Iron Sight vs. Scope

Donster 125

Donster 125

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Well I took the advice that you all gave me and started shopping around for my first rifle, a .22. The guy at the store seemed very knowledgeable and recommend the .22 Savage for accurate beginner shooting (plus i confessed my fear of loaded rifles, so i wont go over a .22 anyway). The gun has a bull barrel, stainless steel furniture, laminated wood stock and is a bolt action. You can sere the gun and its specs here:
93r17BTVS.jpg


Here is my dilemma. The gun doesn't have any iron sights. Just Picatinny scope mounts. I am all for using a scope, but i want advice from the pros first. Basically:

Should i learn to shoot with a scope first or with iron sights first? Or does it really matter?

I would love to hear your advice. I am a total novice to shooting. If any of you have a better recommendation for a first rifle, please say so! :)

Regards,

D 125
 
I would say both.... If you want to shoot irons, that probably isnt the best .22lr (i don't think it is dovetailed receiver for diopter (iron) sights...)
That said there are some iron sights out there that would work, but it would be a big pain in the but to find some...

Best bet is to buy yourself a scope and start shooting. Once you have gotten comfortable, buy another .22 with irons included off the EE.

Take them both to the range and have fun!
 
I'd get a new rifle that has good iron sights and use it that way for awhile, you can always add a scope later and with the right rings, can be taken off and put back on easily. There are many instances in hunting where one is better off with iron sights, and other times where a scope is best. Alot has to do with the kind of hunting/shooting you do, hunt open areas for pronghorn? A scope is best...hunt for bear over bait? Iron sights may be best.
I'd suggest that a new shooter would do well to learn to use a good peep sight, often groups are just as good as with a scope.
 
Here's a suggestion. To learn trajectory, gravity, and windage, I suggest going and buying a cheap air rifle with iron sights. Here you can learn the basic physics involved for a cheap price. Many you can mount a scope too as well to see what you enjoy more.

You can therefore choose the gun without regrets. Also, as ben_hunchak stated, if you buy a firearm with iron sights and a scope mount, you can always buy a scope later and toss it on.

Enjoy!
 
This will be your first gun? Then buy a standard 10/22, use iron sights and shoot the hell out of it. Practice until you master basic shooting skills, then move up to something else.

A great training is to use Reduced targets. Don't be a schmoe, and learn basic shooting skills with ironsights.
 
firemachine69 said:
Buy the Savage, buy a cheap scope. You'll quickly find yourself wanting better optics, you have been forewarned now!
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And you'll never fully understand basic shooting skills because you don't even know what it's like to shoot with iron sights... :rolleyes: Scopes are just a crutch. Well, of course you need them for extended ranges, but you won't learn basics skills as efficiently as with iron sight.


That said, you're the one who really knows what you want inside. So get it, whatever it is, and shoot the heck out of it. The more time you pass behind the trigger, the better it is. (well, some ways are better than others, but still......)
 
I started with a scope. My third and fourth rifle purchases relied on iron sights, and my latest acquisition is scoped again.


Read any basic "how-to" guide, provided you're shooting under a hundred yards (to offset parallax), you can "learn" the fundamentals just as easily with irons as with scopes, and vice-versa.
 
As long as you use a low powered scope, then you won't really be inhibited in learning by using optics. Optics that are too strong are very distracting, even for experienced shooters because you can end up concentrating on the wiggling sight picture, instead of on the fundamentals. Breathing, stance, trigger control.

I'd suggest a fixed power scope, 4x. Variable power scopes tend to encourage knob-fiddling, and besides, fixed power optics are much clearer and more durable at every price point. Leupold's FX series are very good, and also affordable.

Get a rifle that appeals to you for your first one, and shoot the hell out of it. If it's not fun first and foremost, it will be hard to stick with the discipline later should you decide to get serious.

That looks like a lovely rifle you've picked out there, enjoy it in good health.
 
hrmmm thanks for all the responses guys, but i am getting conflicting messages. Let me rephrase this:

What is the most accurate .22 with iron sights?
 
Everything else being equal, a scope will yeild more accuracy.

"plus i confessed my fear of loaded rifles, so i wont go over a .22 anyway"

Don't let the number fool you, a .22 can be just as deadly as a .30, .40, or .50.

None are have reason to fear, but all will ultimately demand respect.

"What is the most accurate .22 with iron sights?"

Accuracy is an end result from a combination of gun, load, shooter and conditions. All have to align to produce accuracy. I don't believe there is anything as "most accurate."
 
