FN C1A1 Help

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paulz

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Technically I should probably post this in Gunsmithing or Battle Rifles, but the people most likely to be able to help me tend to hang out here.

I recently bought another FN, a minty ex-OPP 8L series C1A1. Unfortunately, it got damaged in transit:mad:. The muzzle punched through the end of the box and it must have got jammed in a conveyer belt or run over by a forklift, because the left side of the flash eliminator is stove in and bent over a bit:eek:. Luckily the damage is confined to the flash eliminator, about halfway down the slots, so the barrel is unaffected.

I tried to straighten it by running a large punch down it, but no-go. The only way this would work is if I get a torch and put heat to it, but understandably, I am not going to.

I have bought a new flash eliminator (thanks to John and the gang at Marstar), but I still need some bits and advice. I have the flash eliminator and the retaining key (little washer thingy). I also have the Australian tech manual, but they like to use a lot of specialized tools, which I am unlikely to find, so;

1. Does anyone out there have a flash eliminator remover and replacer tool (the big nut looking thingy) that they can lend, rent or sell me?

2. Can anyone sell or lend me the Canadian tech manual, or scan/pdf/email, or photocopy/mail me the appropriate page(s) form the Canadian tech manual?

3. Can I re-use the positioning washer, or will I need to find or make a new one, and how do I tell what size? (Marstar has some in stock, according to the website). I don't have a flash eliminator retaining pin (Marstar was out of stock), but I assume any pin of similar size will do.

4. Do I need anything else? Any other advice you can give me?

I have a vice and could probably do the job myself, but I plan to take all the collected bits, pieces and instructions to a 'smith, and get him to do it. (I don't want to compond my anguish by screwing it up worse trying to fix it myself.).

Thanks in advance.
 
You might find that by trying to remove the flashider you will unbreach the barrel, yes they are on that tight!! The index washer you have might ir might not work, only one way to find out. If it's too thick you can fix that by simply stoning it down, if too thin no go.

I will try to dig up my mannual, (I know I've got a copy of it somewhaere around here) and get the pages to you. I'll pm you if I find it! I't been a long time since I worked on that rifle....man I'm gettin' old!

Scott
 
i got the small parts you need .

btw, im sure you got the right FH from marstar , C1A1 FH has an opening of approx 10.7mm , aussy are smaller .
 
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curtton said:
btw, im sure you got the right FH from marstar , C1A1 FH has an opening of approx 10.7mm , aussy are smaller .
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That's what I like about Gunnutz, always someone who knows and you learn something new every day! I didn't know the openings were different, but I checked my new part against the broken one, and against my Aussie, and sure enough! The Aussie is smaller, and the part I got from Marstar is a C1 part.

Thanks for the info guys.
 
paulz said:
That's what I like about Gunnutz, always someone who knows and you learn something new every day! I didn't know the openings were different, but I checked my new part against the broken one, and against my Aussie, and sure enough! The Aussie is smaller, and the part I got from Marstar is a C1 part.

Thanks for the info guys.
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i wouldnt want to see you put a foreign part in that boooootiful C1A1 and end up redoing it again .:)
 
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...which is why I am approaching this project so cautiously. I went through enough trouble finding it, and the anguish of having it damaged, so I want the repair to be done right. I went through a long spell of finding one for sale and calling or emailing and being told I had just missed it! I am now going through the same process trying to get a Brit L1A1 for "the family".

H Wally PM'd me with the suggestion of making my own tool out of a large machine nut, which is what he did on his project, but I would rather use the 'real deal".

BTW curtton, I've sent a quick PM to you about the small parts.

Thanks again for the help.
 
paulz said:
H Wally PM'd me with the suggestion of making my own tool out of a large machine nut, which is what he did on his project, but I would rather use the 'real deal".

BTW curtton, I've sent a quick PM to you about the small parts.

Thanks again for the help.
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yes, i showed the big nut to H wally and you can make it yourself , if you are nearby you can measure it yourself .
 
I am still going to try and get my own real one first. I'm hoping someone else will have a spare they are willing to part with, or risk lending. Per my last PM, I'll be in touch if I do end up needing to make my own.
 
Anybody else out there who can help a fellow out? I'm still looking for a Canadian tech manual and tool.

Anybody?
 
A final post to let all know that my rifle is now fixed!

It was waaay easier than I thought, I was overthinking and flinching for nothing.

I ended up using my grenade launcher instead of the proper tool, and it worked fine.

Many thanks to all who posted and especially to those who PM's me with advice, and a special thanks to curtton for providing the washer.

Now if only I could go and test fire it.......
 
paulz said:
A final post to let all know that my rifle is now fixed!

It was waaay easier than I thought, I was overthinking and flinching for nothing.

