manbearpig
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Somewhere in the Third World
in a SHTF scenario, who gives a flying $%@# about hunting regulations? youre going to have bigger problems than worrying about using FMJ to hunt meat to survive.
Hunting with FMJs...
- Thread starter berger
- Start date
in a SHTF scenario, who gives a flying $%@# about hunting regulations? youre going to have bigger problems than worrying about using FMJ to hunt meat to survive.
FMJ would never be my first choice for hunting. But if hunting with FMJ is all that stands between you and a diet of grass in a survival situation, do what you gotta do.
You might also consider a couple hundred rounds of cheap silvertip .308. By no means new technology for hunting, but it'll do a better job of anchoring that deer or elk.
Ruffed Grouse is right! When I was in combat training that was the reason they gave us for using fmj bullets. But if you look at the 5.56 bullet it will do alot of damage and the reason for that is when it enters the body it will tumble around inside and exit somewhere else or not at all.
I am not worried about the hunting regs as far as putting food on the table when in a loosy situation, I was just surprised about the lack of effectiveness of FMJ on wild game. I am glad the info was put out,
I will keep a few boxes of hunting rounds in the kit.
It's not that mil-type FMJs are ineffective, they just demand a bit more precision or much better tracking skills.
As was pointed-out, cast bullets generally don't expand to any appreciable extent. But no one thinks shooting cast bullets out of your .30-30 is inhumane.
As was pointed-out, cast bullets generally don't expand to any appreciable extent. But no one thinks shooting cast bullets out of your .30-30 is inhumane.
The AK-74 round is a devestating keyholing round that makes horrific wounds.Ask the Afghans when they were fighting the Reds.The rifling twist was made to just stabilize the bullet in flight then the projectile had a airpocket in the nose.When it struck something the base caught the foreward momentum and tumbled through the target.Most didn't need a doctor.......Harold * military FMJ's are perfect for hidehunting [headshooting beavers] .223
Too bad hardly anyone we ever fight, barring the Germans back in the day, actually gives two frigs about their wounded.
The Russians probably wouldn't have, which always made me wonder about that whole "better to wound" arguement for introducing a smaller round in general. Especially when they figured out our little bullet downright tears stuff up.
I don't really buy it.
In terms of hunting with FMJ out of neccessity...Was it Elmer Keith who used to write about loading them backwards and using them on game that way back in the depression?
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. . . and if our allies, and ourselves ever wound one of our present enemies guess who's going to be providing stretcher bearers, ambulance driver and doctor? The wounded is better than dead myth is such a load of BS.
FMJ feed reliably too which hasn't been mentioned...especially in MG's and self loading weapons..no soft lead tips to get deformed and cause jams....i think that has alot to do with why they're still used but the Hague convention is probably the #1 reason why...and i don't buy the wounding is better than killing...i don't know one soldier that would rather wound an enemy than kill an enemy...when Mohammed jumps out at you with an RPG you do not want him to live long enough to squeeze the trigger after you've drilled him in the chest...so maybe that was applicable back in the day i don't think so anymore...as for hunting well unless you can guarantee a shoulder bone hit everytime to incapacitate the animal they are not an ethical choice even if they were legal...they don't have the terminal performance like even a cheap soft point does...and don't just check your provincial hunting regs to see if it's legal or illegal..check the provinces wildlife act..for example Nova Scotia doesn't state FMJ's are illegal in the hunting regs..you must look at NS Wildlife act to see that they are indeed illegal to even have in your weapon in a wildlife habitat for any game period...and i would assume that they could hang you even if you were target shooting on crown land (in NS)....and ignorance of the law is no defense unfortunately.
I've always felt that at the Hague Convention they were so desperate to agree on something that they agreed to use the bullets that they were already using. These are the same people that had no problem using flamethrowers, artillery and poison gas on each other.
- Location
- Somewhere on the Hudson Bay Coast
If you consider the effects of modern weapons on the human body, an expanding bullet would seem to be of little consequence. Many countries, the Brits in particular found ways to increase the wounding capabilities of FMJ projectiles. By the way Full Metal Jacket is a misnomer as the base of the bullet is not jacketed. Some bullets had wood inside the front section to ensure the bullet was unstable at impact. Jackets were made thin at the cannelure to ensure that the bullet would bend or break in two when it turned, and that bullet fragments would tear around in there damaging soft tissue. Compared to this, an expanding bullet that produced straight line penetration would seem to be more humane. Fighting isn't sport and you don't give an enemy any consideration as long as he poses a danger to you. If you can get a fix on where his fire is coming from you might as well incinerate him as shoot him anyway.
Yes it is. I am impressed by those who are compelled to justify the whole whole FMJ thing, while not having a clue themselves.
FMJ bullets where designed for pentration, rough handling, and reliabilty of cycling in weapons. The Hague Convention was in a time when nations destroyed eachother in a dignified and civilized fashion (trenches, etc), & only applied to the countries who signed it.
No, you can't hunt big game with them, but feel free to shoot rodents / coyotes. They tend to richocette ALOT.
Gophers dont know the difference between 7.62x39 FMJ and SP. They both cause a big mess.
I used my CZ 858 on a bunch.
As long as you are aware that regardless of what calibre that you are using, you are responsible for where that bullet goes, you should have no issue.
Just dont decide that you are going to take a file to the tip of your FMJ ammo so that it becomes an SP.
It wont work, it can destroy your gun, injuring or killing you, and even if the bullet does make it out, you are not going to get the accuracy you would want. Even from an SKS.
I used my CZ 858 on a bunch.
As long as you are aware that regardless of what calibre that you are using, you are responsible for where that bullet goes, you should have no issue.
Just dont decide that you are going to take a file to the tip of your FMJ ammo so that it becomes an SP.
It wont work, it can destroy your gun, injuring or killing you, and even if the bullet does make it out, you are not going to get the accuracy you would want. Even from an SKS.
- Location
- Somewhere on the Hudson Bay Coast
I'm sure it's there, but that's not where I got it.
