Has anyone tried using pull down bullets and powder from Chinese 150Gr 54R in 308?

steelgray

steelgray

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The 150 grain FMJ steel core 54R Chinese surplus ammo of the 70's seems to have 308 ballistics.

Has anyone tried less than a full dump of that 54R donor powder (say, original less 2-3 grains) into a 308 Win case, capped off by a resized 150 Gr Chinese pull down bullet?
 
Should work, presuming you do your research on the powder charge. I pull the bullets from 54R and use them and a lesser dose of powder in .303 British.

Would you run the bullets through a LEE sizing die?
 
Rather than asking. Why not just try it? But if you subtract a few grains from the x54 for 308, you wouldn't have the same ballistics anymore.

Personally with how common 30 cal bullets are, I'd save the x54 components for 303.
 
I've used them in 7.65x53 as well as 7.62x51Nato.

It's been a long time since I did use them for the "Indian FN FAL" rifles which all seemed to have .310 or larger bores and in Mod 1916 Spanish Mausers, which also seem to have larger .310 bores, similar to the CETME rifles they produced.

Be careful with the powder charge as mentioned. The 7.62x54 is actually quite a powerful military cartridge, right on up there with the 30-06 and 8x57IS loads.

If you're actually going to shoot these bullets out of a sporter, such as a Win Mod70/REM 700 or a Savage 110 bolt action I seriously doubt they would notice any difference, other than that those bullets aren't especially notable for being more than acceptably accurate by military standards at the time of their production.

I don't remember offhand what the speed alternative was for the Chinese ammo, but I believe it was close to IMR3031. Maybe Ganderite would have more specific information
 
OkayShooter said:
Rather than asking. Why not just try it? But if you subtract a few grains from the x54 for 308, you wouldn't have the same ballistics anymore.

Personally with how common 30 cal bullets are, I'd save the x54 components for 303.
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Yes, I Think I'd resize them to 308 with a Lee Bullet sizing die. There is a guy in another thread who I think said he bought a bunch of surplus steel core 8mm projectiles and resized them to .311 in one pass and to .308 in two passes. He said that the Lee bullets sizing lube worked fine but he found that Duralube worked even better. As for the charge size, because the 54R case has a larger volume it need more powder than 308 to achieve the same ballistics. I'd go down 2 or three grains for that reason.
 
steelgray said:
Yes, I Think I'd resize them to 308 with a Lee Bullet sizing die. There is a guy in another thread who I think said he bought a bunch of surplus steel core 8mm projectiles and resized them to .311 in one pass and to .308 in two passes. He said that the Lee bullets sizing lube worked fine but he found that Duralube worked even better. As for the charge size, because the 54R case has a larger volume it need more powder than 308 to achieve the same ballistics. I'd go down 2 or three grains for that reason.
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If the OP is going to shoot them out of a good strong rifle, even one of the older 98s chambered for the 308Win, the rifle won't notice the .002 difference and may even shoot them better than the rifles they were intended for.
 
I use 70% of the powder from a surplus 7.62x54R round, along with the bullet to load a .303 British round.
 
I have tried them in a custom 308. It has a SAAMI minimum chamber. The neck was a bit tight in the chamber because of the fatter bullet and I got massive pressure and a blown primer. Check the neck clearance before loading/shooting.
 
Ganderite said:
I have tried them in a custom 308. It has a SAAMI minimum chamber. The neck was a bit tight in the chamber because of the fatter bullet and I got massive pressure and a blown primer. Check the neck clearance before loading/shooting.
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Very tight neck clearance will do that.

The only reason I didn't shoot any out of my HBR was because I couldn't chamber rounds loaded with those bullets because the neck diameters of the cartridges was to large and my case necks were already on the thin side from being turned down for the neck bushing in my Wilson sizing die that was exclusive for that chamber. Didn't want to chance a case neck separation for bullets I knew weren't intrinsicly accurate.
 
I've tried dumping the 150 gr Chinese donor powder into a 308 case and reseating the .311projectile. Contrary to what another poster has said, there is no issue shooting .311s in a .308 bore. The projectile just resizes as it runs down the bore - and the pressure increase associated with that is tiny. This has been established - by many others. There are multiple threads about this on the web. If anything, the net result is improved accuracy.

HOWEVER, the 308 case is substantially smaller - in capacity - than the donor X54R case and the Chinese powder is basically a fairly bulky Chinese version of IMR4898. When the X54R powder charge is transferred to a 308 case, the level of the powder in the case gets pretty close to the neck - especially in military 308 cases. That creates a pressure issue. So far I found you have to go down about 2 grains with commercial brass and probably another 2 grains with military brass.
 
steelgray said:
I've tried dumping the 150 gr Chinese donor powder into a 308 case and reseating the .311projectile. Contrary to what another poster has said, there is no issue shooting .311s in a .308 bore. The projectile just resizes as it runs down the bore - and the pressure increase associated with that is tiny. This has been established - by many others. There are multiple threads about this on the web. If anything, the net result is improved accuracy.

HOWEVER, the 308 case is substantially smaller - in capacity - than the donor X54R case and the Chinese powder is basically a fairly bulky Chinese version of IMR4898. When the X54R powder charge is transferred to a 308 case, the level of the powder in the case gets pretty close to the neck - especially in military 308 cases. That creates a pressure issue. So far I found you have to go down about 2 grains with commercial brass and probably another 2 grains with military brass.
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I agree that the extra few thou of bullet diameter won't make much difference, not safety wise anyway. It might cause the issue Ganderite had if the load was over max for his rifle.

I was curious after reading your post, so went to the shop and measured some of the Chinese surplus bullets I've pulled from three different lots.

They were all .310 diameter according to my Mitutoyo and Starrett micrometers.

That was just to satisfy my own curiousity. It wouldn't surprise me at all if your bullets are actually .311.
 
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