somebody tell me the hs precision stock is the same cheap tupperware of the one savage use, is true or false. I have a fried who whant to buy a tactical savage with the mcmillan stock, who know if the plastic stock of the tactical serie is better than the regular savage plastic stock?
HSprecision stock good or crap
- Thread starter matou2041
- Start date
HS PRecision is not the same quality as McMillan which is not the same quality as the standard Savage synthetic stock. Arguably, Savage is the cheapest quality, followed by the HS Precision (which is already a huge improvement) with the McMillan being the top of the line of the three.
Shelldrake
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Right behind you,,
I would rate HS Precision in the same league as McMillan. There isn't too many in the higher end, high volume aftermarket stock producers. To get something "better" than these two,, you would be looking at one of the custom makers.
You may want to look at Robertson Composites stock.
Ian Robertson is a member here.
http://www.robertsoncomposites.com/htmlfiles800/RobertsonComposites800.html
RePete.
Ian Robertson is a member here.
http://www.robertsoncomposites.com/htmlfiles800/RobertsonComposites800.html
RePete.
Steve David
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Oshawa, Ontario
I have to agree with Shelldrake. The HS stocks are super quality products as are the McMillan. You have to use both and see which one you prefer, it is a matter of how it feels to you, but as for one being better then the other, no, both are equivelent in quality.
Also, what RePete suggested with Robertson, that is a way to go aswell. Although I have never held one, they are right up there with HS and Mcmillan.
Also, what RePete suggested with Robertson, that is a way to go aswell. Although I have never held one, they are right up there with HS and Mcmillan.
Steve David
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Oshawa, Ontario
When the US Army put out the request for a new rifle, they specifically put that model HS stock into the requesition. Price had nothing to do with it, we are talking about the US Military, $$$ clearly means nothing, consider the price of the whole package, intial cost was close to $10,000, now, after this many years, the price has not come down that much. Look at the new 40-XS, it comes with an A3 stock and fully decked as a package with Leupold scope, Badger base and rings, case, bi-pod etc. they run $4600.00, that is quite a bit cheaper then an M24 with an A3 stock. Although a lot of us look at that HS stock on the M24 and try to figure out why they went with that particular model, and after this many years they still use it, again, this is the US Military and they could change it any day if they wanted to, they do infact still choose to use that stock. To say McMillan is "BETTER" then HS is like saying Mercedes is "BETTER" then BMW. In this case, it all comes down to which one feels better to you, not anyone else. With regards to the original question of quality of stock which this thread was posted for, that is not the issue, the one you like better is!
I can see some issues in regards to HS allumium bedding block as the rifle should be bedded and as McMillan reccomends in there stocks.One is made with Kevlar[HS] which does not have very good structual strenght the other is made with Fiberglass [McM] there is a big difference between the 2 manufactures
Shelldrake
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Right behind you,,
Savage said:
The HS stock I have came with bedding material. It works like a charm.
Mystic Precision
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Summerland, BC
Sorry, but Kevlar is way stronger AND stiffer then fibreglass.
That was the whole point for inventing Kevlar, or at least using it (lab accident actually). Anyways, kevlar provides a much stronger and/or lighter product as a similar glass item.
Throw in some carbon fibre and you have some really nice tech. Have a quick snoop at aerospace or racing (any discipline).
since Kevlar is roughly 6 times more expensive then FG, surprised that HS is cheaper. But then, maybe there is just a small patch in there somewhere.
Also, the company that uses Polyester resin (same stuff in Truck canopies) is not using the best adhesive. Epoxy is the best choice for stability, durability, flexibility. Polyester resin is about 1/4 the cost.
With all this tech and the cost these two charge, I am surprised that they are still building such heavy products. There is little reason to not make a better/stronger/more stable product that weights less then a savage injection molded stock.
Unless, you aren't producing a product worth the price.
I am glad to see that both suggest bedding now. There was a time that they said their V block bedding was perfect and all you needed was to torque the crap out of the action screws. That was very bad advice....with a lot of bent/stressed actions.
Jerry
That was the whole point for inventing Kevlar, or at least using it (lab accident actually). Anyways, kevlar provides a much stronger and/or lighter product as a similar glass item.
Throw in some carbon fibre and you have some really nice tech. Have a quick snoop at aerospace or racing (any discipline).
since Kevlar is roughly 6 times more expensive then FG, surprised that HS is cheaper. But then, maybe there is just a small patch in there somewhere.
Also, the company that uses Polyester resin (same stuff in Truck canopies) is not using the best adhesive. Epoxy is the best choice for stability, durability, flexibility. Polyester resin is about 1/4 the cost.
With all this tech and the cost these two charge, I am surprised that they are still building such heavy products. There is little reason to not make a better/stronger/more stable product that weights less then a savage injection molded stock.
Unless, you aren't producing a product worth the price.
