How do you choose an optic?

CptAubrey

New member
Rating - 100%
7   0   0
Location
Toronto, ON
My son wants to try long distance PRS shooting (out to 1km) and as I want to keep him and I doing things together so I'm looking into it. So while I check out different bolt action rifles I jumped into the rabbit hole of optics that seems so deep and wide that I had no idea.

Not only brands, but basic magnifications, tube diameters, objective size, MIL, MOA, parallax, illumination, special turrets not to even mention the wild reticles. From plain jane cross hair to a wild array of hash marks, dots, lines.

How do you narrow down to a few? I figured I will max out at $1500 for my scope and $1000 for my rifle. (After I sell some others, ha ha). There seems to be so many good brands, big names with 'budget options' (ya right). So while I'd love to browse the EE area I really have NO idea what I need here. Ideally I'll have a rifle set up for this summer and get to an ORA match and look into joining.

So, what is your advice? Start with a magnification range and reticle preference and narrow down from there? Or is that a bad idea? Buy a cheaper scope and see how it goes? I kind of like the buy once, cry once philosophy, at least in my budget range. Pistols now seem so easy.


j
 
Well I'm not familiar with the PRS game. But I would suggest you look at the Sightron Siii, Nightforce SHV, used leupold mark 4, those are a good start. Great deals can be found in the EE but watch for counterfeit scopes. You might also want to look at some of the Zeiss conquest line up like the new V4. I'm not familiar with the trijicon line up or Swarovski but they should all have good optics.

For reticles I really like a fine crosshair and particularly like the LRMOA reticle in the Sightron Siii.
 
My son wants to try long distance PRS shooting (out to 1km) and as I want to keep him and I doing things together so I'm looking into it. So while I check out different bolt action rifles I jumped into the rabbit hole of optics that seems so deep and wide that I had no idea.

Not only brands, but basic magnifications, tube diameters, objective size, MIL, MOA, parallax, illumination, special turrets not to even mention the wild reticles. From plain jane cross hair to a wild array of hash marks, dots, lines.

How do you narrow down to a few? I figured I will max out at $1500 for my scope and $1000 for my rifle. (After I sell some others, ha ha). There seems to be so many good brands, big names with 'budget options' (ya right). So while I'd love to browse the EE area I really have NO idea what I need here. Ideally I'll have a rifle set up for this summer and get to an ORA match and look into joining.

So, what is your advice? Start with a magnification range and reticle preference and narrow down from there? Or is that a bad idea? Buy a cheaper scope and see how it goes? I kind of like the buy once, cry once philosophy, at least in my budget range. Pistols now seem so easy.


j

In a budget of $1500 for a scope I would definitely encourage you to check out the Athlon Ares BTR. It has an excellent range of features, magnification and reticle to get into PRS.
 
For PRS, I can recommend the following:

Mil Christmas Tree reticle
Mil Turrets
First Focal Plane

Everything else is pretty much personal preference. A larger tube diameter generally lends to more internal elevation/windage travel. 34mm is pretty common. I think when I shot my first couple PRS shoots I didn't get my scope above about 18 power so don't get hung up on scopes that have huge magnification.
 
Age of son?
Would a scope filled with distractions be cumbersome for him?

I'd send Jerry @ Mystic Precision a note.
He seems to have a great handle on them Sightrons.
 
I would not go the Sightron route personally. I am sure they make fine optics but I ran PRS events in Alberta for 3 years - I cannot recall once instance of seeing a Sightron being used.

There are not a lot of options in the mid $1k range but somethings to look for would be:

1) Reticle in the FFP
2) Matching turrets and reticle (MOA/MOA or MIL/MIL) - I would recommend Mil as that is what most people at matches will be shooting and we are a friendly folk and if we are all speaking the same language it is easier
3) 30MM of 34MM - it doesnt really matter. Higher end scopes will be 34MM+ and in the mid 1K range most scopes will be 30MM. A 30MM tube will give enough elevation for most (whether we like to admit it or not)
4) I like XMAS tree style reticles but anything with a .2 ish hash mark will work. Lots of guys dial for elevation and hold for wind. If you want to hold for both that a XMas tree one will help. Most manufacturers have both these days
5) As Clocked92 said I run my scopes in the 14-18 range at matches most of the time but all of my scopes are 5-25. However, a 6-18, 6-24, 5-25 will all work.
6) Objective size - doesnt matter. All your options will be in the 40MM to 56MM range and they will all work
7) Parallax - side parallax is what you should get (or Kahles weird top parallax or whatever it is)
8) Illumination - I never use it - If I could buy my scopes cheaper without I would but I can't. Don't go looking for a scope with one IMO

The Athlon scopes are an amazing value buy - lots of good reviews coming out of the states on them.

