Hunting with slow bullets

John Y Cannuck

RichPoorMan<br>Super Moderator
Moderating Team
Rating - 100%
15   0   0
Yup, this is one of those posts, that nobody responds to, but, I make anyway. I figure, it might enlighten those with magnumitis.
I've taken deer with overloaded 45-70's, that punched whalop along the lines of a frieght train, and blew huge holes in the offside, but this year was different.
I toof my 44-40 out. A rifle, that I've been trying to get to shoot decently, for most of the year, at velocities upwards of 1800 fps. Wouldn't do it.
I found, that best groups were with bullets lobbing out at 1200 to 1300 fps.
That's much to slow for hunting, why the bullet would not even expand says I.
But then, I was watching an old western, one where the renegade Calvary guy is helping the indians kill buffalo. He's using a '73 Winchester.....
AH Hollywood what do they know?
But, I do a little research. The old round, at black powder velocities used to be used for not only buffalo, but bear, moose, deer, everything.
Must be a case of multiple hits right? But.... Maybe deer...
So, I took it out to the bush, sighted to be a couple of inches LOW at 100 yards, to get as small a point blank area as I could with it's rainbow trajectory, and settling on a load that gave me four inch groups at 100 yards.

Openning Morning.
i decided to walk through a section of bush, with my people at the other end. I was not dogging, rather still hunting.
The ridge I was walking was a steep one. Being about a 400 ft rise from the lake to the top. I was rewarded by running into one hunter after another. :rolleyes: The rewards of hunting crown land :rolleyes:
Then I run into a guy who tells me Im on HIS land. :confused:
Been hunting there for 40 years, and I did not know this. It's OK he says, "you just pushed out a doe to me, that I missed" "You can cross anytime!" :rolleyes:
I continue on, meeting more hunters. I'm depressed.
I cross the hydro line, where My people are supposed to be, below the last man's possition. He doesn't see me, Im under the edge of the cliff.
I start to climb, to walk through the other side. I park my butt on an old watch that my father used to sit at, in his younger days.
I was trying to sort out the mornings events, when i spotted a doe, walking up the far side of the swamp at the bottom of the ridge, about 200 yards off.
I rase the rifle, and wait. She keeps coming, turns the end of the swamp, and starts to climb towards me.
I'm thinking, keep climbing, you're saving me a lot of work.
She starts to turn up the other side of the swamp, and that's about 60 feet in front, and below me.
The 44-40 goes bang. (And really, it is a bang, not the report of a higher powered piece)
The deer bounds twice, as I jack in another round. She flopps over down hill against some brush, her feet in the air kicking. Then, she is still. It's all over but the drag up the 'mountain'
The little cartridge killed very effectively. Entered just below the spine, and exited a little lower. calliber sized holes.

Anyone got any slow bullet stories they'd like to share?
 
No stories in perticular but my dad's Ruger Carbine in .44 magnum has taken many deer out to 100 yards, makes them just as dead as my 30-06 does.
 
The 7x57 w/175gr RN and the 6.5x55 w/160gr RN are famous for reliable results. I'm pretty sure you cold duplicate these results with any non-magnum case, like the .308 w/200gr for example. This combination was needed (and useful) in the day when there were no custom bullets or high velocity calibers that would require those bullets.

Anyone shooting game at ranges under 200yds would be well served with a slow RN bullet, and that pretty much covers 90% of all big game shooting today.



.
 
last year i took a muley with an 8x56R with a load that i later chrono'ed at 1900fps with a 205 grain bullet.

this year i took another muley with an 8x57 with 200 grain bullet at just under 2500fps.

the deer could not tell the difference.
 
This year i took a large buck with my Sharps 45/70....66grs. of Black powder and 330 gr. Gould Hollow pt(MT Chambers)....hit the southern most pt. of a northbound deer....bullet exited in front of hip, deer dropped instantly and was stone dead when I got to it(175yds.)...muzzle vel is only 1450fps....but you could really hear the bullet hit....Wide, heavy bullets seem to be the best on game for me...the animal usually doesn't take another step after being hit.
 
I like the big, slow stuff too!
My 8X56MS was loaded with 175 pro huunters this year, but I am going to get a
200-220 grain mold for it this year and hunt withh cast next year!:dancingbanana:
My problem is I have too many cast bullet rifles to play with, and it is getting a bit tough to choose one to hunt with!:( :D
Cat
 
I fired a shot at a deer last year with a 170 gr RN out of a .30 REM. I checked on it last weekend, and the bullet is about halfway there now.
 
My first deer rifle was a Mod. 92 rifle in 44-40.

No complaints with factory ammo, and took a number of deer very neatly !

Lately been toying with a Ruger No. 1 in 45-70, with Sierra 300 HP's
at +/- 2000 fps.
 
The 44-40 may be a marginal deer cartridge, but it's undeniably taken more than it's fair share of venison over the years.

Given that we have better choices available to use today, I'd probably shoose something else (as I'm sure they would have in the 1870's, if they'd had more powerful cartridges widely available). And I'm sure that the average frontiersman who didn't EAT if he didn't kill stuff was a better marksman than most today.

But, it most certainly WILL work.
 
2300 fps isnt slow, it will get you out to 250 yards no problem if your bullet is pointy :runaway:

Id define slow as 1800 fps or less
 
I used a bp load in a short barrelled H&R Handi Rifle for one deer. It chronied at 1190 fps. Being so slow meant there were no problems using quite soft cast bullets. Caliber entry and golf ball sized exit on through the rib cage.
 
I shot a deer with a .50 cal 410gr hollow point. Muzzle velocity was ~1350fps. The penetration and performance was excellent. It's all about the momentum of the projectile.

People have been tricked into looking at kinetic energy, which uses the velocity squared when calculating the value. It was a way to market the new small caliber "high" velocity cartridges that replaced the old black powder rounds. When calculating momentum velocity is not squared, and because of that the smaller, lighter and faster bullets lose their "advantage".
 
Not a hunting story but.... In '86 I took the paramedic training in California. One of our lecturers was a LA county emergency room doctor who said that slow moving bullets do more damage than fast moving bullets. I asked; Are you a shooter? He said yes. I asked; Do you mean that a 45 ACP does more damage than a 44 magnum with a similar bullet? And he said yes. He probably has seen more gun shot wounds than every ER doctor in Canada combined. So I'll just have to take his word for it
 
I think if I counted I'd be well over 20 deer plus some moose and bear. in all I think 3 shots would have required more rifle then you had that morning. And the extra rifle I am talking about was a 160-180 grain bullet at less then 2800fps.
Hunting (and some luck) is the most important factor terminal ballistics is a far second.

If your going for antelope or goat or sheep or hunting mulies in wide open country yeah you'll want a flatter cartridge but for the most part a nice slow heavyish bullet will put food in the freezer.

Thanks for the energy explaination 1899 that is good to know
 
John Y Cannuck said:
The little cartridge killed very effectively. Entered just below the spine, and exited a little lower. calliber sized holes.

Although the story was good J/C it certainly does nothing to prove the effectiveness of a slow bullet.:confused:
You can kill anything quite easily with any projectile at any speed by interupting the CNS with a spine or head shot. Try shooting a 300 pound deer through the shoulder into the vitals with that round then get back to me.;)
 
Those shlow rounds have been killing deer for ages. My brothers friend on the farm found a nice ols 38-40 round in the mud, this is southern Ontario and it has been a while since you could hunt with that caliber. A dead deer is a dead deer and no matter what the Magnum guys say you don't need a 375 H&H to take out bambi.

I always liked the little 44-40, I must add one to my collection at some point, and a 38-55.
 
Back
Top Bottom