I am glad to see that both suggest bedding now. There was a time that they said their V block bedding was perfect and all you needed was to torque the crap out of the action screws. That was very bad advice....with a lot of bent/stressed actions.
Jerry
As far as I know the HS is not a laid up stock, I believe the Kevlar that some suggest is rather decieving in that it is fibers that are molded into the stock as opposed to Kevlar cloth a la Brown Kevlar Pounder. Very different technologies and prices. I have used all of the above and think the McMillan is better than the HS, I will reserve judgement on the Robertson since I have never handled one, but being a Canadian company already is a big plus in my books. If the quality of the Robertson is similar to the McMillan then it would be a smart choice, not having to go south for any of my components makes thing alot easier.
bigbull
bigbull
Long Range Canuck
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Athabasca Alberta aka God's Country
In my opinion they are all very good stocks with different twists, I think it's like Steve David said you have to try them out to see what suits your shooting style best. I agree with bigbull about checking out Robertson Stock's. I think they build an excellent product that can compete and with the best, if not beat the best. I have an Mcmillan A5 on one rifle and Will be puting a Robertson on my wifes rifle. I would have used a Robertson on mine had I known about them at the time. Shop carefully and find what fits, if you buy the best stock on the market and it fits you like ####, it will not do anything to improve your accuracy or rifles performance.
Just an opinion.
Just an opinion.
Really Jerry You should inform McMillan of your findings
1. What materials is a stock made of? Each fiberglass stock is made of multi-layers of eight-ounce woven fiberglass cloth, laminated under pressure with epoxy resin. The stock is filled with solid fiberglass in the receiver area and epoxy and glass beads in the forend. Our EDGE ultralight stocks are made with 100% graphite cloth instead of fiberglass, for less weight and greater strength
6. Do you make Kevlar Stocks? From the testing we have done and the results of some independent testing, we have determined that Kevlar does not improve the quality or strength of our stocks.
9. What method do you use to make your stocks? We use the method commonly referred to as hand-laminating. Layers of glass cloth are laid in a mold by hand, then cured under heat and pressure. This adds strength, reduces weight, and eliminates voids compared to other methods of sprayed or molding methods.
Copied from the McMillan website http://www.mcmfamily.com/mcmillan/faq/#1
1. What materials is a stock made of? Each fiberglass stock is made of multi-layers of eight-ounce woven fiberglass cloth, laminated under pressure with epoxy resin. The stock is filled with solid fiberglass in the receiver area and epoxy and glass beads in the forend. Our EDGE ultralight stocks are made with 100% graphite cloth instead of fiberglass, for less weight and greater strength
6. Do you make Kevlar Stocks? From the testing we have done and the results of some independent testing, we have determined that Kevlar does not improve the quality or strength of our stocks.
9. What method do you use to make your stocks? We use the method commonly referred to as hand-laminating. Layers of glass cloth are laid in a mold by hand, then cured under heat and pressure. This adds strength, reduces weight, and eliminates voids compared to other methods of sprayed or molding methods.
Copied from the McMillan website http://www.mcmfamily.com/mcmillan/faq/#1
bigbull said:
I have handled a Robertson stocked rifle, and it 's as good as the McMillan.
If you go to Connaught Ranges in Ottawa, you will see a lot of Ian's stocked rifles.
His stocks are probably cheaper than the HS and McMillan's, AFTER you factor in the postage, duties, etc. Especially the hassle factor. And if they are more expensive by, say $50.00 (this is just a number pulled out of the air), then the extra cost isn't worth the agro of importing.
RePete.
HS stocks have a very thin fiberglass shell and a strip of Kevlar about 1" wide running up each side and are filled with a milled fibre reinforced foam.
McMillan stocks are, generally speaking, multi layer of fiberglass.
Our stocks are, generally speaking, multi layer fiberglass and carbon fibre with greater of lesser amounts of it dependng on model and intended use but every model has some cf in it.
I have played with Kevlar and have found no use for it in stocks. Kevlar tends to be a flexible material especially when used with a semi flexible resin. That is why some canoes are made of it. They can flex rather than break when they hit a rock. It is harder to cut than anything else.
I do have some Zylon which I will play with eventually.
Please don't say we are just as good as McMillan, we are better! We have a great record of converting customers.
We welcome CGN members to visit our shop in Ottawa and see for themselves.
McMillan stocks are, generally speaking, multi layer of fiberglass.
Our stocks are, generally speaking, multi layer fiberglass and carbon fibre with greater of lesser amounts of it dependng on model and intended use but every model has some cf in it.
I have played with Kevlar and have found no use for it in stocks. Kevlar tends to be a flexible material especially when used with a semi flexible resin. That is why some canoes are made of it. They can flex rather than break when they hit a rock. It is harder to cut than anything else.
I do have some Zylon which I will play with eventually.
Please don't say we are just as good as McMillan, we are better! We have a great record of converting customers.
We welcome CGN members to visit our shop in Ottawa and see for themselves.
