Hot loads in older shotguns?

Gibo - words might be used different - "integral" tends not to be "attached" - it is "part of" or "formed from" - from your links - looks as if that round boss for the main action screw - on the 190kb - might act as if it were a recoil lug - to transfer recoil from the metal part into the wood stock - evidence here is that round shapes do not hold up to that service very well - wood tends to get forced apart and split - like when allowing action screws to transfer recoil to the stock on Mauser rifles. The schematic for the 390ka appears to show a "recoil plate" at front of receiver / rear of barrel - I think that is fairly commonly seen on various Savage, Remington and others - including rifles - was a separate part - not part of the receiver casting, at least in the Remington 788 rifles that I have played with. One would think that "recoil plate" would work well enough, if it was fit tight and bearing on the wood stock. That round boss on the 190kb might work fine if that action screw kept tight, and perhaps if it was fitted into a metal collar within the stock - but I do not know how that was done.
 
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yeah that's my fault 185/190/195 models don't use the well as a recoil plate alone.
The well fits into a recoil plate which wraps around the takedown screws that go through the entire width of handguard displacing the recoil through that, kind of like the Mauser k98's recoil lug.

There are not any good schematics for the 185/190/195 models.
https://youtu.be/ve5tSTIFxlE?t=500 at 8:20 shows it best
 
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... As an aside, better that people are a little confused about pressure levels and come away with the idea that all loads are at 11,500 psi so perhaps they might exercise caution when attempting to fire old or damaged barrels.

Canvasback, I respect your opinion … but this is where our opinions differ …..

Firearms owners are not 5 year old children that you keep in the dark and in order to protect them from themselves. Firearms owners are vetted adults who are able to make up their own mind as to what risks they want to take in life … and who can make their own decisions …. and who can take the responsibility for those decisions and outcomes.

“Confusion” doesn’t help anybody to learn and to evaluate the risks … and to make those decisions!

This forum is about sharing our collective knowledge …. and so that we can all learn.

Withholding that knowledge and creating confusion on purpose … and in order to protect members from themselves … I just find that approach very very very counter productive ... and I cannot agree to that approach.

This paternalistic approach … of keeping people in the dark … sounds a bit like the voice of our Liberal government ….. “We know what is best for you ... and you don't need to know!” ... doesn't that sound familiar?

Anyhow ... I hope you can accept that we have different opinions in this matter …
 
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Canvasback, I respect your opinion … but this is where our opinions differ …..

Firearms owners are not 5 year old children that you keep in the dark and in order to protect them from themselves. Firearms owners are vetted adults who are able to make up their own mind as to what risks they want to take in life … and who can make their own decisions …. and who can take the responsibility for those decisions and outcomes.

“Confusion” doesn’t help anybody to learn and to evaluate the risks … and to make those decisions!

This forum is about sharing our collective knowledge …. and so that we can all learn.

Withholding that knowledge and creating confusion on purpose … and in order to protect members from themselves … I just find that approach very very very counter productive ... and I cannot agree to that approach.

This paternalistic approach … of keeping people in the dark … sounds a bit like the voice of our Liberal government ….. “We know what is best for you ... and you don't need to know!” ... doesn't that sound familiar?

Anyhow ... I hope you can accept that we have different opinions in this matter …


Laugh2. “Vetted adults” ? On the subject of appropriate ammo to use in older guns? You are kidding, right? Do you remember the course material for your PAL?

Most haven’t a clue. The evidence gets shown to me and others again and again in the form of the misuse / lack of basic care / mangling by shade tree gunsmiths we get to see when we are looking at older guns. I see it regularly in these threads and these are the people, on CGN and other forums, that are the most likely to be learning. I hear it again and again in the myths about things like high brass and Damascus barrels that get repeated ad nauseum like it’s the gospel truth.

Me and everyone else involved in vintage sees the evidence of stunning ignorance every time we look at a selection of older guns. So I have little faith in the general knowledge of licensed gun owners in Canada to know much beyond the PAL course material. Which covers exactly none of what we are addressing here.

Having said that, if you’ve read my posts for any length of time, you know I’m happy to explain this stuff to people who are asking. Who have the wit to understand that maybe it would be in their best interest and the best interest of the firearm they are using, to ask a few questions. Like the OP did here. That’s why I’m posting. To replace ignorance with knowledge. To dispel myths and misinformation.

Do you see me withholding information here from people who ask? Do my posts suggest I’m trying to sow confusion? I’d say not. But the people who post on CGN, who ask questions and are interested in learning, represent a small fraction of gun owners in Canada. Most never come near here. They are too busy trying to jam 3 1/2” shells of 1 1/2 oz of steel into “grampa’s” old gun because that’s what the gun shops and ammo companies are pushing.

Most people aren’t interested in learning. And if they have even just the tiniest sliver of knowledge that suggests to their lizard brain that maybe they shouldn’t load that old gun they’ve got with just any shell they happen to find, I’m fine with that.

I'll add that my comments are specifically in regard to shotgun owners and shotgun gunsmithing. My knowledge of rifles and the way people use and abuse them is extremely limited as they aren't an area of interest for me.
 
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Laugh2. “Vetted adults” ? On the subject of appropriate ammo to use in older guns? You are kidding, right? Do you remember the course material for your PAL?

How does it go?
- A little knowledge is a dangerous thing.

While most firearm owners usually err on the safe side... I'm sure we've all come across the "if it fits, it ought to be safe to fire" type of individuals.
- Next thing you know, you see beat up M96 Mauser, because 7.25x25 pretty much looks the same as 7.63x25... or guys complaining of powder blow-back when shooting their grand'pa 22short rifle, when it's a 22 Flobert
 
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