There is a used Delta Stryker (A LOW made scope) with rings for just under 2k that I would look hard at personally.
 
Age of son?
Would a scope filled with distractions be cumbersome for him?

I'd send Jerry @ Mystic Precision a note.
He seems to have a great handle on them Sightrons.


I am 56 and get distracted by reticles that are 'too busy'.

I second the nod to Jerry at Mystic, and the Sightron scope line.

I really like my Nightforce, but acknowledge that they can be spendy.
 
My son wants to try long distance PRS shooting (out to 1km) and as I want to keep him and I doing things together so I'm looking into it. So while I check out different bolt action rifles I jumped into the rabbit hole of optics that seems so deep and wide that I had no idea.

Not only brands, but basic magnifications, tube diameters, objective size, MIL, MOA, parallax, illumination, special turrets not to even mention the wild reticles. From plain jane cross hair to a wild array of hash marks, dots, lines.

How do you narrow down to a few? I figured I will max out at $1500 for my scope and $1000 for my rifle. (After I sell some others, ha ha). There seems to be so many good brands, big names with 'budget options' (ya right). So while I'd love to browse the EE area I really have NO idea what I need here. Ideally I'll have a rifle set up for this summer and get to an ORA match and look into joining.

So, what is your advice? Start with a magnification range and reticle preference and narrow down from there? Or is that a bad idea? Buy a cheaper scope and see how it goes? I kind of like the buy once, cry once philosophy, at least in my budget range. Pistols now seem so easy.


j

Can you confirm the type of match you want to shoot? There are matches held at Connaught that are called "precision/sniper" matches which are very different vs what is generically called "PRS/PRL" matches (think Meaford match)

Key features that are pretty much the norm in either style:

larger external adjustable turrets with click value that match the reticle. Mil is the most common unit in PRL matches. For matches at Connaught, you will likely bump into MOA as well. Definitely if you mean F class, MOA is favored. So it helps to clarify the game. You can most certainly use either unit in all forms of shooting.

Hash Mark reticle - for mil reticle, the newest options will be 0.2mil spacings for the windage... for elevation, you will find 0.2 and 0.5 mil lines. In MOA, 1 to 2 MOA spacings is typical.

Xmas tree reticle - these are reticles with the cascading markings to help with hold over and windage. These become very useful if you are shooting targets at various distances and are under time constraints so you can't dial (or the stage format doesn't allow you to dial). Some styles can be really cluttered so you will need to see what suits your tastes and game.

Mag range - for more static prone shooting, you can and will use higher mags with 30X not being too high for 900m pin point shooting. For PRL matches where are you in less then stable positions and have to locate targets and spot misses, lower mag will be used. Depending on the scope, field of view and reticle thickness, I will hover from 10X to 16X for PRL type matches.

Zero Stop - if you have it, you will use it especially if it works precisely and repeatably. Most scopes come with it so it really isn't an upgrade these days.

Side parallax - will be a given in this class of optic. Don't get hung up on the yardage markings, they rarely mean anything. Yes, some optical systems will be harder to get and keep a clear image.

Illuminated reticle - pretty much all offer it... I haven't used it so can't say either way.

Tracking - this is something that price tag and slick ads can't illustrate. You gotta run the scope and it better do what you expect and do it everytime. Test, test, test somemore. Every brand suggests their scope will track... some do, some don't. I am very tough on this for my scopes that I use and offer. In competition, you just don't get a mulligan or do over and if the scope misbehaves, you are chasing ghosts trying to figure out what to do next. The tracking should also match the reticle precisely.. not close, not sometimes.


Ideally my scope will have FFP, 0.1mil clicks, 10mils per revolution, Xmas tree reticle with 0.2mil windage/ 0.2 or 0.5mil on elevation with clear numbering so you can pick up the lines in a hurry. Mag range 4 to 30 or somewhere in between.

As an Athlon optics dealer, I am of course biased towards their products but I have also tested them aggressively on my rifles and in competition.... and they work. For 2018, I ran the Ares BTR 4.5-27 and it helped me get on the podium at both matches I shot. At that time, it was the best entry point for a full featured optic that didn't break the bank. The only "downside" of the scope is the clicks are not as pronounced as others. Now given the time constraints, I don't count clicks... you are dialing directly to a number and the smoothness allows for very fast transitions. Current models have improved clickiness.

Another new scope worth a look is the Midas TAC 6-24. Again, all the features that are "current" thinking but a capped windage knob which some prefer. The Xmas tree is a variant with a very small central floating dot. This allows for very precise aiming and avoids the #1 complaint of FFP scopes - thick reticles.

Either will fit well within your budget and serve you well.

For 2019, I will be running the new Ares ETR. These are 34mm scopes with ED glass, full features and huge amounts of useable travel. The price is a bit more then your goal BUT wowza, what an upgrade. If you can invest a bit more, this is the gem of a scope and I will be moving all my FFP scopes to this model. Perfect? nope, but it ticks off all the boxes with optics that is not far off some very pricey options.

