Kimber, STI, or S&W 1911, which one to choose?

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I am looking to buy a "fine" 1911 to mark my recent "achievement:p".
I am set on three models right now.

One is Kimber blued walnut custom II, one is STI trojan, and one is S&W 1911 SS target (all in .45acp).
I figure all three are fine pictols at similar price range. but it is difficult to
decide which one to get.

For me, I prefer a full-size, full-metal, heavy 1911 without any plastic in it. The reliability and durability are the other major concerns.

Please give some suggestions.

Thank you very much.
 
Personally, I'd go: Kimber, STI, then S&W in that order.

2007-10-27_091302_1aCoffee.gif

NAA.
 
kimber.
I own the desert warrior and it is phenomenal to say the least. I absolutely love it. And I would expect nothing less from all the other models that kimber has to offer.
 
I am looking to buy a "fine" 1911 to mark my recent "achievement:p".
I am set on three models right now.

One is Kimber blued walnut custom II, one is STI trojan, and one is S&W 1911 SS target (all in .45acp).
I figure all three are fine pictols at similar price range. but it is difficult to
decide which one to get.

For me, I prefer a full-size, full-metal, heavy 1911 without any plastic in it. The reliability and durability are the other major concerns.

Please give some suggestions.

Thank you very much.

Hi,

IMHO, STI is the best choice of the 3 makes. I've owned pistols made by all three manufacturers and only the STI pistols are still part of my "arsenal" (wifey's term, lol).

STI pistols on a dollar for dollar basis are "better" than Kimber, Para or S&W as far as value, reliability, accuracy and warranty service are concerned. Nuff said.

C:popCorn:
 
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Personally, I'd go: Kimber, STI, then S&W in that order.

2007-10-27_091302_1aCoffee.gif

NAA.


YES this will be my choices too!
I'll put KIMBER on the first place, it's one of the best in a resonable price range
pistol comes with tight tolerances slide/frame and top accuracy out of the box
my KIMBER Custom II SS comes with a 4lb factory trigger
KIMBER fully recommended !!!
 
Trojan. The other two both have firing pin blocks (a la Series 80) which make for heavier trigger pulls.

The Block on the S&W functions off the grip safety and does not affect the trigger pull...!

The Trigger pull on mine is really crisp and a pleasure to feel!

Plus... they look pretty too!
1911-SW-Tac.jpg
 
The Smith and Kimber both have useless "safety" devices (the infamous Swartz safety) that interfere with the functioning of the firing pin independantly of the trigger = fail. The Kimber adds insult to injury by using large numbers of MIM parts, but Kimber won't tell you which ones, or even how many are MIM (unlike Colt for example, who use MIM and tell you which parts they are - and yes, I know MIM is just as good as any other method - sure it is, no, really). That leaves STI - a good bet that you won't have any issues, not too many superfluous parts, no knocks about periodic QC issues (can't be said for Smith or Kimber) and first class product support from the importer - who is a sponsor here.
 
the smith and kimber both have useless "safety" devices (the infamous swartz safety) that interfere with the functioning of the firing pin independantly of the trigger = fail. The kimber adds insult to injury by using large numbers of mim parts, but kimber won't tell you which ones, or even how many are mim (unlike colt for example, who use mim and tell you which parts they are - and yes, i know mim is just as good as any other method - sure it is, no, really). That leaves sti - a good bet that you won't have any issues, not too many superfluous parts, no knocks about periodic qc issues (can't be said for smith or kimber) and first class product support from the importer - who is a sponsor here.

sti faq
sti faq

q does sti use any mim parts?

a yes. We, like most manufacturers, do but not in any of the "critical" stress or wear components. Our good friend bob serva of fusion firearms has graciously allowed us to quote his response to this question.
read bob serva's comments

http://www.stiguns.com/

sti faq mim


"gentlemen, the hysteria over mim has been going on for many years. The facts are that mim and pm (powder metal) are modern manufacturing processes that do have their place. Many parts lend themselves to mim processes due to there shape and function. I have been working as a manufacturing engineer and closely with the firearms industry for over 20 years. I can give you some of my experience and facts of mim and pm.


Q are mim parts of lesser quality than cast, forged or barstock?

