Hard Cast for Moose/ Bears/ Elk

[Logan_Lamothe]

I am looking at starting to reload for my 45/70 guide gun and want to know if hard cast bullets are what I should look at for Moose, Deer, and Elk this gun is also my back-up gun. I have 40 or so empty lever revolution cases and am hoping someone has some tips on what powder bullet combo to start off with.

 

[PileBuck]

You should throw a set of calipers on those empty cases. I remember reading somewhere that they might be too short to reload. Can't remember for sure but worth having a look

 

[gunlaker]

You should throw a set of calipers on those empty cases. I remember reading somewhere that they might be too short to reload. Can't remember for sure but worth having a look

That is true if you plan on crimping the loads. The Hornady cases are significantly shorter.

Chris.

 

[blacksmithden]

You won't get much expansion with hard cast lead, but it will definately still do the job for you.

 

[Al-Sway]

As long as the cases are long enough to be crimped by your die, then it doesn't really matter if they are shorter than most others. They still need to be trimmed to the same length before you start loading.
As for cast bullets, you should have no problem. A flat nose is recommended to get the maximum effect when you hit game. It doesn't have to be hard cast or particularly soft either; whatever works best in your rifle for accuracy and non-leading. Remember, it doesn't have to expand as your .45 is already pre-expanded to what a .308 will often end up.
If you are going to use any jacketed for the heavier game you mentioned, I would recommend you stick with the 405, or perhaps the 350. You don't want to go lighter as they might not penetrate as deeply as you might like.

 

[phishroy]

No need for a lot of expansion with a 45-70.
Pick a nice heavy bullet with a wide maplet and your set to go.
I know the bullet barn have a nice 405 grain which has a wide maplet.
As far as powder goes imr 3031 is nice but so is 4198.
I wouldn’t worry to much on the crimp as long as the bullet is seated tight and you can’t push the bullet into the cases when pushing on the maplet.

 

[gunrunner8]

Pay att to the hardness of "hard cast bullets". Any less than 12HB and bullet penetration in bone might be not optimal, bullet at 17HB or more might be to brittle if pushed to fast. If possible start casting them yourself and have full controll of the ammo, this way you know the quality can be counted on when chips are down.

 

[Logan_Lamothe]

Thanks for the replies. This morning I picked some new Remington Brass, RCBS die set, and some 420 grain hard cast bullets now I need to find some powder and do some shooting.

 

[ben hunchak]

It is becoming more apparent that cast bullets should not be too hard or they are brittle and can break up on solid bone, BHN of 25 has proven to be brittle and it is now accepted that BHN 19 or so is optimum for hardness, with little if any expansion, and much less chance of busting up due to brittleness. My experimenting shows that those figures are about right and that adding Tin is also great for keeping the bullet together on impact, it doesn't add much to the hardness, but adds to the ductile strength of the bullet. Most commercial outfits don't add tin because, you guessed it, it is fairly expensive. Instead the bullets get their hardness from antimony, which helps cause the shattering on impact. As a bonus, the slightly softer bullets usually shoot better!

 

[Logan_Lamothe]

Okay, just finished cronying my first loads on the weekend.

IMR4198 and 420 hard casts from WSS made in Foam Lake Sask.

I tried 41 to 45 grains and got muzzle velocities from 1700 to 1900 fps, how fast can I push hard cast before they start to fail?

 

[blacksmithden]

The usual rule of thumb is 2000 fps, but I'll let someone who owns and has shot that specfic caliber chime in.