I would buy a non-restricted, legal "FAL" for $____ amount...

[H Wally]

I'm curious. If people could get an FAL looking rifle, in 7.62x39 caliber, looking fairly authentic, what would you pay?

To be clear, we're talking a semi auto functioning 7.62x39 caliber rifle that matches appearance closely and uses many of the parts of an L1A1 to look like an FN FAL or other derivatives. It would be non restricted as well.

Keep in mind - the less it costs, the less work goes into it and the less it looks like an FAL.

EDIT: I only have plans for individual builds. I would likely pass on my info and plans to a larger company with better support and machinery if it has potential to go really big.

 

[nemesys]

meh - get it light and have ergonomic controls with the ability to use AK mags and I think you'd have a winner

 

[greentips]

The thing must work. if you are using your buyers as beta testers to iron out your design deficiencies and manufacturing bugs, you will be doomed like some other and got rolled over by the crowd.

 

[Lawrence D]

This is the way I see it. XCR is around 2K, AR180B is around 1K. For a relyable FAL I would pay more than a grand. I would have liked it better if it was 7.62mm NATO instead of Russian but that would foul up the legal ownership issues. I would consider getting the PARA model and the L1A1 if this becomes true.

 

[Armedsask]

I hope you plan to do more than just change caliber to get it non-restricted.

 

[Paul Morrison]

I would pay 1200$ if it was unrestricted.

 

[Curtton]

interesting clone project ... canadian ingenuity at work .

 

[Polyshot]

How' bout we ask IMBEL to make the semi 7.62mmX39 version of their MD-97?

http://world.guns.ru/assault/as84-e.htm

Sure it looks like a FAL but it use rotary-locking bolt instead of tilt-locking so makes it not a variant of FAL, then we might have a chance to see it on the store shelves......

Just wondering what's the export policy of Brazil and IMBEL regarding on selling such weapon to the civvies.....

EDIT: I just learn that IMBEL makes the .22LR version of their FAL/MD-97 as well .........

http://www.imbel.gov.br/index.php?centro=produto&id_categoria=2&lang=en

 

[Armedsask]

Damn, I want an Imbel in .223 and .308!

Edit: no chance, stright from the site:

The Light Automatic Rifle - FAL is a weapon of international acceptance owed your exceptional characteristics, already proven in the most several combat conditions.
It was projected and manufactured with objective of equipping the soldier with a weapon that has maneability, safety and simplicity maintenance and operation.

 

[b-wingpilot]

Sorry to sound like an a$$hole, but why bother asking now? IF you plan on going ahead with this, then it would probably be at least 2-3 years before you had a legal firing firearm. Believe me, taking an existing gun and re-designing the internals (or even if you take the internals from another non-rest gun) is not a walk in the park, let alone if you want to mass produce it and ensure that there are no faults.

What ever happened to your other ground-up, non-restricted .308 project?

 

[H Wally]

meh - get it light and have ergonomic controls with the ability to use AK mags and I think you'd have a winner

My goal is to make it as close to an FAL in appearances as possible, so large changes aren't likely, as the purpose isn't a new kind of rifle, but a FAL lookalike. Also, wouldn't CZ 858 mags make more sense? I haven't seen ak mags in person... ever.

The thing must work. if you are using your buyers as beta testers to iron out your design deficiencies and manufacturing bugs, you will be doomed like some other and got rolled over by the crowd.

Yep, just getting an idea if there's interest. I'm making one or three for myself, but I'm wondering if I should contemplate offering these to other people.

This is the way I see it. XCR is around 2K, AR180B is around 1K. For a relyable FAL I would pay more than a grand. I would have liked it better if it was 7.62mm NATO instead of Russian but that would foul up the legal ownership issues. I would consider getting the PARA model and the L1A1 if this becomes true.

Interesting perspective. The idea I have would allow for para if someone could dig up para parts to work with. For the time being though, I think one design is the way to go for now. If I get something that is fully cleared with the CFC at the end, then I'll be able to contemplate variations.

I hope you plan to do more than just change caliber to get it non-restricted.

No worries on that - I can't own prohibs and I don't go to the range a lot, so I am trying for non restricted for myself, and definitely non restricted if I'm going to try to market it.

I would pay 1200$ if it was unrestricted.

I like the sound of that

Sorry to sound like an a$$hole, but why bother asking now? IF you plan on going ahead with this, then it would probably be at least 2-3 years before you had a legal firing firearm. Believe me, taking an existing gun and re-designing the internals (or even if you take the internals from another non-rest gun) is not a walk in the park, let alone if you want to mass produce it and ensure that there are no faults.

What ever happened to your other ground-up, non-restricted .308 project?

Good question actually. It's because I'm doing this for myself to begin with. I'm going to make at least one or more just for my own fun. Since they're already being made, I thought I may as well see if there's any interest, and how much there is. If I went headfirst and spent a rediculously long time designing and planning all aspects of the gun and discovered that my market wasn't interested, it would be a pretty firm boot to the groin.

What ever happened to your other ground-up, non-restricted .308 project?

It has evolved

 

[stencollector]

For those with cash to burn, the FN CAL is restricted only. Unfortunately, most or all of them that were built in semi automatic were sent to the US. Doubtful one could get an export permit for one these days.

I saw one for sale on gunbroker (or one of the gun auction sites) the other week. It was in the $8-10K range if I recall.

