IMR 4198 for 223

A

Anpaul

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Disclaimer: new reloader here.

I'm just starting to reload 223 and picked up 5 lbs of D4198 from CanAm. Loaded 50 rounds today with 55Gr Campro projectiles in 1 grain increments from 17-21 grains. None of the loads would reliably cycle my ACR with only 21grs ejecting brass intermittently.

4198 seems to be divisive in 223, with some swearing by it and others hating it.

I've got 5lbs if the stuff and it would make a great cheap load if I could get it to cycle reliably.

Any pointers? Lost cause and I should be looking at alternatives?
 
I read 4198 is fast burning so less than ideal in AR.

Probably your best bet is to stick it in the EE and get something more suitable for your setup.

I really wanted that D4198 to be good for AR so I could make some cheap plinking .223, but everything I've read says it's not the right choice. Or not worth the hassle even if you can get it to work.
 
In a Speer manual MAX load is 22gr for the 55gr bullet and IMR 4198..........may not be in your gun with this powder.Harold
 
4198 is a great powner for 223 BUT it's fast burning and the pressure curve can be less then ideal in self loading rifles. You may find you will have to load at or close to max to get your rifle to cycle reliably. Accuracy may be less then ideal at that load.
 
4198 works fine in one of my ARs (16" bbl) but short strokes in another (20" bbl). For 55gr bullet loads, I would go with H355 in an AR15. 4198 works really good in a bolt action .223 though.
 
4198 is my go to .223 powder. I load 20.5 ish grains of powder behind all sorts of 55g pills and never had a problem. I use a Dillon 550 progressive press and just throw the powder so it's not perfect but good enough for the thousands of rounds I make a year.
I have used this load out of bolt action, mini 14, and Robinson Arms .223's and never had a problem.

I must admit I have never fed these rounds to an AR and the Robinson gas block was adjustable but .Maybe your option is to get an adjustable gas block for the AR if you want to stick with this powder.
 
Odd. I used to shoot Hornady 50gr & 55gr SXSP's using IMR 4198 out of my SP1 with not issues (granted this was 30yrs ago).
Try a different powder. See if that does anything.
Hornady manual does not show IMR 4198 for use in AR type platforms.
 
Check your gas regulator setting, you should see a U when looking down from the top. S is the suppressed setting and will bleed more pressure off.
What barrel is on your ACR?
My ACR has cycled everything I've fed it, some shoots well some does not but it all cycles.
 
maybe try working up in 0.2gr increments with a chrony until you're in the 3000-3100 fps range from a 16" barrel.

Code: 
Cartridge          : 5.56 mm NATO
Bullet             : .224, 55, Hornady FMJ-BT w/c 2267
Useable Case Capaci: 28.626 grain H2O = 1.859 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.260 inch = 57.40 mm
Barrel Length      : 16.0 inch = 406.4 mm
Powder             : IMR 4198

Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 1.0% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !

Step    Fill. Charge   Vel.  Energy   Pmax   Pmuz  Prop.Burnt B_Time
 %       %    Grains   fps   ft.lbs    psi    psi      %        ms

-10.0   89    21.06   2816     968   44954  10050     98.7    0.839
-09.0   90    21.29   2843     987   46290  10139     98.9    0.827
-08.0   91    21.53   2869    1006   47661  10225     99.2    0.816
-07.0   92    21.76   2896    1024   49072  10306     99.3    0.806
-06.0   93    22.00   2923    1043   50505  10384     99.5    0.795
-05.0   94    22.23   2949    1062   52012  10459     99.6    0.785
-04.0   95    22.46   2975    1081   53544  10529     99.8    0.775  ! Near Maximum !
-03.0   96    22.70   3002    1100   55118  10594     99.9    0.765  ! Near Maximum !
-02.0   97    22.93   3028    1120   56729  10657     99.9    0.755  ! Near Maximum !
-01.0   98    23.17   3054    1139   58379  10714    100.0    0.745  ! Near Maximum !
+00.0   99    23.40   3079    1158   60072  10768    100.0    0.736  ! Near Maximum !
+01.0  100    23.63   3105    1177   61812  10817    100.0    0.727  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
 
Anpaul said:
The ACR had a Questar barrel and was on the U setting when. For good measure, I also tried S and it wasn't even close.
Click to expand...

Mine has a Questar barrel, cycles everything I've fed it so far.
PM me if you want some help with the rifle, I've done a lot of work on them.
Regarding the 4198, I use it in my 36gr 223 loads for my bolt action varmint rifle but for heavier projectiles I use CFE223 and a few other powders a little slower than 4198.

