Is it me or does my gun not like my reloads?

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g3arhead

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So, I’m a newbie reloader. Currently loading up 308 win and 6.5 creedmoor. The 308 I’m shooting out of is a TikkaT3 Battue. I’m looking to develop my own hunting loads, with cup/core bullets and N140. I use CCI BR2 primers. Federal cases.

I’ve tried Speer 150 and 165gn Hot-cor, Hornady Interlock 150. Every group is 1.5ish in or greater. I’ve also shot 5 shot groups (3 times) to add more to the sample size.

The gun is capable of a .4in group with factory Sako 150gn hunting ammo.

With the 6.5 Creed I’m shooting this out of a Weatherby Vanguard. No hunting loads; Barnes Match Burner 120gn with N555, Sako cases and white river primers . Groups are sub MOA.

Question is, what am I doing wrong with the 308? Am I just #### at reloading ?

Or is this more so, my gun being picky about bullets ?
 
my best advice, is to work out a few 5 round loads. Keep everything consistent but step up and down the powder charges by 0.5 grains. break out a chrono and record velocities and group sizes for each 5 round group. Also, shoot off of a lead sled or similar.

Graph out the data and find your nodes. that is going to help with your grouping and accuracy more than anything. Once you find the node, start adjusting the powder charge by 0.1 grains, rinse and repeat until you drill into the frequency your barrel harmonizes with.

If you want, PM me, and I can try and figure out a load that your rifle should like. I have discovered a system that works really well, and I have a hard time explaining it, but it's worked every time for me in getting me pretty close to finding that frequency balance.
 
g3arhead said:
So, I’m a newbie reloader. Currently loading up 308 win and 6.5 creedmoor. The 308 I’m shooting out of is a TikkaT3 Battue. I’m looking to develop my own hunting loads, with cup/core bullets and N140. I use CCI BR2 primers. Federal cases.

I’ve tried Speer 150 and 165gn Hot-cor, Hornady Interlock 150. Every group is 1.5ish in or greater. I’ve also shot 5 shot groups (3 times) to add more to the sample size.

The gun is capable of a .4in group with factory Sako 150gn hunting ammo.

With the 6.5 Creed I’m shooting this out of a Weatherby Vanguard. No hunting loads; Barnes Match Burner 120gn with N555, Sako cases and white river primers . Groups are sub MOA.

Question is, what am I doing wrong with the 308? Am I just #### at reloading ?

Or is this more so, my gun being picky about bullets ?
Click to expand...
could be picky with bullets/powder
my 7mm rem mag sure is
Haven't shot a lot of bolt gun .308 but I know that my semi auto match rifles are certainly fussy about what bullets peak performance is achieved with and i've put many thousands of rounds downrange with those.
 
Could be a reamer thing too. I had a 6.5 creed that hated Berger 140 gr hybrids but absolutely loved hornady ELDM 140 gr. same powder charge and everything
 
Have you tried other powders with the 308? Did you do a “ladder” type test? Have you tried sitting your bullet out or in( do you know where is your land for each bullet? Do you have a chronograph?
Do you use some good rests?
Seems like you know how to shoot since you can get good results with the 6.5! And look like the rifle can shoot well with factory ammo… so it has to be the powder sitting depth combination.
 
Ditch the Federal cases & test with some of the Sako cases, or spring for better quality brass. Doesn't always make a massive difference, but I'm confident you'll see at least some improvement with better brass.
 
g3arhead said:
I’ve tried Speer 150 and 165gn Hot-cor, Hornady Interlock 150.
Click to expand...

Those are all flat base. Have you tried boat tails? Try a Hornady 150gr SST maybe?

I find, and this is only my opinion from personal preference and not 'scientifically' checked, that flat base are best on lighter bullets where the length engaging the rifling is short (by having flat base over boat tail there is just a fraction more touching the rifling). I've reloaded a large number of .308 bullets from 110gr to 220gr and I have only reloaded flat base with great success in 125gr or less.
 
g3arhead said:
Question is, what am I doing wrong with the 308?
Click to expand...
First thing you need to figure out is how deep to seat the bullets. You are likely loading to a COAL which is not the thing to do. Get a bullet seating depth tool / gauge and figure out where the lands of your rifle are and then look at the bullet and case to see how close to the lands you can seat. I'd suggest 0.020" to 0.050" off the lands.

Then look at your sizing operation and make sure you are not over sizing the case.

You will also want to measure muzzle velocity to see how fast and how consistent the velocities are. This can be a function of the powder type and how you are metering it but it can also be a function of the load density (how much of the case is filled by the powder). A very low load density can cause wild velocity swings depending on how the powder sits in the case.

If you are currently using flat base bullets, stick with those. Boat-tails are way more difficult to get to shoot accurately.
 
DGY said:
Have you tried other powders with the 308? Did you do a “ladder” type test? Have you tried sitting your bullet out or in( do you know where is your land for each bullet? Do you have a chronograph?
Do you use some good rests?
Seems like you know how to shoot since you can get good results with the 6.5! And look like the rifle can shoot well with factory ammo… so it has to be the powder sitting depth combination.
Click to expand...
I've tried both N140 and also Varget. In terms of my rest, I have a front and rear Caldwell bag. I'd probably look into the Lead Sled in the future.
I do have a chrony (old school Pro DLX) . I should run more tests to make sure I'm not just being really inconsistent with the powder charges etc.

Regarding the factory Sako ammo, I haven't chrony'd it but the box posted is 2854fps, probably from a 24in? barrel.

I was really hoping the Speer Hot-Cor's would work, considering that I've read they're pretty effective on game and, well, they're cheap. If they're cheap, I get to practice shooting more of them!
 
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There was a time, not too long ago, where a 2 inch group at 100y was considered a good hunting load. These days, people expect more, and the reloading industry thrives on people chasing sub-MOA performance out of every rifle. It should be pointed out that things get substantially more challenging at the sub-MOA level, for both rifle and shooter.
Rather than going through laborious and expensive ladder tests, incremental powder charge trials, etc. I would suggest you try different bullets, and particularly different weights. Flat based bullets are easier to manufacture for concentricity etc, meaning that boat-tails often perform poorly unless they are match grade.
Your rifle should preferentially tune to a bullet weight . BTW - Having reloaded for 30 years, I have found that a good load will show promise right out of the gate.
Finally, I've never had much luck with Speer Hot-Cors, perhaps they are inexpensive for a reason.
 
Try different powders and bullet combinations
Primers too
I’ve had good luck with 308 using hornady or sierra bullets with cci LR primers and imr 4064 powder
Make a bunch of loads with small powder increments and do 5 round groups with each until you find the best group, then you can fine tune from there
Sometimes it takes a bit of testing to find that right load but it’s worth it
Don’t go for “max” loads either, I’ve found the hotter loads usually never group as well as a milder once
A deer isn’t gonna know the difference between a few hundred fps
 
Do not use a LEAD 💩 SLED ! You shoot good groups with your 6.5 CM - you said . So your shooting habits are prob pretty good - decent ! 👍

The 308 Win is usually very easy to get to shoot Well ! N140 - Varget - TAC - H4895 - IMR4064 are all good 308 powders

Even the Bullets you are using should get you inside a inch with 3 shots IF your brass is sized properly and your COAL is correct 👍

You may have a rifle or scope problem ?

Just a few thoughts 🤷‍♂️😊
 
Last edited:
Deathrawt said:
Try different powders and bullet combinations
Primers too
I’ve had good luck with 308 using hornady or sierra bullets with cci LR primers and imr 4064 powder
Make a bunch of loads with small powder increments and do 5 round groups with each until you find the best group, then you can fine tune from there
Sometimes it takes a bit of testing to find that right load but it’s worth it
Don’t go for “max” loads either, I’ve found the hotter loads usually never group as well as a milder once
A deer isn’t gonna know the difference between a few hundred fps
Click to expand...
Funny for me most of the time my best groups are close to max loads!
 
remington jim said:
Do not use a LEAD 💩 SLED ! Youn shoot good groups with your 6.5 CM - you said . So your shooting habits are prob pretty good - decent ! 👍

The 308 Win is usually very easy to get to shoot Well ! N140 - Varget - TAC - H4895 - IMR4064 are all good 308 powders

Even the Bullets you are using should get you inside a inch with 3 shots IF your brass is sized properly and your COAL is correct 👍

You may have a rifle or scope problem ?

Just a few thoughts 🤷‍♂️😊
Click to expand...
I agree lead sleds are not the way to go!
 
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