Help..any ideas?

Sask Hunter

Sask Hunter

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Hi guys been here a little while...enjoy it immensly...

Heres the rub...

My new rifle...completely stock(no other work) T/C Pro Hunter 7mm-08, Elite 3200 4x12x40 ao. Yes the trigger is heavy and the hammer is heavy.

The problem...can't find a load that shoots less than 2.25 inches at 100 yds. Most shoot > 2.25".

Varget powder...43 grains.
Bullet...139 grain Hornady IB
Case length...2.025
Primer: Federal Match Large Rifle Primer

and YES I have run down the powder weights from 42 grs - 43.5 grains (max)and 43 shoots the best in both rifles...in the Pro Hunter thats not saying much...

My wifes Remington 700 SPS in 7mm-08 Rem shoots this load sub .75" at 100 yds at both COL = 2.810 and 2.840...

My Pro Hunter shoots nothing at any length from 2.800 - 2.880...its just not a shooter...and I am having a difficult time with this...and I sold my Savage for this...I am a moron...

Any help would be great...

Disappointed in Regina

Sask Hunter
 
People seem to think that just because a certain bullet/powder combination shoots accurately in one gun,it should shoot accurately in all guns.Unfortunately,that just isn't always the case.If changing the powder charge and bullet seating depth doesn't help,try another bullet or another powder.Every gun will not shoot every bullet or every powder accurately,and you need to experiment to see which bullet and which powder it prefers.
 
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You really haven't given it much of a range as far as load development goes.

In my 300 win mag, I started at something like 64 grains of 7828 powder and worked it all the way up to 78. As it turns out, it'll shoot just under an inch at 100 yards with 68.5 grains. That just happens to be under the starting load for a couple of the manuals that I consulted.

Check through several manuals and take note of the lowest starting load out of all of them and the max load out of all of them. That's your new min and max loads. Work up from minimum. If you reach max and it's still spread all over, change something weather it be powder or bullet.

My 300 just will not settle down using boat tail bullets of any kind. It hates them. Once I switched to plain old flat bottom Speer Spitzers and went through the range again, it settled right down at 68.5gr

It can take a long time to find something that your particular gun is happy with. Be patient.
 
Sask Hunter said:
Hi guys been here a little while...enjoy it immensly...

Heres the rub...

My new rifle...completely stock(no other work) T/C Pro Hunter 7mm-08, Elite 3200 4x12x40 ao. Yes the trigger is heavy and the hammer is heavy.

The problem...can't find a load that shoots less than 2.25 inches at 100 yds. Most shoot > 2.25".

Varget powder...43 grains.
Bullet...139 grain Hornady IB
Case length...2.025
Primer: Federal Match Large Rifle Primer

and YES I have run down the powder weights from 42 grs - 43.5 grains (max)and 43 shoots the best in both rifles...in the Pro Hunter thats not saying much...

My wifes Remington 700 SPS in 7mm-08 Rem shoots this load sub .75" at 100 yds at both COL = 2.810 and 2.840...

My Pro Hunter shoots nothing at any length from 2.800 - 2.880...its just not a shooter...and I am having a difficult time with this...and I sold my Savage for this...I am a moron...

Any help would be great...

Disappointed in Regina

Sask Hunter
Click to expand...

How can this be?? On all the hunting shows the TC PH is a one-hole-shootin' wonder!!

Do you think that it might be that all the hype (gasp!!) might just be advertising BS?? After all it's really just a single shot break action rifle, not far removed from a sears / cooey single shot shotgun... My advice is see if you can get the savage back...
 
Barrels will preferentially "tune" to a given bullet weight. Your post does not mention whether you've played around with different weights - could be that your rifle doesnt like the 139 grainers, plain and simple. Suggest you try some other weights. If you want to stick to that weight, play with powders.
 
Thanks for the thoughts...the range of powder charge is per my reloading manuals...I love the 139 grain...so I think I am stuck on it.

The barrel twist rate is unknown to me...lans is 2.880. Still does not shoot...

I have had the pleasure to own 3 other 7mm-08's all would shoot the same load sub .50 inch @ 100 yds. All very forgiving loaders.

Time to play. I guess. COULD IT BE BARREL BREAK IN ISSUES?...

Keep the ideas coming...it gives me patience or else for sale it goes...I am a lefty so that maybe the problem...lol

Cheers

Sask Hunter
 
Apparently the Encore doesn't like 7mm barrels, and this thread is not the first time I've read that.

Typical posts on GBO:

"I purchased a 7mm-08 T/C replacement barrel for my Pro Hunter. It would not shoot accurately with any factory or reloads. It turned out to be a head space ( bad chamber) problem. The primers were definitely showing flattening. I sent it back with some fired cases and they agreed. They sent me a new barrel. It shoots well."

"I HAD PROBLEMS WITH THE 7MM AND 243- MOST I COULD GET WAS 4-5 INCH GROUP AT 100(AFTER TRYING DIFF FACTORY AMMOS AND WEIGHTS).
CALLED TC, THEY TOLD ME TO SEND BARRELS BACK TO TC FACTORY.
IN 6-8 WEEKS I RECEIVED NEW BARRELS BACK AND BOTH SHOT LESS THAN 1". "

http://www.go2gbo.com/forums/index.php/board,33.0.html


BTW, don't know if it makes a difference or not, but TC makes the 7mm-08 barrel with a left hand twist...

Just for s**ts and giggles I'd try a different bullet weight, or even factory ammo...
 