This is a good read and has load data specifically for loading for a semi auto
https://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&sour...uB7JZr9D6BQcsBiRw&sig2=S8sx2rOpJSvTUBy0W1V6fQ
 
todbartell said:
maybe try working up in 0.2gr increments with a chrony until you're in the 3000-3100 fps range from a 16" barrel.

Code: 
Cartridge          : 5.56 mm NATO
Bullet             : .224, 55, Hornady FMJ-BT w/c 2267
Useable Case Capaci: 28.626 grain H2O = 1.859 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.260 inch = 57.40 mm
Barrel Length      : 16.0 inch = 406.4 mm
Powder             : IMR 4198

Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 1.0% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !

Step    Fill. Charge   Vel.  Energy   Pmax   Pmuz  Prop.Burnt B_Time
 %       %    Grains   fps   ft.lbs    psi    psi      %        ms

-10.0   89    21.06   2816     968   44954  10050     98.7    0.839
-09.0   90    21.29   2843     987   46290  10139     98.9    0.827
-08.0   91    21.53   2869    1006   47661  10225     99.2    0.816
-07.0   92    21.76   2896    1024   49072  10306     99.3    0.806
-06.0   93    22.00   2923    1043   50505  10384     99.5    0.795
-05.0   94    22.23   2949    1062   52012  10459     99.6    0.785
-04.0   95    22.46   2975    1081   53544  10529     99.8    0.775  ! Near Maximum !
-03.0   96    22.70   3002    1100   55118  10594     99.9    0.765  ! Near Maximum !
-02.0   97    22.93   3028    1120   56729  10657     99.9    0.755  ! Near Maximum !
-01.0   98    23.17   3054    1139   58379  10714    100.0    0.745  ! Near Maximum !
+00.0   99    23.40   3079    1158   60072  10768    100.0    0.736  ! Near Maximum !
+01.0  100    23.63   3105    1177   61812  10817    100.0    0.727  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Click to expand...

Quickload defaults to the lowest case capacity of a given cartridge and tells you to measurer the capacity of a case fired in your rifle.

The difference between the default capacity and the majority of .223/5.56 capacity of 30.+ of H2O is 6,000 psi "LOWER". Meaning the chamber pressure and velocity in your chart above is is much higher than actual.

On top of this you need a chronograph and change the burn rate in Quickload until it matches your chronograph velocity to get accurate pressure and velocity readings.

LjAQ7L9.jpg


I ran this through Quickload to see what would happen if using mixed brass in my AR15 with 25.0 grains of H335 and the chamber pressure varied 6,000 psi between 28.0 and 30.6 case capacity. And as you can see in the chart above American made brass runs between 30.1 to 30.6 and the chamber pressure you posted will be much lower.

Bottom line, you "must" adjust/tweek Quickload to get accurate information. And the smaller the case and its capacity the more it will effect chamber pressure.
 
Last edited:
Anpaul said:
Disclaimer: new reloader here.

I'm just starting to reload 223 and picked up 5 lbs of D4198 from CanAm. Loaded 50 rounds today with 55Gr Campro projectiles in 1 grain increments from 17-21 grains. None of the loads would reliably cycle my ACR with only 21grs ejecting brass intermittently.

4198 seems to be divisive in 223, with some swearing by it and others hating it.

I've got 5lbs if the stuff and it would make a great cheap load if I could get it to cycle reliably.

Any pointers? Lost cause and I should be looking at alternatives?
Click to expand...

In the reloading manuals I have I only found one that listed 4198 for service rifle loads. And when first developed Remington used IMR-3031 for the 5.56 to give you an idea of the burn rate.

Bottom line when I put together my AR15 carbine I used the "mid length" gas system and not pound the rifle to death.

Charts below from http://www.ar15barrels.com/prod/operation.shtml
How the AR-15 Direct Impingement gas system works

223plot.gif


pressure-time.gif


Below tells you a great deal about using faster burning powders and port pressure.

Ganderite said:
Try 22 gr. If that won't cycle your are SOL.

It will depend on your rifle. My Norinco is over gassed and will run 20 gr perfectly. 3 other makes will not.
Click to expand...
 
I came back to this thread because I just found four 8 pound jugs of 4198 and since I don't shoot much cast bullets, I was looking for another use for it.

I use two ARs for CQB (223 at 35 yards). I don't need full power ammo, and both guns are over gassed, so down loading a bit calms the rifle down. Both cycle 100% at 17 gr, but I will load 18 gr just to be sure of cycling. That gives me about 12,000 rounds of powder. Better order some more bullets.

The 4198 I found is a short cut experiment from the days when I did such things. I never got around to using it, except for the jug I gave a bench rest shooter.
 
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