A no. Mim and pm parts if designed and processed properly are as good as the other process for most small part applications. Design, material selection and heat-treatment processes play a big part in quality and serviceable life of the part. For example, most people don’t understand how many products they use everyday that are mim and pm processed. Items such as the transmission gears in your car, valves, the jaws on the cordless drill you use and many types of carbide tooling for machining to name a few.


Q why do manufacturers use them in their product?

a quality and cost. Mim and pm allow for consistent process that produces repeatability and good quality parts of complicated geometry. Tooling for mim parts is very expensive and you need to produce a product with some volume in sales or it is very hard to justify the costs.


Q can you make substandard quality mim parts?

a yes. Again, design and process control are critical to good quality mim parts. But this is also true with cast, forged, or barstock parts. If good manufacturing processes are not followed you will get parts of sub-standard quality.


Q why do we seem to see more mim parts fail?

a this is pure numbers. Most production firearms include mim or pm parts- yes, you might not want to believe it but most all pistols, revolvers, and rifles contain mim or pm parts. Most people, without knowing the difference, have been using these for many years. Why we hear about it more is because the majority of pistols and revolvers have some mim content in them. So, if we want to look at this logically you have to think in ppm. (ppm is parts per million- it is a basis to how to figure a parts failure rate and its effect on the product.) for example if in 2005 there were 500,000 pistol produced with mim slide stops and the failure rate worked out to be 1 failure per 1000, we would see 500 mim slide stops fail. If in the same year we produced 50,000 with bar stock slide stops with the same failure rate we would hear of 50 failures. So yes, we do hear of more mim failures and we probably should due to the fact that they are, at a minimum, of 10 to 1 in annual sales.


So yes, mim does has its place and it can and does produce high quality and durable parts. Yes, some will fail, just as cast, forged, and barstock parts also fail. I have used 1000’s of sti parts in production 1911’s over the years and the failure rate was basically the same with mim as with the other manufacturing processes. I have worked closely with the people at sti for many years and their designs and process controls are first class. They do not skimp or try to cheapen their product to save a nickel. They use the best processes and materials available and they always have the goal to offer their customers products of exceptional quality and attention to detail."

http://www.stiguns.com/
 
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Thank you all. Seems that the Kimber and Sti Trojans got most of the vote. For me the Trojan is a little bit pricy as an "entry-level" gun. Need more thinking before I made up my mind.
 
The STI is probably the best of the three, but I don't really care for the look of them: very coarse slide serrations and gaudy markings. If I'm going to pay that kind of money for a gun, aesthetics definitely matter.

The other two have significant flaws of their own:
Kimber: Poor quality small parts, problematic grip safety-actuated firing pin block
http://10-8performance.########.com/2010/07/kimber-warrior.html

S&W: Similar firing pin block issues as above, proprietary internal extractor prone to tolerance stack-induced malfunctions that aren't easily fixed.

In this price range for a production gun, Colt would be my first choice, followed by Springfield Armory. The Series 80 firing pin safety on Colts works the best of any design on the market and is easy to get rid of if you don't want it. If you don't mind spending a little extra, Dan Wessons are quite nice. If you're willing to go the custom route, Dlask 1911s start at $1250 for the base model.
 
I love my smith and wesson 1911 (my profile pic). It is a great gun. Nice trigger, solid as a brick, and gorgeous! I owned a kimber custom II and it was great, but I like this one more. I have not played with an STI before, so I cannot say. A lot of hearsay BS floats around the interwebs...ask people what their personal experience is with these firearms and the answers may be different. My understanding is that all three of these are high quality firearms and you cannot go wrong, but I can certainly vouch for the S&W and the Kimber.
 
If MIM isn't an issue why don't they simply tell us which parts are MIM? Colt has no issue doing this, even though they do use MIM for 2 parts that I consider critical (sear and disconnector). The arguments made in support of STI remain valid, a very solid performance history with an absence of Monday morning and Friday afternoon guns, lack of superfluous parts (like the Swartz), and solid support from a site sponsor.
 
i own a kimber sis and love it. about 2 weeks ago i got my mits on a raptor. Very nice arm that i would love to add to the collection. You should have a look at one of those if you can find one. Sti a close second. imo
 
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