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There are so many variables, you could wear out a barrel before finding 'the' load.

If It was my rifle, here is what i would do.

Take the laod that shot the best and make 3 tests (5 shots each) of bullet touching the rifling, 10 thou off the rifling and 20 tou off. One might be better than the other.

If that did not work, I would buy a box of 140 grain flat base spitzers and a box of 140 gr round nose.

I would then load them with the same powder charge as above and .5 and 1 grain more and less, with the bullet 10 thou off the rifling. This should suggest which bullet, of the three, the rifle prefers.

And finally, I would try a can of RL15, which I find a less fussy powder to work with than varget.

Actually, the FIRST thing I would do is try to get my Savage back.
 
I've been pulling my hair out for the last 3 months trying to get my rifle to shoot some decent groups - 3000 shots later (22 hornet) I think I might have her grouping under an inch - yiks.....talk about frustrating. Anyway, I did alot of reading on barrel break in and found there to be a trillion different recommendations on how to! I had purchased some JB paste a while back and then read on some threads not to use so I just sort of forgot about it. Well, when you can't get groupings......desperation kicks in and the JB came out. Used it sparingly, went out and shot 20 - five shot groupings & 90% were under 1 inch - finally! One other change I made was I sent one dry patch through the barrel after every 5 shots - a recommendation directly from Dan Cooper of Cooper Firearms. Question is was it the JB or the dry patch cleaning that solved the problem? Thought I would share my experience as it may help you. Cheers
 
Thanks for the thoughts...the range of powder charge is per my reloading manuals...I love the 139 grain...so I think I am stuck on it.

The barrel twist rate is unknown to me...lans is 2.880. Still does not shoot...
Click to expand...

So are you saying that you have actually measured the distance to the lands with that particular bullet and it measures 2.880" or is that the COL specified in the manual?

In any case,the rifle just doesn't seem to like that particular bullet/powder combination,so your best option is to change one or the other,and do some more testing..
 
The manuals suggest a MAX over all length of 2.800 per factory spec...for fun I bought some Serbian 140 gr sp bt loads to try out...they measure Max OAL = 2.600 not 2.800 like every manual I have...hmmm I hear they now how to build ammunition...we'll see Thursday night.

Been using IB's for 5 yrs or so in everything(7Rem Mag, 7-08, 308, 30-06) never a problem. But I am going to try some different bullets.

This gun may just not like 139 over Varget with match primers...or maybe I have to call TC personally and ask them...maybe there is a bad run of barrels...like suggested earlier...

Anyhow, patience is a virtue.

Cheers

Sask Hunter
 
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That firearm just does not seem to live up to the T/C promise, I think with such a heavy and rough trigger and the rather poor performance I would just send it back to T/C for a replacement.

I doubt that they would argue with you and I am sure they would not want you to have a sour experience with their products...

Maybe time to save some angst and let them "make it right"?

Cheers and good luck with it, Bob
 
Question:

Is the fore-end/stock touching/contacting the barrel?

I am not sure of the design of the rifle but that would be the first place I would look.



Ruger #1's that suffer from accuracy problems usually benefit from Hicks forearm hanger so the barrel is free-floated.

Being this is a break-open action I am not sure if this achievable?
 
Sask Hunter said:
I love the 139 grain...so I think I am stuck on it.
Click to expand...
You might like the 139s, but your gun might not. Probably be a good idea to be a bit more flexible with different bullets and weights.

I wanted to shoot 270gr Hornadys from my new 375 mag in prep for a moose hunt this fall as I have lots of them on hand and they're not all that expensive. I tried everything to get them to shoot, but no deal. I finally switched to 260gr Nosler ABs and got 1" groups right off the bat. Load development stopped after that! :)


.
 
my tc encore 7-08 will not shoot the cheap 139 gr. hornadys at all... have you tried a box of factory ammo? mine will one hole all day with either 140 gr. accubonds, or ballistic tips, or barnes bullets, factory or reloads. As for the trigger, the gun is still new correct? why not give it some time to work in before sending it back to t/c?
 
Thanks again...
no angst...just some disappointment...am going to try some different bullets? Maybe Bergers, maybe Accubonds, I have used Ballistic Tips in .30 cal.

On recommendation from a friend I bought 2 boxes of 140 sp bt (serbian made?) factory shells. He says they will shoot and the have great brass...

We will see tonight how they shoot...was just hoping to shoot exact same load as the wife's Remington SPS. Last yr the Savage and the Remington were both match lighters (same loads) (saves money)...
 
Hi everyone
Update...the factory ammo was worse than the reloads...so time to start over...

This what I chose to do. I reinstalled the base, rings and the 3200 4x12x40 AO scope. Then, I remeasured the MOAL of the cartridge for my rifle. It measures 2.925 (touching the lans), I backed it off to 2.905 rechecked not touching the lans anymore. I do believe thats the magic 20thou everyone talks about.

If it rains and I can't bow hunt I will test (42 grns - 43.5 grns max) 3 shot groups. I am still trying 139 Hornady IB's with the Varget powder and Fed Match Primers.

If the gun shoots better than 2.25 inches I will change the action pin, trigger springs and hammer springs all from Bellm. They say the action pin reduces group size alone by over 1 inch...

If the Hornady's dont shoot I will test the Grand Slam, and the Nosler Partition and some berger 168 gr vld (but I think they will eat up case capacity).

Either way it will be a great day...

Cheers

Sask Hunter
 
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