In the beginning... A beginners journey towards F-Class

[Major Sights]

This is a thread that I will update when need be (to avoid starting more threads, that could just be developed along into this one thread) and ask questions on and try to absorb as much as possible from fellow nuts. I will even include my basic lessons, that I learned along the way.

Starting out as a beginner in precision shooting is something that is easier said than done...

I started out by creating a thread "Help a beginner pick a kit." and got lots of great info. I also came across a great deal on the basic kit that I wanted and I scooped it up as the financials were on my side.

I picked the rifle up from a fellow nut and thus was the official start to my new hobby. The next day I picked up some low quality varmint ammo for my "new" Remington 700 SPS Tactical in .223. Thus my education began...

1. Pay attention to the little details...
I went out to the range for first time with the rifle and just could NOT hit paper...or even the 4x8 board that held the paper... then after almost all my ammo for the day was extinguished I remembered... "RIGHT!, Rifle scopes do not operate the same as my archery scopes!" Which the whole day before I had been shooting and playing around with...


2. Bulk ammo is not precision ammo...
after picking up a "battle pack" of 500 MFS 55g Mill spec .223 rounds, and shooting them off, I do not get very good consistency at longer ranges. However, this is good enough for me to practice my form and my trigger control at first, and while I only shoot 20-30 rounds per session and only 1-2 sessions a week I should be able to save up for a beginners reloading kit so that I may start tweaking my rounds to just the right flavor.
Results of shooting at 125 yards, the sheet says 100, but I wrote that before realizing that the grass at the 100y line was about 5 feet tall... I moved the target to a top of a small hill with much shorter grass.

3. Bore sighting at 25-30 yards makes life wonderful...
After a terrible first experience with my new rifle, I came here and did a search for some sighting in info, and came across the basic bore sight. Remove bolt, align bore on target, adjust scope to match. First shoot put me within 4inches of my target, which is much better because I was about 2.5 feet high at that distance...
Pic of my target at 30ish yards

5. While out in the sun shooting, wear a longer shirt and tuck it in....
Sometimes, I found, that while prone, and making small adjustments here and there, the back of my shirt rode up and who ever thinks to put sunscreen on their lower back...

6. SPS stock sucks...
I took apart my rifle completely while cleaning it after my second session, only to see that most of the stock is hollow, made of plastic, and flexes from the bipod pushing up... Can't wait to upgrade to something a little more firm, and cool looking +

7. Shooting bags are a must, at least a rear one!
was trying to punch holes at 150y with my setup and I found a hard time sticking on the X with only my bi-pod working... I created a make shift rear "bag" with what was available at the camp, was very Red Green...
Beginners shooting kit

8. Just as I had been told in my previous thread, UPGRADE the scope.
There is nothing wrong with my current scope but have seen some higher end scopes up close, I can instantly see the benefits of upgrading optics, I think I will skip the middle man and go straight to something that i shouldn't have up update as soon (Sightron or Night Force scope, with a MINIMUM of 20x with a 50mm objective lens with a good base, and rings to match)
Shot of down the scope and an overall shot

So far, these are my top lessons I have learned in my quest for farther shots, and tighter groups.

Any tips, hints, or advice is more then welcome.

 

[precisionshooter]

seem to be on the right track, just practice practice practice and soon enough you will be putting them threw the same hole

 

[bulldog284]

drop your front bypod down about 6 inchs and by yourself a good rear bag,

 

[maynard]

And buy yourself some good ear muffs.

 

[ultimate_monkey]

It's hard to tell but if in your last pic , your in the same position as you shoot your way to far off to the side. You want to be directly behind the rifle, the muzzle, stock, should and hip should form a straight line pointed directly pointed at your target. And your natural point of aim should be basically bang on where you want to shoot. If you find your POA to be say 12" to the left rather then twist you body
/ gun to get on target shuffle your whole body to the left maintaining that straight line threw it, keep shuffling around untill your within and inch or to of your target making sure to stay directly behind the rifle and keep that imaginary line straight!



Posted from iPhone

 

[Major Sights]

Couldn't really drop my bi-pod, I am kind of set up on a down hill slant, and having it that high gets the rifle level. But I know what you mean, I will not be setting up again in that exact location, it was just the best spot to sight in from at 30y, then I moved the target back and kept the same shooting position.

Ear muffs are on the list... but its only .223 and hardly notice the report of the rifle with my current buds.

My prone position, as I was taught as a youngster, was that I should form an angle to my rifle.