I am also a Sightron dealer and use them on my F class rifles. They continue to offer high mag variable SFP scopes that compete with anything on the market BUT they just seem to get the FFP specs wrong. Feels like they are being "arm twisted" to build these scopes... good in some areas, missing in others. Happy to offer the new STAC FFP to those who want to give it a go.

PM or email if I can help get you get set up

Jerry

PS, also a Delta dealer and the FFP scopes are fantastic. now we are pushing well beyond the OP's budget so didn't mention it. Glass is one of its strongest points and is just behind the ubber expensive stuff. Very nice product but some may balk at the warranty. FYI, the Athlon Cronus BTR is the twin.
 
Last edited:
PS, also a Delta dealer and the FFP scopes are fantastic. now we are pushing well beyond the OP's budget so didn't mention it. Glass is one of its strongest points and is just behind the ubber expensive stuff. Very nice product but some may balk at the warranty. FYI, the Athlon Cronus BTR is the twin.

Used Delta Stryker from GBT with Leupold rings for 1995 - but yes, new ones are more than that.

Similar optic (read pretty much identical) to the Cronus BTR, Bushnell XRS, etc.
 
Wow, fantastic information. I'll read it over again at home and try to digest it. Thanks everyone!

Jerry, I said PRS but perhaps I should have just stayed with 'Long Range'. My son is 18 and I'm keen to see what tickles his interest, so we will be trying a few different disciplines. But I suspect the more dynamic or 'tacticool' styles will appeal to him. I'm a bit taken back as I thought it was pistols he liked (like me) and then he drops the bomb on me, that he'd rather shoot a rifle. But hey, I get to buy another rifle...


j
 
To keep the cost of entry down, have a look at the CRPS and NRL22 type matches in ON. Cost of entry is peanuts by comparison and no need to reload. The cost of shooting is also a fraction of centerfire.

The courses of fire and tasks are very similar to centerfire PRL matches. Your son will learn alot going this route and if this ends up not being his thing, you don't have a 5 figure project to unwind.

If you do want to get into the centerfire game, remember it is not just the rifle/scope, you will be reloading and that can add alot to the overall cost of the adventure. And if your son and you want to shoot and practise, you will have to consider consumables like barrels, brass and bullets,

Figure out your budget overall THEN start worrying about which game to play.

If I can help with some budgeting ideas and certainly, a wide range of suitable gear, let me know

Jerry
 
Thank you Jerry, that actually is a fantastic idea. Didn't know about the CRPS. I'm going to pitch it to him soon.

But wow, 500 for rifle and 500 for scope is quite low! But at that cost I can get my younger son involved sooner!


j
 
Two brands that will hold zero and track reliably are Nightforce and SWFA. SWFA's run ~ 1/3rd the price of NF.

Agreed. I prefer scopes with a established reputation for reliable, accurate tracking & durability. And if on a budget would buy a SWFA long before any of the newer, less proven options. A guy shooting a SWFA 10x placed second in one of our bigger local matches last year, even with the extra work of running a squad. They aren't fancy, but the SWFA's just plain work... Also, with a $1500 budget, I'd add the LRTSi to the list and try find a clean used unit or a sale.
 
Thank you Jerry, that actually is a fantastic idea. Didn't know about the CRPS. I'm going to pitch it to him soon.

But wow, 500 for rifle and 500 for scope is quite low! But at that cost I can get my younger son involved sooner!


j

The rifle can be around $300... optics choices have changed to include a better selection of scopes with the desired features. I am one of the Series sponsors and compete in it myself. I have helped several shooters work up their gear and they are having a ton of fun competing.

Send me an email info@mysticprecision.com Happy to offer some suggestions and link to events in ON. There are events in a couple of months and it would be great for both of you to go have a look... even give it a try (yes, there will be loaner rifles in both classes). These events are very low key and the organisers do a wonderful job of making sure shooters of all levels have a chance to enjoy their experience.

Jerry
 
I just bought a Bushnell Forge Deploy MOA FFP, 3-18 x 50mm. What sold me was the hollow square at the centre of the reticle with a dot in the centre. A guy doing reviews on youtube, had a photography background and said anything around 16x zoom was more than enough. I'm also mailing in a rebate for 70$, added bonus. Ends Jan 31st. Also bought a 20 MOA rail to mount it on and I didn't go cheap with rings, Vortex Precision Matched.
 
As mentioned earlier in the post, for that price range I would strongly consider Athlon models. They give far more pricey scopes a real run for the money. And most importantly above all else they seem to track extremely well. Tracking is better than many, more expensive makes and models. Suprisingly...
 
Back
Top Bottom