I just inherited a Winchester 1895 made in 1896! SN below 3500!

curseyou

curseyou

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So I just inherited a Winchester 1895. Looks just like the middle guy here, except the stock is a basic grade of wood, and there is no grip or front checkering, and it has the steel backed crescent buttstock. No blue left and significant surface rust. The rifling fared much better. VG rifling with reasonable cleaning and crown in good shape. It was a moose gun in 303 Brit that saw one round a year at most and was used as such until two years ago. A google search of the SN sub 3500 says it was made in 1896 and is of the limited to the first 5k flat sided receivers. It would be an antique if it weren't for the centerfire cartridge.


18952.jpg

The last John M. Browning design for Winchester , the Model 1895 was engineered to accommodate a new generation of military cartridges promising to gain a substantial market. One of the innovative features of the model 1895 was the use of a non-detachable “box magazine” made necessary for use with more powerful pointed bullets. This was the first box magazine rifle developed by Winchester .

First Models have flat sides, rounded top and breech bolt, and a one-piece lever. The Second Model has a fluted receiver with a two-piece lever. Configurations were rifle, carbine and musket. Production ran from 1895 to 1940 with a total of 426,754 guns made. Of these, 293,816 were in the 7.62 mm Russian caliber in the musket version which were shipped to the Russian Imperial Government in 1915 and 1916. The ‘95 in 405 W.C.F. was a favorite of Teddy Roosevelt and he described his special order Winchester .405 as “The medicine gun for lions.” The model 1895 was a favorite among the Texas Rangers and other lawmen of the period. The 95 had many special order options available throughout its 45 years of production.
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So I guess I'm into antiques now! :D

Any advice on preservation and cleaning I'd appreciate. I have so much reading to do.
 
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I'm not much into the old Winchesters but it seems as though they fetch more money without any restoration. If one were to restore it though, getting someone like Doug Turnbull to do it would be the way to go. Pricey but absolutely stunning.
 
I would agree with Samb. On an early Winchester of any model, one should always be cautious of any restoration or changes. Flatside 1895s are rare and any example is likely worth more as an original than refinished.
Your new-to-you rifle has seen generations of hunting. Let it be what it is: a good hunting rifle, used and enjoyed for what it is. It has been part of many, many hunting stories.
Make sure you hunt with it at least once more.
 
Tharjoe said:
I would agree with Samb. On an early Winchester of any model, one should always be cautious of any restoration or changes. Flatside 1895s are rare and any example is likely worth more as an original than refinished.
Your new-to-you rifle has seen generations of hunting. Let it be what it is: a good hunting rifle, used and enjoyed for what it is. It has been part of many, many hunting stories.
Make sure you hunt with it at least once more.
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I **LOVE** your guidance.

Preservation concerns me. I've given it a gentle oil wipe with chamois towel to protect it. Some surface rust came off and I became concerned with rubbing off any traces of bluing I might not have seen.

Wood has zero cracks. I am amazed the quality now that I know the age. The action's function is excellent, springs excellent. It is in great shape based on initial inspection. Screws seem to have similar wear to samples on the web.

Should I carefully disassemble & clean and oil every nook and cranny, screw spring and raceway and leave a gentle coating of oil? G96? Should I not touch a thing and leave as-is?

What is an appropriate cleaner and protector for the wood?
 
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If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
If it werks, then a good cleaning is awl she needs.
G96 is a good product.
Fluid Film is stinky chit, but does a decent job on the wood too.

I use both.

Nice treasure you inherited.
 
The bore has very strong rifling, but some minor pitting like the rest of the metal. The barrel metal looks identical to the receiver with just a trace of blue in the recesses where the receiver and forestock prevent fingers from touching the barrel.

I noticed the proof marks that have a Oval WP (Winchester smokeless Proof) and an Oval P (mail order) which I understand probably means the original rifle was factory refitted with a .303 British barrel at some point, possibly after 1908. It is difficult to tell because the factory process wasn't 100% before 1908, and there are claims of documented proof of exceptions from the period. (probably wishful thinking) I also found different websites date the SN on the receiver to 1896 or 1897 depending on the site you look, and 1897 also is cited by some sources as the earliest of the .303 Brits. There is also poor clarity on the switch from O.F. to P proof marks for mail orders and outside fitting around this time, so more research is required. In addition to the proof marks mentioned above the rifle also has "nickel steel barrel especially for smokeless powder" on the left side of the barrel close to the receiver, and nothing else. I interpret this to mean rebarrel but I will continue reading for certainty.

