Is this case annealed enough?

[Munkey1973]

From left to right...

First, is an un-annealed case
Second, is a case that has been induction annealed for 4.5 seconds
Third, is case that has been induction annealed for slightly longer at approx. 4.75 seconds

I put a bead of 750 F Tempilaq on the 3rd case for illustration. They say that it is supposed to liquify when it hits the ideal temp (i.e. 750 Fahrenheit).
But it never really liquifies for me.... it goes from dry-chalky blue and then runs just a little bit and turns black and burnt looking.
I've heard that Tempilaq should "turn into a clear liquid puddle."

The third case shows discolouration just below the body-shoulder junction and I think this is where I want to be... the second case only has discolouration about half way down the shoulder.

I've used my homemade annealer for many years for F Class 223 Remington cases with ease... but it was free Federal cases so I did care if they were a bit "over done"

Now that I am using the more expensive 308 Lapua Palma brass, I don't want to cook the copper out of the alloy.

So....Does the 3rd case look to be about right to the senior and experienced annealers out there ?

 

[yodave]

I can tell you from experience that every make and lot of brass is different and that the color of the annealed brass has absolutely nothing to do with properly or improperly done cases, so visual inspections mean nothing.....

set your machine up, turn out the lights and hit the fire button, the neck/shoulder will just start to glow, for half a second, that is it, it is at that point in time that it is perfect, you will not see the glow in the light, when you do, it's to late.....set your timer in the dark and write the number down on your ammo box, everytime you anneal that brass use the same time on the switch.

oh......templilaqu should be applied to the inside of the neck, measure the heat transfer, the issue at hand is the induction heat is so rapid that you will go from clear to burnt in a quarter second, so once you get your results then up and down the time a couple tenths of a second until your happy

 

[Munkey1973]

I can tell you from experience that every make and lot of brass is different and that the color of the annealed brass has absolutely nothing to do with properly or improperly done cases, so visual inspections mean nothing.....

set your machine up, turn out the lights and hit the fire button, the neck/shoulder will just start to glow, for half a second, that is it, it is at that point in time that it is perfect, you will not see the glow in the light, when you do, it's to late.....set your timer in the dark and write the number down on your ammo box, everytime you anneal that brass use the same time on the switch.

oh......templilaqu should be applied to the inside of the neck, measure the heat transfer, the issue at hand is the induction heat is so rapid that you will go from clear to burnt in a quarter second, so once you get your results then up and down the time a couple tenths of a second until your happy

Thanks for your insight. Been slowly walking up the timer on some 308 range brass as rough test cases (turned the necks as I did with the good Lapua brass). I can set the timer in 0.005 second increments. Tried the lights off at 4.75 seconds and didn't see a glow. But I kinda regard that as OK. Not trying to disregard your advice, but I've read on other posts that if the cases glow at all, then they been over done.

Wonder if I can rent a "digital-lazer-type-temperature-reading-type-instrument" from home depot?
Oh, sorry I saw a picture of Trudeau on the news just now... had water-drink-box brain fart!

 

[yodave]

not sure what induction annealer your running, or what kind of coil/loop around your case, but I am 3.2-3.7 seconds on most lapua brass, lapua brass has very little color change when I zap it, where as remington and hornady brass have a very distinguished annealed look when done

 

[yodave]

you'll just see a flash of red, any more then the flash color change is to much

 

[Mystic Precision]

As already said, appearance is not a reliable indicator. I use welders crayon 650F. I rub it on the case body just below the shoulder junction. When it flashes off, I interpret that neck has reached the desired temp. I set my timer so the crayon flashes off just the annealer moves the case out of the flames. I rather be a hint under 'cooked' then over.

And it takes very little time to go over. Since there is no way to compare the energy of your system vs another, I suggest you use the temp stick as an indicator and get your timing sorted.

If you are using a Lee collet neck die and have enough neck clearance, you will feel the neck size down when it is annealed enough. Seating will also be even pressure.

I am not trying to make things factory orig... I just want it to be consistent.... and last a good many firings.

Good luck.

Jerry

 

[Munkey1973]

not sure what induction annealer your running, or what kind of coil/loop around your case, but I am 3.2-3.7 seconds on most lapua brass, lapua brass has very little color change when I zap it, where as remington and hornady brass have a very distinguished annealed look when done

I am running a custom made annealer that a good friend handed down to me after he down-sized from a house and went to a condo (and got out of reloading altogether). As you can see it not as ###y looking as a commercially made setup such as an AMP. While its ghetto and rough looking, but is 100% customizable (again I can adjust the timing down to 0.005 seconds). And it sure as sh#t does not cost as much as an AMP or an AMP mark 2 !

Think that I will practise to "walk-up" the timer on some expendable brass until I see that glow in the dark.... use that as a base line. Then maybe I will back the timer off say 5% just to play it safe. Practise this technique on some garbage brass until perfected the skill.... then I will "walk it up" on the good Lapua Palma brass.....

Thanks for the tip Yodave !!

 

[Munkey1973]

As already said, appearance is not a reliable indicator. I use welders crayon 650F. I rub it on the case body just below the shoulder junction. When it flashes off, I interpret that neck has reached the desired temp. I set my timer so the crayon flashes off just the annealer moves the case out of the flames. I rather be a hint under 'cooked' then over.

And it takes very little time to go over. Since there is no way to compare the energy of your system vs another, I suggest you use the temp stick as an indicator and get your timing sorted.

If you are using a Lee collet neck die and have enough neck clearance, you will feel the neck size down when it is annealed enough. Seating will also be even pressure.

I am not trying to make things factory orig... I just want it to be consistent.... and last a good many firings.

Good luck.

Jerry

Thanks Jerry.. I always value your advice. I have never heard of welder's crayon until you post just now. I will try and source some of that tomorrow and give that technique a try in addition to Yodave's.