First build. Need some input.

[Boomer454]

So I have had the idea of building a long range/precision/tactical rifle for a long time now.
I figure its time.
The problem I'm having as I look into it more is where to start.

I know I want it to be a fast twist .223. And I have it narrowed down to a Rem 700 action or a savage so that when the budget allows I can upgrade the stock to one of mystic precision's chassis. But that's actually the main part of my problem. Which action to go with?

Being able to pick up a cheap "beater" savage and build on it seems like a good option. If I'm not mistaken you can even change the bolt face from the .308 family to a .223 size fairly easily, and can switch out pre-fit barrels with headspace gauges and a proper wrench. This could save me tons on gunsmithing.

On the other hand, I'm very familiar with the Rem 700 action and know the quality is there. I have zero experience with savages.

What are some if your opinions, pro and con for using either action?

 

[kimmer82]

I have both rem and savage custom builds and they both work just fine.
Jerry from Mystic will order you most Savage and Remington Stocks from Choate and few others whicg are quite affortable and durable.
If you do not have a doner action either rem or savage, I would maybe prefer you buying a Savage Axis for around $300 dollars and play with that barrel for bit, and customize from there.
Either action also works Great, you can get over sized bolt knobs for less than $100, Get your action Trued for around $200, Shilen barrels come with pre-thredded for Savage (rem too i think). Brake are $100-200 depending your choice. Timney trigger will do you just fine at $150 or just accutrigger works good too.
Or get savage M12 with heavy barrel to plink till barrel life burns and go from there.

I just finished building one from ordering most parts with Jerry from Mystic and Finishing it by Terry from Black Art Rifles. He does a great job and i was very pleased with his cost and work.

Another option is to order Rem700 blueprinted action and build from start to fresh.

If you let us know what the budget is, I can PM you some detailed pictures of few high-end Accruacy internationals or Budget Builds done with Savage and rem Action. Sky is the Limit on custom builds and it is that much fun.

 

[Boomer454]

I don't want to be "cheap", but my "budget" to start will be in the 6-800 dollar range. I have to sell my .22-250 first to start the funding. I figure if I have something to start with I can add on things like fancy stocks as I can afford.

I have looked at some of the blueprinted Remington actions, but they cost as much as a new rifle!
One other consideration I gave that actually isn't to important is that I shoot left handed. But as this us going to be primarily a bench and bag gun that doesn't really matter much.

 

[9x19p]

Both Savage and Remington have proven themselves on every firing line around the world. You can't go wrong with either.
That said, Remington has far more aftermarket support. It's the small block Chevy of the gun world. You can do everything you want to it but it doesn't need anything to be a shooter. You put tactical in your want list. AICS and MDT chassis, and many others don't accommodate Savage. Can you get a "tactical" chassis for Savage? Maybe Choate, I don't know.

When I built my first rifle, I was lost. I didn't know what to do or who to call. I finally said eff it, sent Jerry a message telling him what I wanted to do, and that was that. After he was on board, it was just a matter of budget. That's how I started, and it was easy.

Fwiw, my first build was a trued 700 with a RB trigger, a 28" 1/7 Shillen in .223 throated for 90gr Berger VLDs, bedded to an AICS. The only thing I'll change when I burn it up is the throat. I'll go with 80gr VLDs. The barrel's a little long to be tactical, but it's tacticool all the way.

 

[kimmer82]

lol omg... my fellow Lefty!!!!!!!! Im a lefty and i do feel for you haha
in that case... with your budget, I would just buy ready to shoot savage in .223 and plink until you burn the barrel.
Few months back, i built a plinking rifle from Savage model12. Its chambered in .308 and has a cheap Fixed 10X40 Bushnell Elite tactical scope on it.
The stock is HS Precision BR wich i modded to shoot single and Glass bed, freeFloated the barrel. Total cost for this with everything was $1200 Dollars )rifle,rings, stock, scope and gun work).
If this kind of cheap and fun build interest you, let me know! Might even have something for you in my safe.

 

[Boomer454]

In my gut I was always thinking of the 700 action. It's just that I've been thinking if my (meagre) budget and than the more I look in here, the more savages I see. Sometimes ok much info s a bad thing...

A few years ago I got a hold if Jerry and he ended up selling me a barrel for a custom hunting rifle I'm going to have built when finances allow. That's on the back burner right now, but I can't say enough good things about his device and advice either.

 

[kimmer82]

so you have a Blank barrel that is ready to be thredded?
When i shop on EE, most Rem700 tend to be retail or over retail price and those rare finds are gone Right away...
It sounds like you really love the Rem700 Action (i do too) so maybe find a used rem700 SA and go from there.
I have Few Issues from Canadianguns.com and they sometimes have killer deals on rifles. will let you know if i see one for a great Deal if you want to know.

I also know there is a place that was trying to sell Rem700 Tactical chambered in .223. Hogue stock, Zeiss 3-9x40 selling around $900-1000. you could give them a call see if they still have it.. if they do, you might even make a deal with'em

 

[Boomer454]

so you have a Blank barrel that is ready to be thredded?
When i shop on EE, most Rem700 tend to be retail or over retail price and those rare finds are gone Right away...
It sounds like you really love the Rem700 Action (i do too) so maybe find a used rem700 SA and go from there.
I have Few Issues from Canadianguns.com and they sometimes have killer deals on rifles. will let you know if i see one for a great Deal if you want to know.

