Help with Bayonet ID/History w/pics

travis_

travis_

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My mother found this bayonet. Anybody have any information on it? What its for, value?

Somebody has coated the blade in some grease and placed it in the sheath. That seems stupid to me. Is it possible to clean it? Also looks like a bit of mold on the outside of the sheath. Should I just rinse that off with a warm cloth? Overall how should I clean and store this?

Thanks in advance....
 
Pattern 1907 bayonet for a Lee Enfiled Number 1 Mark 3. I can see that is is made by Wilkinson, and I think I seen an "8" on the date, so I am guessing it is a 1918. It will either be "18" or "28", but likely "18". It is broad arrow marked, which means it saw service with the British military. If it was Canadian it would probably have had a capital letter C around the broad arrow.

As for cleaning, use whatever will work to remove the grease from the bayonet. Hot soapy water even. The scabbard, I would clean more lightly. Wipe the mold off of it. A wet cloth would be OK, but I would be careful not to use anything which would soften the leather too much as you don't want it to go all floppy on you.

And BY NO MEANS sharpen or sand the blade. Just clean it, and give it a light coat of gun oil.
 
Thanks a lot! I definitely won't sharpen it. However there is another bayonet around my mother's house somewhere (I think it's the same kind) that has been messed with is there somewhere/someone I can send it to to have it fixed/restored? When I come across it I'll post pictures.
 
travis, it would cost you more to have it fixed or restored than the bayonet is worth.

Do not use Neatsfoot Oil or anything similar on that scabbard. They were never intended to last for a century or more.

If you must clean up the scabbard, I would use a light coat of Kiwi shoe polish. Very light, coats, several times. The scabbard was never brightly polished except for special purposes. Stay away from cleaners that require brushing as well. The Kiwi will keep the leather reasonably supple.

A lot of the leather in those old scabbards was cured during war time conditions, often in a hap hazard manner and were actually rotting as they were being sewn and fitted. Lots of them have the stitching rotted away as well. This is because the curing Tannin used wasn't rinsed out properly.

That one is in decent shape.

As for the grease on the scabbard, it may well be cosmoline. This stuff was used to coat metal for long term storage by the military.

If you don't intend to show the blade, leave it alone. It may be hard but will soften with repeated rubbings of Diesel or Varsol. Be carful to keep both of these off the scabbard and the wooden grip panels. I have seen them bleached almost white from this.

If you do decide to clean the cosmo from the blade, use a spray on type rust retardant that dries clear. Stay away from stuff like WD 40.
 
bearhunter said:
travis, it would cost you more to have it fixed or restored than the bayonet is worth.

Do not use Neatsfoot Oil or anything similar on that scabbard. They were never intended to last for a century or more.

If you must clean up the scabbard, I would use a light coat of Kiwi shoe polish. Very light, coats, several times. The scabbard was never brightly polished except for special purposes. Stay away from cleaners that require brushing as well. The Kiwi will keep the leather reasonably supple.

A lot of the leather in those old scabbards was cured during war time conditions, often in a hap hazard manner and were actually rotting as they were being sewn and fitted. Lots of them have the stitching rotted away as well. This is because the curing Tannin used wasn't rinsed out properly.

That one is in decent shape.

As for the grease on the scabbard, it may well be cosmoline. This stuff was used to coat metal for long term storage by the military.

If you don't intend to show the blade, leave it alone. It may be hard but will soften with repeated rubbings of Diesel or Varsol. Be carful to keep both of these off the scabbard and the wooden grip panels. I have seen them bleached almost white from this.

If you do decide to clean the cosmo from the blade, use a spray on type rust retardant that dries clear. Stay away from stuff like WD 40.
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Thanks for the response. Maybe I'll wipe the big chunks of grease off the blade and just wipe the scabbard lightly down with a warm cloth to remove the mould. I wasn't intending on doing anything even as major as treating the leather.

From your perspective is this what I should do? I'd like to preserve it best I can and not ruin the historical integrity of it. I guess for storage just like my guns (cool, dry and out of the light)?

Also, do you have any idea on value? I looked quickly online and I am seeing them from between $80-200. Of course I know there are dozens of nuanced things that I don't know to consider..
 
Only thing I have to add is that when you pull the bayonet from its scabbard always hold the scabbard by the metal. Seems like an obvious no brainer but there are a ton of scabbards that have been ripped in half by people holding onto the leather and tearing the steel away with the blade.
 
flying pig said:
Only thing I have to add is that when you pull the bayonet from its scabbard always hold the scabbard by the metal. Seems like an obvious no brainer but there are a ton of scabbards that have been ripped in half by people holding onto the leather and tearing the steel away with the blade.
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Thanks, I will make sure to do that. However, the leather feels pretty solid I couldn't see that happening anytime soon.
 
travis_ said:
Thanks for the response. Maybe I'll wipe the big chunks of grease off the blade and just wipe the scabbard lightly down with a warm cloth to remove the mould. I wasn't intending on doing anything even as major as treating the leather.

From your perspective is this what I should do? I'd like to preserve it best I can and not ruin the historical integrity of it. I guess for storage just like my guns (cool, dry and out of the light)?

Also, do you have any idea on value? I looked quickly online and I am seeing them from between $80-200. Of course I know there are dozens of nuanced things that I don't know to consider..
Click to expand...


Unless I had it in my hands, I couldn't give you and accurate price. The condition you describe would bring over $100.

As for cleaning the mold from the scabbard, you definitely need to stop those spores before they do any real damage. Some very mild alcohol/water mix that is warm will do that nicely. Then get some Kiwi polish and put it on without buffing it to a shine.

If you don't intend to display the blade, leave it as is, as long as there are no rust spots appearing.
 
kolik1 said:
The next time I'm at my parents i'll grab dad's and snap a few pictures. It's still in awesome shape from the last time i remember seeing it. He bought it military surplus around 35 years ago for $6.
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The 3 Vets stores and Army Navy used to have bins full of them in various condition, ranging from as new to well used. Take your pick for a buck apiece. That was in the late sixties.

We used to pick up No4 bayos, without scabbards at 12 for a dollar. They made great tent pegs.
 
bearhunter said:
The 3 Vets stores and Army Navy used to have bins full of them in various condition, ranging from as new to well used. Take your pick for a buck apiece. That was in the late sixties.

We used to pick up No4 bayos, without scabbards at 12 for a dollar. They made great tent pegs.
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Tent pegs! haha
 
Yes, tent pegs.

They used to be listed as that in some of the surplus catalogs.

You ordered tent pegs, sent in your $ and got a packet of Number 4 spikes.

SMLE bayonets started at $2. They are $80 and up these days.

Partly it is scarcity, partly it is new collectors, but a LOT is the fact that the Dollar has gone for crap. A 10-cent chocolate bar is now $1.29 plus tax and a Dollar is an aluminum-bronze SLUG that costs the Gummint 12 debased cents to make; it used to be 5 quarters weighed a Troy ounce..... and they were 80% Silver. When the Old Age Pension started off it was $75 a month; it is now about 1100 and it buys much the same.

That is called INFLATION and it is the cruelest tax of all because it destroys the value of what money you have saved. If you have your savings in collectible property, you can just about keep up or even get ahead a little.
 
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