Haenel AYDT 8.15x46R

H

hornhead

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my question is this - can i use this rifle in black powder cartridge target matches. details are sketchy as to whether it was a black powder cartridge. it is approximately a 32/40 cartridge, and was popular in europe as a schuetzen round.
 
It depends on the club and the rules. For example the system aydt is a hammerless action and would not be acceptable at the Coors matches while the cartridge might be. Tempting to say; form your cases out of 32-40 cases and say it is just a metric 32-40 :>)
Your greater problem is possibly going to be bullet weight; many of the cartridge matches involve steel silhouettes and at 400 yrds it will be very borderline at knocking the rams down, based on my experience with the 32-40

cheers mooncoon

cheers mooncoon
 
the 8.15 X 46R is a german cart.(BP originally) that was/is used for 200yd. Shuetzen shooting(paper target), would be too light for steel targets, and for hunting would be in the 32/40 Black Powder class. The cartridge and the guns are real works of art usually sporting beautiful set triggers and fancy stocks designed for Shuetzen shooting.
 
Hornhead's dilema however is; will the rules permit him to use the gun and the cartridge in competition. In some matches such as Coors, one of the rules says must have an outside hammer so his gun does not qualify. Locally here in Nanaimo we say the action must be designed for black powder or replicas of same. His gun would be acceptable in Nanaimo and I suspect in many or most Canadian matches. I am not sure if Coors accepts "modern" cartridges but I think they do which means the cartridge might be acceptable there while it would be touch and go with many matches in Canada because the cartridge was introduced around 1890 or shortly after and is really borderline on what is was first loaded with.
To some extent, the problem is self answering because the cartridge is suitable primarily for paper target shooting and close range (under 200 yd) gong shooting while black powder cartridge shooting usually includes ranges well in excess of 200 yds.

cheers mooncoon
 
yes it's way too light for sillywets. it's basically a scheutzen/target rifle.
so if it was originally a black powder cartridge i can use it in the few matches i go to. hammer/hammerless doesn't matter, lots of martinis at these matches.
still working on smokeless loads. going to switch to black when it warms up a bit. i'd be surprised if the cartridge will take more than 30-35 gr of 3F.
i've got it down to about 1" -5shot groups at 50 yards with smokeless. it's a cool old rifle.
 
the rear sight and front sight were both gone.
a pity cuz the rear sight looks like a magnificent piece of engineering.
so instead i have a lyman globe target sight at the front and a lyman tang sight rigged up to go on the rear. it did have the sliding open rear sight tho. that sight as with the inside workings is all hand made. a nice old gun circa 1870-75 from the proof marks.
it still has some shooting left in her.
brass is made by resizing 30/30 thru a 32/40 and trimming it down - a lot!
170 gr 32/40 cast bullets go out the spout.
 
I was just looking the cartiage up in Cartiages of the World and it said it was designed in 1890 to 1900 and was not likely a black powder shell? I don't know but RWS still make shell and loaded ammo for this cartiage.
Pedersoli make a copy of the proper type of rear sight rear sight.
But like a said a very nice gun
John
 
the info i got dated the cartridge around 1870. the proof marks (as near as we can tell ) date the rifle from 1870 to early 1900s.
it is not a "scheutzen" as such but is a "plate" rifle. they shot off hand at steel plates. (ie "the original steel challenge" in lederhosen) all off hand ... apparently out to 300 metres. it seems to me the "scheutzen" rifles have shorter barrels. could be wrong tho.
 
I think scheutzen rifles and plate rifles are more or less the same thing; offhand rifles mostly for 200 yd/meter shooting. I am a bit puzzle about the proofs you are referring to; Germany did not have a mandatory national proof until 1894. Is it a Belgian gun? or does it have a regional proof like Suhl

cheers mooncoon
 
the proofs were under the forearm. a crown with B under it,a crown with U under it,a crown with G under it. a capital H with a B under it.
7,7mm. we believe it may have originally been 7.7, then rechambered to 8.15x46 norm. it's a bit of a mystery.
 
All of those are listed in wirnsberger as post 1891. The crown over G is for rifled barrels and the B and U I believe are provisional and definitive proofs. 7.7 at a guess is the bore diameter and not the groove diameter.

cheers mooncoon
 
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