 

[b-wingpilot]

Ok, you seem new to this so I'm going to give you plenty of advise. Firstly, do you have any machinist experience (formal or even self taught)? If you don't and you plan on building this rifle yourself then you're in for a world of disappointment. Operating a mill, a lathe, welding/brazing, heat treating are all skills that take time to learn and more time to do well. Even if you can do all of these things well, making an entire gun is not easy. Just ask Armedsask, it took him a long time just to make (not necessarily design) a receiver using a different type of material and manufacturing process and he had formal machinist training (I think). Dealing with the CFC can be pretty challenging too.

From my experience heres a few tips to help you along:
*Do NOT assume that once the design is done that the manufacturing will be easy. If you have no machinist experience than chances are that your design will be junk. You always have to keep in mind how you are going to make a piece that you designed (can an endmill fit in there? do I need a jig to get that done? etc.)

*You will probably spend more time making tools/jigs to make the firearm parts than you will actually making the parts. Keep this in mind.

*It takes a very long time for the design/build process. Best to have a few projects on the go so that you don't become enraged at a single project from constantly thinking/building it.

*Making 1 is alot of effort; making a few more along with the first is very easy. Make sure to produce a few extras in case of screw ups.

*Start small then work your way up. Perhaps you should have a go at making an existing design first, then if you want to make something of your own design start with a subgun as those usually are more forgiving than a rifle.

There you have it. Best of luck, the more rifles out there, the better.

 

[pitdogboy]

$1200 ish for me . prefer .308 though

 

[Armedsask]

Just ask Armedsask, it took him a long time just to make (not necessarily design) a receiver using a different type of material and manufacturing process and he had formal machinist training (I think).

Actually, once the design was done (which took years of off and on work), it didn't really take that long to actually build. Finding time to work on it was the biggest problem. Of course there were screw ups and design flaws that had to be fixed. As for formal training, it was actually built while at trade school using the school's manual mills, hence the trouble finding time to work on it.

Plan to make at least two rifles. You WILL #### up the first one, be it from manufacture screw ups or just from bad design.

Dealing with the CFC can be pretty challenging too.

I built that receiver 2 years ago, called CFC, submitted pictures for verification, did all the work to have it registered and never heard from them again.

 

[H Wally]

Ok, you seem new to this so I'm going to give you plenty of advise. Firstly, do you have any machinist experience (formal or even self taught)? If you don't and you plan on building this rifle yourself then you're in for a world of disappointment. Operating a mill, a lathe, welding/brazing, heat treating are all skills that take time to learn and more time to do well. Even if you can do all of these things well, making an entire gun is not easy. Just ask Armedsask, it took him a long time just to make (not necessarily design) a receiver using a different type of material and manufacturing process and he had formal machinist training (I think). Dealing with the CFC can be pretty challenging too.

From my experience heres a few tips to help you along:
*Do NOT assume that once the design is done that the manufacturing will be easy. If you have no machinist experience than chances are that your design will be junk. You always have to keep in mind how you are going to make a piece that you designed (can an endmill fit in there? do I need a jig to get that done? etc.)

*You will probably spend more time making tools/jigs to make the firearm parts than you will actually making the parts. Keep this in mind.

*It takes a very long time for the design/build process. Best to have a few projects on the go so that you don't become enraged at a single project from constantly thinking/building it.

*Making 1 is alot of effort; making a few more along with the first is very easy. Make sure to produce a few extras in case of screw ups.

*Start small then work your way up. Perhaps you should have a go at making an existing design first, then if you want to make something of your own design start with a subgun as those usually are more forgiving than a rifle.

There you have it. Best of luck, the more rifles out there, the better.

Thanks for the advice! What I am planning however, is not nearly so complicated - I'm just not talking about the design because I want one finished, working, and ready to roll before I actually say anything outright. At the moment I'm about 1-2 weeks of evening fiddling and working away from submitting it to the CFC. I made a flintlock of my own design when I was 15 that used an old smoothbore barrel, and have goodness knows how many other projects going at the moment as well, so if I hit a roadblock in this, I can go find the ross parts and finish that project... which will require cleaning the house

$1200 ish for me . prefer .308 though

Unfortunately I looked at .308, but there was nothing I could work with there. If I eventually got in correspondance with a larger more competent company I bet they might be able to handle it.

Actually, once the design was done (which took years of off and on work), it didn't really take that long to actually build. Finding time to work on it was the biggest problem. Of course there were screw ups and design flaws that had to be fixed. As for formal training, it was actually built while at trade school using the school's manual mills, hence the trouble finding time to work on it.

Plan to make at least two rifles. You WILL f**k up the first one, be it from manufacture screw ups or just from bad design.


I built that receiver 2 years ago, called CFC, submitted pictures for verification, did all the work to have it registered and never heard from them again.

I have a lot of time to plan. I have all the machines and tools I need at home and have been using them since I was six and my dad let me into the shop.

 

[RevolverRodger]

I'd go with a HK G3 look alike

 

[UCSPanther]

I prefer one in .308 winchester and can take FN FAL, H&K g3 or M14 mags, and am willing to pay up $1000 for one, provided it is legal and non-restricted.

 

[cote_b]

7.62 x 39 would be ok, but Id rather have it in .308.

 

[UCSPanther]

Maybe some wood grips and a FAL-style flashider so it at least resembles a C1.