I will make the adjustment, and give it the ol' college try.

Thanks for info and suggestions all!

 

[ultimate_monkey]

the angle to the rifle is fine for smaller callibers. once you step up to a 308 or bigger (face it in the future u will every one does haha) being angled to the rifle will cause the rifle to hop and move right, consistantly pulling your shots. being stight behond the rifle will allow the weight of your body to absorb the recoil and allow for faster follow up shots which in long distance is key if your trying to get your shots off in a break of the wind etc.

as foolish as i think "online" training is, this video from snipers hide does a much better job of explaining things then i can over the computer

[youtube]u8rkt1HRWdo[/youtube]

 

[agent_mango]

I developed a sunburn just like that when I was helping to build a deck a few weeks ago!

 

[Major Sights]

I see, that makes lots of sense U_M, I will most definitely be changing my technique.



mango-yes,... it stings like hell, especially the closer to heat sources I get.... which is hard to avoid in a commercial kitchen...

 

[beltfed]

being angled to the rifle will cause the rifle to hop and move right, consistantly pulling your shots.

This isn't true. Inconsistant rifle/body position and follow through is the root cause. I use a slightly bladded prone and have no problems with recoil or pulling shots due to body position.

The key is natural alignment. If a position doesn't feel natural, don't use it - or work on it if you feel it is of benefit.

 

[Major Sights]

So I have some "fun" money coming in soon, and I was thinking of putting it towards some goodies for my rifle.

What would be more prudent at my point in my precision shooting career (about 12 days into it so far)

A jewel Trigger
or a Choate TACTICAL CUSTOM PACKAGE Stock?

A trigger is cheaper, and is an end cost, but if I go with a stock I still have to have it bedded (as any job I attempt to do WILL look like a$$ and I will never be happy with it) thus adding to the cost.

What would benefit me more at this point?

 

[CyaN1de]

What would benefit me more at this point?

Practice, practice and more practice.

I would be the first to say that the Jewel trigger is one of THE best investments I have ever made but it will not make YOU a good shooter.

Only you can make you a good shooter by getting as much trigger time as you can.

Before I even started shooting F-Class I was at the range 2-3+ times a week with my Tikka T3 SS pencil barrel .223 trying to get that "1 hole" group at 100, then 200, then 300. It was after this that I got sucked into the addiction of competitive shooting, and even then I had much to learn about reading conditions.


If I had to choose between a Choate stock and a Jewel trigger, I would buy the trigger and look for a different stock.

 

[Longshot]

This isn't true. Inconsistant rifle/body position and follow through is the root cause. I use a slightly bladded prone and have no problems with recoil or pulling shots due to body position.

The key is natural alignment. If a position doesn't feel natural, don't use it - or work on it if you feel it is of benefit.

I disagree.Natural alignment is correct however there is no such thing as natural body postion.They are 2 seperate entities.

Because you are naturally aligned doesn't mean your body position is correct.
If you take the top target rifle shooters,F classers and even the top military guys you will find that 99% of them are behind the gun insted of angled off like those little green plastic army men you had as a kid.

 

[rnbra-shooter]

That photo you posted is the classic old-fashioned military shooting position (body 45 degrees to the rifle barrel). One hardly sees that sort of position used nowadays. To be honest there are a great many different shooting positions that are used successfully by different shooters, so my advice would be to ask around for information on what good positions are, but realize that there is not "one correct way" to do it, there are in fact many different good ways to do it.

All other things being equal it is usually more comfortable to shoot from a lower position. Until you get a rear bag you can use your left hand as a support, either balled as a fist or holding the toe of the stock between your left thumb and your left index finger. This means the butt of the rifle will be nearly touching the ground -- adjust the height of your bipod to make this so.

Sometimes for various comfort reasons it is necessary to shoot from a higher than conventional or lower than conventional position (e.g. to get a comfortable head/neck angle, or face position on stock, etc). Nothing wrong with this.

I see you don't wear glasses (congrats ;-). If you can, it is a good idea to get into the habit of wearing safety glasses (whenever I shoot with contact lenses I use a pair of cheapass clear or yellow safety glasses). This is a precaution against the occasional pierced primer (which can blow gas and sometimes flecks of gunk back into your face).

Ear plugs or ear muffs are usually enough to reduce noise to a comfortable level. When I am competing or when I am doing serious load development or testing, I wear ear plugs and ear muffs - the reason for this is that it allows me to concentrate/focus better, and can help me shoot better shots.