I also know there is a place that was trying to sell Rem700 Tactical chambered in .223. Hogue stock, Zeiss 3-9x40 selling around $900-1000. you could give them a call see if they still have it.. if they do, you might even make a deal with'em

DM sent!
The barrel blank I have is in .30 cal and is the lightest profile shouldn't makes. I have a Win model 70 left handed rifle in .257AI that has a huge headspace problem that us going to be a nice light 30-06 someday. I'm just not in a rush for it right now.

 

[Boomer454]

Do after a little thinking on it I've decided to stay with a 700 action.
Really, that's what my gut has been telling me all along.

Thanks for the opinions guys!

 

[Boomer454]

So I found a screaming good deal on a Rem 700 VTR in 223.
I'll see how it shoots as is and start replacing things as I can afford to. I imagine the first upgrade will be the stock. It's still in the cheap factory plastic.

If nothing else I have the action I want to start with.

I'll post back here when I have some range results.

 

[Boomer454]

It's been a long time since I've updated this but had some good results last night.

So far I've switched the stock and the scope out on the VTR. Just a rem factory BDL varmint stock, but so much better than the Tupperware it came with. And tha scope is an old weaver V16 I've had for years.

After getting consistent 4+ inch groups with win white box I tried som 69 grain smk's and groups smartened right up. Down to one inch with a basic book load and no tweaking. 22 grains of H335 and C.O.L at 2.235 (book length).

Loaded up 5 with the same load and tried them at 2.255 last night and got this little gem.

I'm pretty sure I pulled the top two. For some reason I always seem to pull them high and left when I screw up. But the first three touching like that is pretty inspirational!

Here's another one with the shorter rounds.

Would have been a solid .75" group if I hadn't pulled that one. Again high and left.

I have some berger's on the way. Il update again when I've had a chance to try them.

 

[Crashman]

Looks like your project is coming along rather well. I love it when the budget builds work out so well. I have a similar problem when I pull a shot off it goes high and right (right handed shooter). What I have found is it only happens when I shoot off my Harris style bipod, when I switch to a tripod style front rest the problem disappears. I will also qualify this by saying that in NO way am I an expert, I am as green as they come and only a novice shooter. I am just giving you some info based on my experience and it may be totally invalid for you.

Keep us updated as your shooting progresses, I like to hear about other peoples experiences as they often times are similar to mine. Good luck!

 

[Boomer454]

Crashman. You nailed it. I do shoot rifles left handed.
I was shooting off bags, but my front bag is just a tiny bit low so i was doing the squeeze and hold to drive the cross hairs where i wanted them. I think that is most of my problem.

 

[Boomer454]

I haven't had time to post in this thread in a long time but thought it was time for an update.

I found an older HS Precision stock off a Rem VSSF with the full aluminium bedding block on the EE that was in my price range. That alone has made it better and has actually shrunk my groups a tiny bit. And of course it looks pretty cool.

As far as actual shooting I've managed to pull off a few pretty respectable groups at 300 yards. Unfortunately I've been plagued by the single flyer. Had one group shaping up to be an almost perfect inch inch, but the third shot went way out to make it about 3 inches. Still MOA, but damn. One "bad" hole in the target..,

Loading is getting pretty close to refined. 70 grain Bergers over 21.5 grains of benchmark and a Rem bench rest primer.

Next is optics. I have an old weaver V-16 on to now, but needs bit more magnification. I'm thinking a vortex or sightron, but will have to wait for funds...

 

[Mystic Precision]

If not done, consider properly bedding that action and the stock. Flyers can simply be the action moving in the stock alum chassis or not.

Watch for quirks in your loading. mark the case that was part of the flyer. If you shoot that case again, and the shot goes weird, throw it away after studying what makes it wonky.

Watch the winds... air is almost never still. doesn't take much to move a 22cal bullet 1" at 300yds. Put up flags or marking tape every 50yds. Watch them. When they line up the same, send the shot.

Mirage will also move the target. Here better optics and learning how to shoot with mirage matters.

a bug hole rifle is a completion of the entire shooting cycle which includes rifle, optics, ammo, rests, shooter and condition doping.

Keep at it. you will get it figured out.

Jerry

 

[Boomer454]

Thanks Jerry.

One thing I had to change that probably cause the flyers was how the trigger and safety fit the stock. I posted in gunsmithing about it, but will add it here.

The Mark X trigger is wider than the the old model 700 triggers and as such, when I tightened my action screws down the safety wouldn't work and the trigger pull saw affected.
A few mins with a dremel tool and that was fixed.

Now that my screws are tight, I can see if that was a cause of flyers.

My local gun club ran a "benchrest" league this summer, and that was a huge eye opener in learning to read wind and mirage! The flags are some time pointing 5 different directions between the line and 300, and really help if I remember to pay attention, and be patient!