GSoD said:
Everything else being equal, a scope will yeild more accuracy.

"plus i confessed my fear of loaded rifles, so i wont go over a .22 anyway"

Don't let the number fool you, a .22 can be just as deadly as a .30, .40, or .50.

None are have reason to fear, but all will ultimately demand respect.

"What is the most accurate .22 with iron sights?"

Accuracy is an end result from a combination of gun, load, shooter and conditions. All have to align to produce accuracy. I don't believe there is anything as "most accurate."
Click to expand...

very true on the danger part. what i meant by a .22 is that as far as firearms go, its a good starter. i dont think a first shooter should start with a .300 WM. baby steps.

You are absolutely correct on the accuracy thing. what i should have said, and it was my error so i apologize, is that the Savage i mentioned had a heavy barrel which makes it more accurate. Do they make a heavy barreled .22 with iron sights? i have seen thin barreled .22s, but when i handled them, they seemed to be of inferior quality.
 
"...Scopes are just a crutch..." Nonsense. A scope is just a sight that allows you to see the target better. That allows you to place the shot more accurately. However, it will not make a poor shooting rifle shoot better(doesn't apply to the Savage) nor will it take the place of good technique. Breathing, trigger control and good ammo still apply. The sight picture is far easier, of course. Does take some getting used to as ever twitch of your body will be seen through the scope. You can watch your heart beat on a good day. They add some weight too.
Don't buy a cheap scope. A bit over $100 will buy a reasonably good one. The rings will run another $30 to $40. Plus $30 to mount a scope. Likely bore sighted. At Epp's.
Having iron sight installed on that Savage will require a visit to a smithy. That won't be cheap. Epp's smithy, for example, wants $75 to drill and tap the holes plus the cost of the sights. Another $100 or so.
"...my fear of loaded rifles..." Inanimate object, you control.
 
I don't think starting out with a bench rifle is such a great idea, heavy barrel and thumb hole stock like that aren't very offhand(correct term?) friendly.

Just go and buy the standard Ruger 10/22. its rather cheap, and VERY customizable. Bunch of aftermarket stocks, barrels, triggers, etc. Like you said, baby steps, don't rush over and buy a big ass target rifle. You'll have more fun shooting a semi then a bolt action .22lr.

well...IMHO that is.
 
Donster 125 said:
hrmmm thanks for all the responses guys, but i am getting conflicting messages. Let me rephrase this:

What is the most accurate .22 with iron sights?
Click to expand...

Ahhhh.... a man after my own heart! Well, actually, the tightest rifles on the face of the earth are ironsighted, they're the ones used in the Olympic Games, and should you want to drop $5000 or more out of the gate, you can have one. There's a number of good manufacturers but the one below is representative

feinrifle.jpg


But if you want a very accurate ironsighted rifle at a more reasonable price, I'd suggest the Savage mark II-FVT. It comes with proper aperture sights. I've owned one for about a year and a half, and it's been very good value for my money. I'll probably replace the stock to one more suited to me, but that's not unusual.

MarkII-FVT.jpg


P.S. I don't agree with the ruger 10/22 idea. My gf has one, and I was disappointed with the rifle's accuracy. It was ok up to 25 yards but went all to hell at the 50 yard line. She likes it, but she's a more casual plinker, liking to knock pop cans around and whatnot.

I tried my buddy Nonus's target model and it's a nice rifle, but was merely satisfactory in the accuracy department and substantially more pricey than the FVT, and still has issues with feeding some brands of normal .22 fodder. We hadn't tried it with proper .22 match rimfire ammo, but I'd expect feeding issues to worsen with close tolerance match ammo.
butlercreekhisgun.jpg
 
My most accurate .22's also have very good peep sights on them, both are Martini action BSA rifles. They come avail. now and again, and my last Martini Cadet cost $250 and the bore is mint, all steel and wood, no plastic, great guns to learn accurate shooting with.
 
How good is your eyesight? If you have good eyes then you won't have any issues with iron sights, but if your eyesight has much to be desired then you might want to start off with a scope instead.

The best iron sights are useless if you can't see them.
 
Tudenom said:
How good is your eyesight? If you have good eyes then you won't have any issues with iron sights, but if your eyesight has much to be desired then you might want to start off with a scope instead.

The best iron sights are useless if you can't see them.
Click to expand...

i wear contacts. so long as i do (and i cant drive without them) i have perfect vision.
 
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