I think I might order a Cody museum letter stating the original factory condition of the serial number. If the original SN factory record said anything other than .303 Brit, it would prove beyond a doubt a re-barreling took place. If it said .303 Brit, there is a very small chance it is factory, but perhaps placed via mail order. Like a Canadian dude mail ordering one of the early 303 brits in an 1890's version of ordering via Amazon?

It is important for me to identify if it is a factory original or a re-barrel. If re-barreled, I would be interested in refinishing it so it could last another 100 years. If original factory I would preserve it as-is for historical purposes.
 
Nice score on the '95. As others have said, don't be tempted to restore either the metal or wood finish, at least until its value has been determined. Clean the steel conventionally with a mild solvent like Hoppes #9 and a good grade of gun oil. If it has been determined that the rifle has no historical of collector value, then I agree with you, have it refinished. Clean and protect the stock with an appropriate wood oil like Tru-Oil; I still use a dab of boiled linseed oil hand rubbed vigorously into the surface of my wood stocked rifles. Linseed oil this has fallen from favor for many due to the fear of a potential fire hazard caused by carelessly disposing of oil soaked rags. If I use a rag to clean a stock, I soak it in water before I dispose of it, but when maintaining wood stocks I simply put a dab of oil on my fingers and rub it in with my hands, vigorously enough to create some heat. A little goes a long way, so you don't need to drown the stock in the stuff. I also use it to seal the inletting of the stock, again, using just enough. Congratulations on a nice heirloom.
 
Bin thinking 'bout this thread and pewl'd up ahh memory that could be useful.
Way back yawnder I purchased a 25-35.
The serial number dint jive with the two five three five.
I pulled the fore stock off and at the bottom of the bawrill where it meets
the receiver is a wee flat milled into it.
It was stamped with a year, last two numbers and the 25-35.
This was later than the serial number on the receiver.

I gathered that Winchester or someone had replaced the barrel and stamped
the info and date on this wee surface.

I recalled three capital letters before it all.
I figured it was the Winchester gunsmith or someother gunsmith that did the alteration.

Dunnoh, but I sure am disappointed in meself for letting this jewel go.

Moral of the note?
Maybe your rifle has some markings?
Cody letter would sure clear things up in regards to what you have and
whether it is in it's original form from the factory.
 
I picked up the Kassab and Dunbar 1895 book. It is really really good. I looked under the forearm to see the underside of the barrel and to ID the rest. The underside has the circle VP (visual/verified/violent proof), an M NS for Midvale Nickel-Steel and a 303 stamp. The nickel steel barrel address with dashes matches > 1908 barrels starting at SN60,000, with matching 24A sporting model rear sights ... on a SN 34xx gun. Toss in the circle P proof mark on the barrel and this is most certainly a rare spring of 1897 stock and flatside receiver with an 1908-1909 rebarrel to .303 Brit via mailorder.

A very cool piece. But rebarrels have zero serious collector/historical value.

Looks like I'm going to touch up this piece to keep her in good working order for the next 120 years. Nothing crazy, just a proper full body de-rusting and re-blueing. I will also replace a missing sight elevator, with a historically correct replica and take her out hunting like she was meant to until my son is ready to take it from me.
 
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Sounds like you have done your homework! Yeah, Winchester didn’t start using the Winchester Definitive Proof Mark (the WP in oval proofs) on the barrels and frames which you found until May 1905. I remember really digging into the research the same way you did with my first Winchester, a hybrid 1892/53, to try to figure out what the hell I had. That was the beginning of the addiction. I know Brad (dealt with him on a survey of Winchester 1894 sights he was working on) and Rob (bought from him and he helped me join WACA away back), I should pick up that book. Did you order it off the WACA site or is it available elsewhere?
Matt
 
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Do nothing to the wood and only keep a little oil or rust preventative on the metal. You can clean the bore and oil it. Then keep it dry and continue to let it age.
 
The Winchester Model 1895 book (Last of the classic lever actions) is available from Wet Dog Publications, Greensboro North Carolina. I have had mine for a couple weeks but just started to read it and I am impressed with the knowledge available.
 
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