If you are shooting with a stock with a flimsy fore-end, you can work around this by just being careful in your shooting position not to load up the rifle in a way that causes the barrel to touch the fore-end.

At some point you ought to start making your own ammo, both to make it cheaper as well as better. As soon as you do start making your own ammo, go straight to the very best match bullets you can get. There is very little price premium over crappo or mediocre bullets, and the bullet is by far the most important factor in making good ammo. Your shooting will improve much faster if you are using good ammo (e.g. how will you know what things about your trigger control is good or is bad, unless you are using really good ammo?)

A Jewell trigger is really nice. BUT. Factory Remington triggers can be adjusted to be very nice clean triggers. I would counsel against assuming that you need a light trigger in order to have a good trigger. After many years of assuming that, I eventually figured out that I can shoot really well with a properly adjusted factory trigger of decent quality (specific ones I have used and include in this statement are Win-70, Rem-700, Savage-110), set to the 2-4# range. A "clean" trigger is far more important than a light trigger.

 

[Major Sights]

Practice, practice, practice is already on my list of things in the works, in the 12 days I have had the rifle I have been to the range 5 times. My groupings are staying quite regular, and there are 2 things I notice.

Trigger pull is hard (but I can still adjust it down) and when trying to level my gun (left to right not front to back) I can see the stock flexing. Which led me to either of those options for upgrade.

Anyone else have some opinions? I would like as much advice as possible before doing anything.

 

[SouthPaw700]

You mentioned the Choate stock before. I've never tried the Tactical one, but I do like the Varmint stock. It comes with two cheek pieces so you can choose between low or high depending on how high your scope is mounted. Also, it has an aluminum bedding block, and the aluminum goes right to the end of the forearm in the stock, so it's very rigid. Some people think it might be heavy for a hunting rifle, but would be fine for prone shooting. Plus you can get one at a very reasonable price and they are guaranteed for life.

Don't get me wrong, Macmillan, Manners, Robertson etc are really wonderful stocks, but not everyone can't afford $700-1200 for a stock on their first f-class rifle.

 

[Major Sights]

Don't get me wrong, Macmillan, Manners, Robertson etc are really wonderful stocks, but not everyone can't afford $700-1200 for a stock on their first f-class rifle.

Hmmm I haven't seen the Varmint one yet, but will look into it.

I'm sure I could afford that but this will always be my "cheaper" "F-class" rifle. As soon as I get my basics of shooting down (with limited upgraded gear) and been working on my reloading skills, I will be purchasing a .308 rifle (or maybe some other cool caliber) to actually start (with any luck) competing with. I don't expect to be at that level for another year or so. I am treating this .223 as a Training device and as a for fun shooter.

 

[ultimate_monkey]

skip the trigger and look for a decent stock.. the stock trigger in the hands of a compitant gun smiith can be worked down to about 1-1.5lbs and crisp. i was in the same boat about my 700 trigger untill i talked to Dennis (guntech) he did my trigger and at 1/4 of the cost of an after market i couldnt be happier...

the sps stock is garbage, i really dont know what remmington would even bother putting it on there rifles...

to save a little $ i would creep the EE for a take off stock from another 700, a few models came with hs precission stocks. My buddy has an sps in .308 after ditching the stock, he probably cut 1/3rd off the groups he was shooting,

 

[beltfed]

I disagree.Natural alignment is correct however there is no such thing as natural body postion.They are 2 seperate entities.

Because you are naturally aligned doesn't mean your body position is correct.
If you take the top target rifle shooters,F classers and even the top military guys you will find that 99% of them are behind the gun insted of angled off like those little green plastic army men you had as a kid.

I hear what you're saying. I certainly don't suggest the 30 or so degrees as illustrated. I guess to put it in different terms, I wouldn't recommend a shooter adopts a position or style based on what someone tells them alone - some things they need to figure out on their own. Absolutely take advise and direction from skilled shooters, but don't be shy with doing some experimentation if something is not working.

+2 "rnbra-shooter" - you summed up my thoughts nicely.

 

[Obtunded]

I disagree.Natural alignment is correct however there is no such thing as natural body postion.They are 2 seperate entities.

Because you are naturally aligned doesn't mean your body position is correct.
If you take the top target rifle shooters,F classers and even the top military guys you will find that 99% of them are behind the gun insted of angled off like those little green plastic army men you had as a kid.

I guess I'm in the 1% group...