pressured in the 303 Brit case.

Hope I helped a little, this makes me want to do some experimenting to find out for myself.
 
D-BOMB said:
Why not just pull the projectiles and then use some good powder with existing data?
Click to expand...

Because you can buy a case of 880 rounds for $250 and get 880 bullets and around 7 lbs. of powder. Don't know where you can even get 7lbs of powder for that price, let alone bullets as well.

And to OP, you will have to reduce your load. .303 should have about 4-7 grains less powder than the 54r.
 
While we are on the topic, anyone know what type of powder is in surplus 54r rounds?

I've pulled down several different types, some looks like 4895. last ones I pulled looked identical to varget.

Anybody out there k ow for sure what's in there??
 
Sardine can should have a marking on it regarding what type of powder used in this particular batch.
I don't think there is a straight equivalent to western standard powders. It also may vary from country to country.

Tinman204 said:
While we are on the topic, anyone know what type of powder is in surplus 54r rounds?

I've pulled down several different types, some looks like 4895. last ones I pulled looked identical to varget.

Anybody out there k ow for sure what's in there??
Click to expand...
 
The steel core bullet pulled from the Russian ammunition will not obturate and fill the bore and in worn barrels will cause the bullet to key hole.

British .303 ammunition fired in the Enfield rifle were flat base bullets (ball Mk.7) and used with double base cordite powder that caused more bore erosion than single base powders. Meaning if you have a new or little used Enfield rifle you "MIGHT" get good accuracy, BUT the blowby of high temp gas past the bullet can accelerate bore wear. You will find that Enfield rifles like flat base bullets with lead cores because when fired and kicked in the seat of the pants the bullet will fill and seal the bore.

I bought 500 Russian pulls with steel cores and found out the hard way and remember that cordite powder contained more nitroglycerin than most of the double base pistol powder we use today. Meaning most Enfield rifles will have throat and bore erosion and you need a flat base lead core bullet that fills the bore.
 
Tinman204 said:
While we are on the topic, anyone know what type of powder is in surplus 54r rounds?

I've pulled down several different types, some looks like 4895. last ones I pulled looked identical
Anybody out there k ow for sure what's in there??
Click to expand...

Trying to ID a propellant based on appearances is totally treacherous. Don't do it. It would be very tough to find an exact match for an unknown foreign propellant to a known domestic one. The only recommendation I would make would be to pull a bullet from a ctg case and then seat another of the same weight in the same case. It might seem a bargain, but I don't like the idea of trying to interpolate data from one caliber to another without knowing exactly what propellant you are playing with
 
DuPont built five powder factories in Russia in the 1930s, so we have a pretty good idea what TYPE of powder they were loading with: a single-base IMR type.

Further, Hercules built several powder mills in Russia, these for double-base powders, in about the same time period.

Considering that Hercules built the powder mills, and that 5 grains of Bullseye will duplicate factory performance in the 7.62TT round..... and that factory TT rounds contain 5 grains of powder, I think it is fair to say that you might infer that the Russian double-base pistol powder is pretty closely related to..... Bullseye.
 
Ganderite said:
Yes, you can do that, but you would have to reduce the powder charge by 6 grains.
Click to expand...

We can discuss this all day, but there is not a bullet-powder combination that would not be safe in a 303 Brit if six (6) grains of powder was removed from the 7.62X54R, the remainder was poured into a 303 Brit cartridge, and the same bullet was re-used.

You can't "identify" a powder by looks, but you can know more about it for future use by comparing how a certain amount of it performs compared to other known powders, i.e. that it "has a "powder burn rate" similar to H4895 with a 150 gr bullet in a 303 Brit."
 
smellie said:
DuPont built five powder factories in Russia in the 1930s, so we have a pretty good idea what TYPE of powder they were loading with: a single-base IMR type.

Further, Hercules built several powder mills in Russia, these for double-base powders, in about the same time period.

Considering that Hercules built the powder mills, and that 5 grains of Bullseye will duplicate factory performance in the 7.62TT round..... and that factory TT rounds contain 5 grains of powder, I think it is fair to say that you might infer that the Russian double-base pistol powder is pretty closely related to..... Bullseye.
Click to expand...

Correct if I'm wrong, but Bullseye is a very fast powder usually used in pistol cartridges. :confused:

Grizz
 
smellie said:
DuPont built five powder factories in Russia in the 1930s, so we have a pretty good idea what TYPE of powder they were loading with: a single-base IMR type.

Further, Hercules built several powder mills in Russia, these for double-base powders, in about the same time period.

Considering that Hercules built the powder mills, and that 5 grains of Bullseye will duplicate factory performance in the 7.62TT round..... and that factory TT rounds contain 5 grains of powder, I think it is fair to say that you might infer that the Russian double-base pistol powder is pretty closely related to..... Bullseye.
Click to expand...
Do you have any references for this, I would love to study it more (having studied other areas of the first 5 year plan)
 
plinker 777 said:
What is the powder charge in the X39? Are you adding powder, or just shooting the case's load of X39 w/ projectile in a primed .303Br case?
Click to expand...

Just dump the contents of a x39 into the .303 and re-seat the bullet. Makes very nice light plinking loads. Alternatively, weigh the contents of few x39 rounds and then pull all the rounds and evenly redistribute the powder into the .303 cases. Makes nice light and accurate plinking rounds.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom