Fitting a new bolt to a M14/M1A rifle info please

maxinumarmor

maxinumarmor

Regular
Rating - 100%
90   0   0
Location
B.C.
Picked up this new bolt for my M14 something a gunsmith can do but was wondering is the bolt fitted to the receiver or is the receiver fitted to the bolt.

When I installed it stripped it doesn't lock up only half closes at the lugs what would have to be done to get it to fit and lock up?
I read of a lapping process or is there more to it then that?
 
Always fit the cheapest part, so, the bolt.

If you miss your shot, you can replace it, but, if you miss your shot with the receiver, you's screwded.
 
So what would the process be to fitting it, the bolt is forged [ 8620 steel ] and put through a heat treating process any material removed would be removing the hardening surface my guess would be the front of the lugs not the back where the pressure is transferred ?
Would that also be measured stripped with a EMT casing in place ?

weimajack said:
Always fit the cheapest part, so, the bolt.

If you miss your shot, you can replace it, but, if you miss your shot with the receiver, you's screwded.
Click to expand...
 
Is there anyone out there that has replaced their M14 bolt could you tell me what you or your gunsmith had to do for good closing & lock up along with head spacing?
 
maxinumarmor said:
Is there anyone out there that has replaced their M14 bolt could you tell me what you or your gunsmith had to do for good closing & lock up along with head spacing?
Click to expand...

What brand of bolt, what brand of receiver? Is the barrel chrome-lined?
 
Basically, you'd be best advised to put on a new barrel and headspace it to the old bolt (or the new one, whichever) because you're otherwise going to have to trim part of the rear of the barrel so the left front of the bolt lug doesn't bind on it, and then lap a LOT of material to get the headspace into safe-to-shoot territory. If you go ahead with it anyway and lap it in you'll want to make sure to periodically keep checking for increasing headspace and looking for signs of excessive set-back, both of which might indicate that you've lapped through too much of the surface hardening.
 
maxinumarmor said:
Thank you do you know of any posts on here on how to convert your gas plug to adjustable? Another chance I like to do.
Click to expand...

That's outside of my experience completely, sorry.

For M305/M1A/M14 stuff, you'll find the Battle Rifle section is the best place to ask questions, there's a fine group of gurus that frequent it.
 
Okay, I gotta chime in here....

I ain't a gunsmith nor do I profess to know as much as a retired USMC Gunnery Sgt who built the match rifles but some things I do know and have experienced.

In the past I was able to drop in a TRW bolt into my 2002 era Norinco. The headspace shrank from 17 thou above the 1.630" Saami Go Gauge to 0 thou or 1.630" GO gauge. Life was fabulous. No lapping needed, everything worked.

I did this repeatedly for many years, dropping USGI bolts into various Norinco rifles. :D

Along comes a beloved 2011 Shorty with 18.5" barrel and I dropped in another TRW bolt and it would not lock up at all! There seemed to be a conflict above the barrel hood and I was not forcing it. :(

I'm not gonna LAP any USGI bolt into that receiver nor was I gonna bust open my 10000 rpm Dremel tool to start relieving the extra metal. I happen to have about SIX spare Norinco bolts from the EE Forum and I took this 2011 shorty up to my gun club and started firing ball ammo with different bolts. :)

ONE of the bolts gave me a 5 thousandths case stretch and that was the smallest chamber I got or resulted with. Life is good. I sold the other bolts here on the EE forum. That was my teaching Norinco rifle I took across the country in 2012 and 2013. Some of you who encountered this rifle will remember that with the "Bolt Slop" test ( I let you feel mine....) :D

And many of you noticed that there was NO movement back and forth with the Norinco bolt that yielded a 5 thou case stretch. Most of the Norinco rifles I have mic'ed turned out to be 14 or 15 thou. Do not panic. Your #### will not fall off! :runaway:

So if your USGI dimensioned bolt (FA or LRB or SAI) won't drop into a Norc or Poly, have no fear. DO Not under any circumstances force it to fit into the Norinco/Poly by using your 15K rpm Dremel tool you got fer Xmas at Cambodian Tire. :eek:

Maybe a re-barrel is in order.... Dealers such as Mystic Player and Peter Dobson of Hirsch Precision can get you a Krieger barrel

Yeah, I know that is expensive but that's one of your options. The cheapest option is the shoot that rifle (Norc or Poly) as it is and be happy. That's a lot cheaper than a new NM barrel. And have it fitted properly from the get go. :)

When you start force fitting a USGI dimensioned bolt into some high school shop class Norinco (all of you at my clinics know how I feel about these rifles) You are begging for trouble. Just play it safe and sell me your rifle for $300.... No, I'm just kidding. :nest:

Hey, it's a diamond in the rough. I never said it was gonna be a National Match shooter! Buying a new bolt to drop in is a hit and miss proposition. That's what ya gets for $400ish or $500 ish give or take.

When ya buys an LRB or SAI or JRA or JTF2.5 then you get the predictability that comes with quality (all depends on yer definition) buy. It's sure gonna cost ya but at what point do you wanna leave things be and shoot things the way they are ?? You gotta make that decision. :D

I'm trying to save all of you money out there. Some things are worth spending on.... CASM mount for optics or Smith or ARMS or Sadlak. Maybe good NightForce or Leupold or Vortex or Sightron or Zeiss or Schmidt & Bender or Trijicon. Or maybe a SAGE or Blackfeather? Or possibly a Boyd's or McMillan?

Or maybe a good install on a Krieger? or unobtainium USGI parts from the US of A ? Or maybe some SAI parts from Brownells?

It's your call and your money. Many of us have different motivations and that's a good thing. Many more of us don't have a pile of money for the upgrades and we just go and buy a Tikka, Sako, Savage, Remmy, FN Winnie, Browning, Marlington, or Kimber in order to shoot little groups.


Some other things are debatable....

Anyways, Keep on helping the noobs with their M14 addiction out there! :wave:

Barney
 
Is a Fulton Armoury bolt original GI or their manufacture? Is it better than a Norinco OEM bolt?
 
AP said:
Is a Fulton Armoury bolt original GI or their manufacture? Is it better than a Norinco OEM bolt?
Click to expand...

I should follow TT's example and mention that I'm no gunsmith, nor am I a guru on the platform, I'm mostly just regurgitating what I've heard better-qualified folks say.

FA bolts are not USGI, though their Gen II series are supposed to be reasonably high quality. As to whether it's better than the OEM Norc one or not, I'm really not qualified to say, but it tends to fit Norc receivers a lot tighter (often much too tightly). From what I've heard, the best drop-in replacement for a Norc bolt in a Norc receiver is a real USGI one, just because they tend to fit very sweetly.
 
TacticalTeacher said:
Okay, I gotta chime in here....

I ain't a gunsmith nor do I profess to know as much as a retired USMC Gunnery Sgt who built the match rifles but some things I do know and have experienced.

In the past I was able to drop in a TRW bolt into my 2002 era Norinco. The headspace shrank from 17 thou above the 1.630" Saami Go Gauge to 0 thou or 1.630" GO gauge. Life was fabulous. No lapping needed, everything worked.

I did this repeatedly for many years, dropping USGI bolts into various Norinco rifles. :D

Along comes a beloved 2011 Shorty with 18.5" barrel and I dropped in another TRW bolt and it would not lock up at all! There seemed to be a conflict above the barrel hood and I was not forcing it. :(

I'm not gonna LAP any USGI bolt into that receiver nor was I gonna bust open my 10000 rpm Dremel tool to start relieving the extra metal. I happen to have about SIX spare Norinco bolts from the EE Forum and I took this 2011 shorty up to my gun club and started firing ball ammo with different bolts. :)

ONE of the bolts gave me a 5 thousandths case stretch and that was the smallest chamber I got or resulted with. Life is good. I sold the other bolts here on the EE forum. That was my teaching Norinco rifle I took across the country in 2012 and 2013. Some of you who encountered this rifle will remember that with the "Bolt Slop" test ( I let you feel mine....) :D

And many of you noticed that there was NO movement back and forth with the Norinco bolt that yielded a 5 thou case stretch. Most of the Norinco rifles I have mic'ed turned out to be 14 or 15 thou. Do not panic. Your #### will not fall off! :runaway:

So if your USGI dimensioned bolt (FA or LRB or SAI) won't drop into a Norc or Poly, have no fear. DO Not under any circumstances force it to fit into the Norinco/Poly by using your 15K rpm Dremel tool you got fer Xmas at Cambodian Tire. :eek:

Maybe a re-barrel is in order.... Dealers such as Mystic Player and Peter Dobson of Hirsch Precision can get you a Krieger barrel

Yeah, I know that is expensive but that's one of your options. The cheapest option is the shoot that rifle (Norc or Poly) as it is and be happy. That's a lot cheaper than a new NM barrel. And have it fitted properly from the get go. :)

When you start force fitting a USGI dimensioned bolt into some high school shop class Norinco (all of you at my clinics know how I feel about these rifles) You are begging for trouble. Just play it safe and sell me your rifle for $300.... No, I'm just kidding. :nest:

Hey, it's a diamond in the rough. I never said it was gonna be a National Match shooter! Buying a new bolt to drop in is a hit and miss proposition. That's what ya gets for $400ish or $500 ish give or take.

When ya buys an LRB or SAI or JRA or JTF2.5 then you get the predictability that comes with quality (all depends on yer definition) buy. It's sure gonna cost ya but at what point do you wanna leave things be and shoot things the way they are ?? You gotta make that decision. :D

I'm trying to save all of you money out there. Some things are worth spending on.... CASM mount for optics or Smith or ARMS or Sadlak. Maybe good NightForce or Leupold or Vortex or Sightron or Zeiss or Schmidt & Bender or Trijicon. Or maybe a SAGE or Blackfeather? Or possibly a Boyd's or McMillan?

Or maybe a good install on a Krieger? or unobtainium USGI parts from the US of A ? Or maybe some SAI parts from Brownells?

It's your call and your money. Many of us have different motivations and that's a good thing. Many more of us don't have a pile of money for the upgrades and we just go and buy a Tikka, Sako, Savage, Remmy, FN Winnie, Browning, Marlington, or Kimber in order to shoot little groups.


Some other things are debatable....

Anyways, Keep on helping the noobs with their M14 addiction out there! :wave:

Barney
Click to expand...

I bought 2 x M305 (because thats what Barney said we should do - or else!!) I also bought some NOS GI bits and pieces (TRW bolt, gas piston etc etc ) and after market scope mt ... I shot the M305's "box stock" with iron sights and surprised myself with how well I could shoot with them (for me anyway) and how "sweet" they are to shoot compared to C1's from my distant memory ... sooo I left them the way they came (stock!) and decided the GI parts were better than having my money in a savings account. I'm pretty happy and have fun! These wont compete with the likes of a Barnard in 6BR ... BUT they do real fine for what they are and manage to group lots of rounds in a hurry -- pretty tight out to 300 - maybe a lot more for the younger guys with good eyes!
 
AP said:
I bought 2 x M305 (because thats what Barney said we should do - or else!!) I also bought some NOS GI bits and pieces (TRW bolt, gas piston etc etc ) and after market scope mt ... I shot the M305's "box stock" with iron sights and surprised myself with how well I could shoot with them (for me anyway) and how "sweet" they are to shoot compared to C1's from my distant memory ... sooo I left them the way they came (stock!) and decided the GI parts were better than having my money in a savings account. I'm pretty happy and have fun! These wont compete with the likes of a Barnard in 6BR ... BUT they do real fine for what they are and manage to group lots of rounds in a hurry -- pretty tight out to 300 - maybe a lot more for the younger guys with good eyes!
Click to expand...

If they bring a grin to your face when you shoot them then there's nothing better. Sounds like you have a great plan for the USGI parts, they'll only appreciate, and if you ever decide to use them you won't be paying REALLY big bucks for them by then :cool:
 
The bolt I got is very nicely made the specs on it are a hammer forged 8620 steel and the heat treated with a nice black finish afterwards.
What the problem seems to be not head space or any interference it seems the bolt lugs are a little to wide and won't drop down into the slots they go down maybe a little less then half way,fit compared to the Poly bolt is a lot tighter other then that,the bolt face don't come in contact with the barrel I was just wondering if it is as simple as machining the barrel side of the lugs until it drops into place then I could do a actual head space measurement. I don't see it touching any where else other the sides of the slots.
Any thought on that?
 
From what I understand, the problem is that the bolt and receiver lugs are case hardened as required to stand up to the wear-and-tear of operations. If you remove too much metal (more than a few thousandths) you will remove the hardened metal and the be subject to extreme wear. In the case of bolt locking surfaces is that wear will open your headspace quickly, eventually to the point where the rifle is unsafe.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom