I assume that's what we have here? SPorter versions....
The Carcano is actually a pretty nice handling firearm. Light and feels okay. I'm going to shoot it tomorrow.
I can't imagine they are worth much but what's a ballpark price?
K-31 and Carcano ?
- Thread starter Gatehouse
- Start date
I assume that's what we have here? SPorter versions....
The Carcano is actually a pretty nice handling firearm. Light and feels okay. I'm going to shoot it tomorrow.
I can't imagine they are worth much but what's a ballpark price?
Sportered Carcano looks very like the Cooey Carcano except that all which I have seen have double set-triggers and this ones has not. Check to see if the barrel has been bobbed and joined and you will know for sure.
Other rifle is a Schmitt-Rubin but looks to be the 1889 model or about that era. There are very accurate records of the Swiss serial numbers available, help you to date it as well.
Other rifle is a Schmitt-Rubin but looks to be the 1889 model or about that era. There are very accurate records of the Swiss serial numbers available, help you to date it as well.
Looks very much like Cooey Carcano that has had its stock reworked a bit.
I have seem these with the double set trigger altered to single trigger. Probably the DST gave problems and was altered.
If it is a Cooey Carcano, it will be 6.5x54 Mannlicher Schoenauer, not 6.5x52 Mannlicher Carcano. I have seen x52s fired in the x54 rifles. There is a headspace issue, and the primer will be really flattened.
I have seem these with the double set trigger altered to single trigger. Probably the DST gave problems and was altered.
If it is a Cooey Carcano, it will be 6.5x54 Mannlicher Schoenauer, not 6.5x52 Mannlicher Carcano. I have seen x52s fired in the x54 rifles. There is a headspace issue, and the primer will be really flattened.
I'll add that the Swiss 1889 is chambered for the 7.5x53.5 round and not the newer more common 7.5x55 round that is fired in the k31's.
So that being said it is not safe to fire 7.5x55 (gp11) surplus rounds as they are loaded to a way higher pressure then the old gp90 (7.5x53.5) rounds.
That 1889 Schmitt is purely a handloaders rifle. But they are quite accurate and take normal 30 cal bullets so making up ammo is pretty easy.
So that being said it is not safe to fire 7.5x55 (gp11) surplus rounds as they are loaded to a way higher pressure then the old gp90 (7.5x53.5) rounds.
That 1889 Schmitt is purely a handloaders rifle. But they are quite accurate and take normal 30 cal bullets so making up ammo is pretty easy.
When loading ammo for the Schmidt Rubin 1889 you can use standard GP11 brass a.k.a. 7.5x55 and not bother having to trim it down to 53.5mm, just not necessary. Load powder to to 80% of 7.5x55 max loads for whatever powder and bullet weight you are using. and use standard .308 jacket bullets to start reloading quickly.
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gunsaholic
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Winnipeg, Manitoba
I just picked up a model 1900 short rifle that was converted . I guess it's known as the 00/11. It still has the bolt with the locking lugs at the rear. I was advised not to shoot GP11 ammo through it although the previous owner shot GP11 and other off the shelf ammo through it with no issues. No one could tell me really what the modification consisted of.
I might be picking up an 1896/11 at the next gunshow in Longueuil, I thought initially that it was an 1889 but after looking at pictures of others it seems that it is an 1896/11 which was supposedly modified to shoot GP11 but I want to be sure. I guess if the lugs are at the front it's ok then?
gunsaholic
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Winnipeg, Manitoba
Below is info I just found regarding the conversion. Apparently the bolt was not replaced.
(from the net below)
It was determined that the 89/96 could easily be converted (Model 1889s could not) to handle the new cartridge by re-barreling the rifle.
1889/96s were converted to 1896.11s buy replacing or modifying the following:
A new barrel was added.
Already fitted the the barrel were new front and rear sights.
A pistol grip was grafted onto the stock of the rifle.
The new rifles were also fitted with 6rd magazines, similar to the 1889/1900 pattern magazine, minus the reinforcing ridge, although the magazine did include a bolt hold-open feature for when the magazine was empty.
A new trigger-guard was fitted to accommodate the new magazine.
(from the net below)
It was determined that the 89/96 could easily be converted (Model 1889s could not) to handle the new cartridge by re-barreling the rifle.
1889/96s were converted to 1896.11s buy replacing or modifying the following:
A new barrel was added.
Already fitted the the barrel were new front and rear sights.
A pistol grip was grafted onto the stock of the rifle.
The new rifles were also fitted with 6rd magazines, similar to the 1889/1900 pattern magazine, minus the reinforcing ridge, although the magazine did include a bolt hold-open feature for when the magazine was empty.
A new trigger-guard was fitted to accommodate the new magazine.
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The 96/11's were reworked to look and be like the 1911 rifle.
If it still has a 12 round mag, then is is an 1889 and is not safe/strong enough for GP11.
A quick guide for all Swiss rifles and what version of Swiss GP ammo you can :
If it has a three groove rifling barrel, then it is for use with the lower pressure GP(18)90 ammo. 7.5x53.5mm
Four groove rifled barrel is fine to use with GP11. 7.5x55mm.
Easy isn't it?
So went to the range with the Carcano today...I put a target at 75 yards and just sat at a table and plunked my elbows down on it- no sandbags. I shot 2 3 shots groups, which weren't too bad considering the iron sights and no rest. There are some 22 holes in the target, but I circled the 6.5 holes.
The stock has a little add on which looks like it was done fairly well, although you can now see the separation line between the 2 pieces
Is this the Cooey barrel stub?
The stock has a little add on which looks like it was done fairly well, although you can now see the separation line between the 2 pieces
Is this the Cooey barrel stub?
I'm pretty sure it is, considering the 6.5 Carcano ammo that I had a box of was showing signs of excessive headspace.
Still pretty accurate for no sandbags, rudimentary iron sights and the wrong ammo.
I'm pretty sure it is, considering the 6.5 Carcano ammo that I had a box of was showing signs of excessive headspace.
Still pretty accurate for no sandbags, rudimentary iron sights and the wrong ammo.
Yeah I'll agree with that.
I think the 6.5x52 ammo didn't rupture because the extractor was holding the rim firmly against the bolt allowing it to stretch h evenly when fired.
