Kar 88 / Gewehr 91: Anyone shot/own one?

Nabs

Nabs

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One of the last milsurps I am looking for would either be the Kar 88 or Gewehr 91 (Primary interest would be the Gewehr 91). I haven't seen any of these on the EE, anyone have a good lead on one ? I had a post in the EE a few months back and it didn't generate any leads but I'll give it another go. Speaking of which, what is considered to be the average going price for one ?

The second issue, has anyone shot these before, especially the spitgeschoss marked ones ? I have an 8mm Mauser load that works in my Gewehr 98s and I am going to be trying it soon in my Gewehr 88.

If you have a Gewehr 91 or Kar 88 and would be interested in parting with it, I would be very much interested in working something out. Mis-matched doesn't bother me as long as all parts are German origin, the unit marked band matches, and the bore and overall condition are good.

Thanks all!
 
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The rifles with the big "S" and sometimes a cut out in the ring have also been re barreled to a .323 diameter bore. Most have also had the clip feature replaced with a special flat spring type guide lip on the left side as well. They will usually have charger guides installed as well. Most of the available rifles, that I've seen recently have been Turkish. Many have had the protective tubes around the barrel removed as well.
I shoot regulars hand loads in mine, with pressures below 45,000. The milspec loads were about the same.

A "good only" Turk will fetch around $200. As the quality increases, so does price.

There is a decent one on the milsurp EE right now. The price seems fair according to condition stated. I think mikeRock is the seller. I just checked, It's the 88/05.
 
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Just to clarify, I am referring to the Gewehr 91/Kar88 carbines and not the Gewehr 88 as far as acquiring an example.

Thanks you for sharing your shooting experience with the Gewehr 88, it always helps to get a second opinion.

As far as these carbines go, my understanding is that they retained the use of the en-bloc clip and many were upgraded to take the spitzgeschoss but it was found that the muzzle blast was too heavy and the search for an alternative carbine began. In the mean time, these carbines were issued with the M88 round unless Patrone S was the only ammo available and the carbine had been appropriately modified to take it.

Can anyone comment on the muzzle blast with hand loads in these carbines ? I would be quite interested in hearing first hand accounts.
 
I have a pair of M88 rifles. They were arsenal refinished. One has the metal shroud and one has been upgraded to the new sight and full wood. My understanding is that they will shoot the new spec ammo. I have never fired them with anything.

They are for sale.

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I remember seeing that pair on the EE. The Turfek 1888/05/35 is quite an interesting piece of Gewehr 88 history.

Presently, I am looking for one of these with priority going to the Gewehr 91:

(If I borrowed your image, please do not take offense as I do not claim them as my own)

KAR. 88

kar88.jpg


GEW. 91

113gr.jpg


If you have some firearms that are either one of the two above, and are interested in selling, send me a pm.

These pictures may also generate some commotion as far as someone remembering their experience firing one of these years ago. If so, by all means, please share.
 
Yes, that is the true Kar'88: butterknife bolt-handle and all.

I have only ever been privileged to handle one; they are more than a little bit scarce, just about as scarce as the Kar71/84. VERY nice little toy.

Thinking on these, we must remember that original ammo was loaded with a very quick-burning FLAKE powder, so the issues would have been less as to muzzle blast. Our modern progressive powders are ALL more progressive than what they had back then.

More progressive = longer burn time = longer pressure curve = more blast from a Shorty.... and these critters definitely were a Shorty.

IF I ever were lucky enough to own one of these, I think I would be doing my loading with 3031 or, better yet, 4198 and segregating the rounds for it if they started getting even a bit 'up there'.

The advantages of the Carbine were greatly outweighed by the disadvantages of smokeless powder, hence the development of the Short Rifle: a relatively-short firearm which could use the new powders efficiently for maximum MV/ME... a compromise rifle.

I am adding that photo to my own little gallery. These things are just too rare.

I have the 88/05 and the 88/05/35, latter with superb barrel, a $39.95 gun when I got it. Shoots real nice, too, even if it looks a tad on the grody side of things. It's much like a Gew98 except on an 88 action. Nice heavy barrel, much heavier than 88 standard barrels.

If you are all the way down to Kar88 and Gew91, friend, you must have truly a fine set. I congratulate you.
 
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Sorry for the mix up Nabs. I do have a 1904, 98 carbine, Erfurt in VG+ condition. I don't shoot it at all any more. It has an 18 in bble and is in milspec dress. Its muzzle flash is horrendous and it kicks like a mule. It is by no means fun to shoot, unless you're a masochist. It is quite accurate though.

It is a killer off the bench or from a prone position. Standing isn't much better. If there is anyone close by, be prepared for some colorful compliments that aren't always nice.
 
Very interesting, I always thought it would kick hard and your report certainly mirrors the German reports from a century ago.

Smellie, thank you for your input, it seems finding examples of these carbines is as hard as finding a Mosin model 1907 carbine (okay, maybe not that hard).

As for my collection, I am quite proud of it. My original goal was to acquire a singular example of every one of Germany's rifles and carbines from 1871 to 1945. Presently, I only require four more: Gewehr 41 (aka Dreyse needle gun), Gewehr 71, either Kar 71, 88, or Gewehr 91, and a late war Kar98k (1945 made). My collection may not be specific but it covers a wide range. The other main driver behind collecting these rifles is directly related to family history with half of my collection being examples of rifles used by my fore fathers. There is nothing quite like firing the rifle your grandfather, great grandfather, and great great grandfather used and was trained on.
 
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