I ended up using my grenade launcher instead of the proper tool, and it worked fine.

Many thanks to all who posted and especially to those who PM's me with advice, and a special thanks to curtton for providing the washer.

Now if only I could go and test fire it.......
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you are welcome paul .

nothing wrong with being cautious with a c1a1 . glad to hear it went well . i would love to see a pic of it when you get you diggy cam going .

what !!! you dont have a range in your basement? :D

heres a pic of my bro-inlaw c1a1 . she is a beaut !!!

fnc1a1.jpg


my sons toes .:)
 
Just out of curiosity, can you post a jpeg of just how those ex-OPP FN-C1's were mutilated prior to sale to the unwashed? Years ago, hidden well behind my Ross rifles was my canadian C1 serial 00L00- it was finished in high commercial blue, with a dynamite stick of dark figured walnut- apparently came out of the showcase at Long Branch.....When those OPP rifles were being surplused, I wanted to add one to mine, but lost all interest when I heard that they were all to be sent to England (??) for semi-destruction. Think about the children....make the streets safe....and other canadian tripe! Sad indeed!
 
The only mutilation I have seen on any of them was the obliteration of the OPP markings on the butt and the right side of the lower receiver (correctly called the trigger housing). The OPP was quite small in the first place and the markings were merely ######X over.
 
The OPP mark was simply the letters OPP stamped about 8mm long by 5mm high, as Stencollector said, just under the pin that holds the body locking catch on the right side, (sorry, not digitized in the photo department yet, so I can't post pictures). On mine, the letters have been stamped over with a bunch of lines, looks like they used a letter "i" puch or something similar, since it is not just scratched out with an awl. The OPP mark is not very big to begin with, and in fact it took me a while to even notice it.

The british proofs are under the barrel ahead of the sling swivel, so they are NOT hidden by the handguards. They are only about 1.5 mm high, and very unobtrusive.

BNP (crown over the N) 7.62x51MM 20 TONS (then crossed swords with N4C in the quadrants fromed by the swords), again, sorry, can't do photos yet.

Which brings up a question from me. How did these rifles get into circulation? I had assumed that the OPP merely surplused them back in the day when police departments could do so. Did all these rifles go to the UK first? and how did they come back?
 
I remember a similiar incident (same end result), one of the guys dropped his FNC1 in some mud, rather than run a bore brush/rod through the barrel he 'thought' he could gently 'tap' the muzzle against a concrete curb and loosen the debris....:slap:
 
paulz said:
The OPP mark was simply the letters OPP stamped about 8mm long by 5mm high, as Stencollector said, just under the pin that holds the body locking catch on the right side, (sorry, not digitized in the photo department yet, so I can't post pictures). On mine, the letters have been stamped over with a bunch of lines, looks like they used a letter "i" puch or something similar, since it is not just scratched out with an awl. The OPP mark is not very big to begin with, and in fact it took me a while to even notice it.

The british proofs are under the barrel ahead of the sling swivel, so they are NOT hidden by the handguards. They are only about 1.5 mm high, and very unobtrusive.

BNP (crown over the N) 7.62x51MM 20 TONS (then crossed swords with N4C in the quadrants fromed by the swords), again, sorry, can't do photos yet.

Which brings up a question from me. How did these rifles get into circulation? I had assumed that the OPP merely surplused them back in the day when police departments could do so. Did all these rifles go to the UK first? and how did they come back?
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I think I heard that some or all of them were originally headed for the US, but the BATF rejected them due to the safety sear or some similar design feature, declaring them potential machine guns.

Not sure of how many went to England, or how many came back. Collectors source out of Acton Ontario were the only (re)importers of them as far as I know. I guess one could ask Fred or Al and see what they know about it.
 
stencollector said:
I think I heard that some or all of them were originally headed for the US, but the BATF rejected them due to the safety sear or some similar design feature, declaring them potential machine guns.

Not sure of how many went to England, or how many came back. Collectors source out of Acton Ontario were the only (re)importers of them as far as I know. I guess one could ask Fred or Al and see what they know about it.
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That makes sense to me. I know that the BATF/ATFE or whatever alphabet soup they are now called hates safety sears. The original "Browning" semi FN-FALs for the US civi market were not supposed to have them, but the first batch did, and were grandfathered. the rest of the production did not have slots cut for safety sears. Also the limited run of Aussie L1A1's that were built for the US civi market in the '80's did not have them either.

As for the OPP rifles, I may just e-mail Al and ask him. I know 8L series C1's were sold directly to DCRA clubs in the 70's, but every C1 I have ever come across for sale was ex OPP, so likely from Collectors' Source originally, if Stencolector is right.

Very interesting! Always fun to find out more about one's favourite toys.
 
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