limitations of basic 'soft points' vs premium bullets....

[manbearpig]

for hunting anything larger than varmints i usually just shell out for premium bullets - figuring even with a $40-50 box of bullets its only a couple bucks per deer, which is peanuts considering all of the other cost factors of a hunt. but i admit that out of all of the facets of hunting & gun ownership i understand bullet construction the least -- i just pretty much trust in marketing and assume you get what you pay for.

but really, at common hunting ranges like ~100 yards, on medium sized game, is there any significant benefit to premium bullets (Winchester XP3 for example) vs traditional, basic 'soft points' such as the Winchester 180gr 'Power Point' SP?

how many of you buy premium bullets for everything across the board, and how many buy them only for select conditions such as larger game and/or higher-velocity magnums which require a more controlled expansion?

 

[aulrich]

I'll use them (prieimium) but only where required, it maybe only a couple of bucks a deer but load development and practice can suck up significant amounts. I'd rather shoot more.

 

[Gatehouse]

The way I see it, using premim bullets for all big game hunting will cost an average hunter an extra $50 per year, maximum.

In BC, open seasons for everything from grouse to moose run concurrently.

Why bother with switching up ammo based on what you think you *might* see that day?

 

[chappy]

i reload all my rifles and use premium for all game. as you said a couple of dollars is meaningless compared to what is spent on vehical and gas. i use mostly hornady and sierras for practice as there cheaper.if i knew every shot was going threw the ribs a softpoint would be great. if you pull your shot and hit a shoulder i want to know my bullet will penetrate to the vitals. two bears i short this year were at close range, the 180 scrirroco preformed perfecty. one that was walking away and turned to look at me i took out his shoulder. bullet recoved on the off side under the hide 146 grns. i would not like to chance that shot with a softpoint as impact velocity was close to 3000fps on impact.

 

[Ruger No.1]

I handload but still always choose to go with premium bullets for my hunting loads. Like you said it's just peanuts compared with other hunting costs and I have had lower cost soft points fail before.

Having said that, because I like to do lots of off season practice, I also use cheaper offerings (ie. Hornady Interlocks) and work out loads so that my POI is very close to my hunting loads and then do a final tuneup with my premium bullets just before I go afield.

 

[Goose25]

A Premium bullet is kinda like insurance, You might never need it, but if you do... you'll be glad you have it.

 

[prosper]

In the grand scheme, the price difference is only worth a coupld cups of coffee per year - so even if the benefits are GREATLY overstated, what do you have to lose? Half a box for load development, then only 2 or 3 shots per year to verify zero, and whatever you shoot at game. A $50/box of bullets might last a decade; is $5/year really that big a deal to you?

 

[ben hunchak]

Although not my cup of tea......if a person is concerned about a std. jacketed bullet blowing up to quickly; just go with a longer heavier bullet. Most of these expensive bullets are just well advertised hocum.

 

[Gatehouse]

Although not my cup of tea......if a person is concerned about a std. jacketed bullet blowing up to quickly; just go with a longer heavier bullet. Most of these expensive bullets are just well advertised hocum.

Tell us about your experiences in using premium bullets on game. You must have had extensive experience to come to the conclusion that it is just "hocum"

 

[ron hilchey]

three generations of hunters in my family have harvested a lot of game, deer and moose, without the need of "priemum" bullets. save your money to shoot more, and better. priemum bullets do not make up for poor shot placement or poor judgement.

 

[todbartell]

like alot of guys, I shoot alot of Hornady and similar priced bullets during the summer for practice. Before fall I will switch to a Barnes X, Nosler Partition or Accubond, and hunt. If it is just deer, a premium bullet is usually not required unless you are shooting a cartridge over 3000 f/s.

Id say it depends on the cartridge and the game being hunted. I shot a moose with a 350 grain Speer Magtip in my 416 Rem. Didnt need a triple shock or swift a-frame, that Speer punched through muscle and bone just fine. This past fall I hunted with 140 grain Hornady Interlocks in my Titanium 260. The muzzle velocity was 2680 f/s, and with the long 140 grain bullet, I knew it'd work just fine on any sane shot. I never did end up shooting anything with that rifle, but I had confidence in it.

if you match your bullet and caliber to the game being hunted, you do not need a premium. but if you want to hunt moose and elk with your 300 WSM, I would not load it with a bullet that can fragment on a shoulder bone! that is just asking for a problem

 

[Gatehouse]

three generations of hunters in my family have harvested a lot of game, deer and moose, without the need of "priemum" bullets. save your money to shoot more, and better. priemum bullets do not make up for poor shot placement or poor judgement.

Save $20-$50 per year? Is that cost significant?

 

[Republic of Alberta]

People have been sucked in to believing that certain "premium" bullets are better at everything all the time. On top of that they lump all "premium" bullets in to one pile. OH it's premium? that means it is automatically better!

This simply is not true, there are times when a regular bullet is better than the WRONG "premium"

People have also been suckered into believing that a 180g 30 cal Hornspeeera will not make it to the vitals of say Black Bear or Deer sized game on normal shots. They have also been suckered into thinking that because it is "premium" it will automatically go deeper than anything their buddy is shooting, never mind the fact that that they are using 150g partitions out of a 300 and their buddy is using 180g interlocks out of a 308.



Just because a bullet has the "premium" title doesnt always make it the best choice.

 

[H4831]

Although not my cup of tea......if a person is concerned about a std. jacketed bullet blowing up to quickly; just go with a longer heavier bullet. Most of these expensive bullets are just well advertised hocum.

I'm with you, Ben! I grew up at a time, in the boondocks, (in your own province!) when people shot game to live on. I have seen, or know of, vast arrays of moose and elk, as well as deer, being shot by virtually anything that burned powder. One fellow had shot thirty moose with a 30-30. I asked him how many he had wounded, that had gotten away. He thought for a while before he answered, then said, "I can't think of any that got away!"
For many years grizzly bears were shot by bushmen who very seldom had a rifle as powerful as a 30-06, and of course, "premium" bullets, or even reloading was not even heard of.
We live at a time when advertising makes the world go 'round. If you are in the business of manufacturing guns, or ammunition, you better have something constantly advertised on the market, that is better than anything else.
Ben's use of 'hocum,' I take to mean advertising, and not meaning the bullets were not better. But the point is, completely adequate bullets have been made for many, many years. This is not meant to discourage you from buying "premium," bullets, or any such thing. We are just pointing out that it probably isn't neccessary. And let's hope you buy enough to keep the manufacturers in business!

 

[Gatehouse]

People have been sucked in to believing that certain "premium" bullets are better at everything all the time. On top of that they lump all "premium" bullets in to one pile. OH it's premium? that means it is automatically better!

This simply is not true, there are times when a regular bullet is better than the WRONG "premium"

People have also been suckered into believing that a 180g 30 cal Hornspeeera will not make it to the vitals of say Black Bear or Deer sized game on normal shots. They have also been suckered into thinking that because it is "premium" it will automatically go deeper than anything their buddy is shooting, never mind the fact that that they are using 150g partitions out of a 300 and their buddy is using 180g interlocks out of a 308.

Just because a bullet has the "premium" title doesnt always make it the best choice.

This just sounds like ignorant people not researching/understanding the products they are using. Nothing to do with the actual bullets themselves.

 

[prosper]

lol, its funny how fast beople get their backs up when it comes to premium bullets. "back in my day, blah blah blah." No one's saying you 'need' premiums.

The whole point is that if there is any benefit or even any potential benefit to premiums, the price difference is so tiny that you may as well go premium. Even if the edge they give you is negligible, the question is 'why not premiums,' not 'why premiums'

 

[Cappy]

My general rule is if I'm shooting a rifle that gets around 3000fps or higher I switch to a controlled expansion like an Accubond. Or if I'm going after heavier game like elk and moose with a rifle that shoots lighter bullets I will do the same ie my 6.5's. Otherwise if it's something like my .308 I am happy with standard 165's or 180's and my .325WSM works just fine with 220gr Sierras.

I shoot in the neighbourhood of 3K rounds a year so the price can add up. I like shooting loads that I am absolutely familiar with and know what their impacts are at all ranges I shoot at. So I try and practice with what I hunt with.

 

[manbearpig]

well for the purposes of this thread, lets assume a .30-06/.308, which is something most people own or have owned at some point.

i was referring to any advantage in using something like a 180gr Winchester XP3 ($40) over a simple Winchester Super-X 180gr Power Point ($15) for deer at average hunting distances...
do the premium bullets only offer advantages for high-velocity rifles and/or large game, or do they have any advantage/disadvantage on smaller stuff such as deer at shorter hunting ranges?

This just sounds like ignorant people not researching/understanding the products they are using. Nothing to do with the actual bullets themselves.

its difficult for the layman, which is why im asking. often the only information you can find is from the bullet manufacturer, or from gun rags which make their living from praising every new product that comes out regardless how effective it really is.
most people just go by advertising which basically tells you that the advantages of premium bullets are overwhelming. id unquestionably buy the best bullet i could find for larger game, but this is the first ive actually thought of questioning spending the extra money on them for animals such as deer.

 

[Scott_N]

well for the purposes of this thread, lets assume a .30-06/.308, which is something most people own or have owned at some point.

i was referring to any advantage in using something like a 180gr Winchester XP3 ($40) over a simple Winchester Super-X 180gr Power Point ($15) for deer at average hunting distances...
do the premium bullets only offer advantages for high-velocity rifles and/or large game, or do they have any advantage/disadvantage on smaller stuff such as deer at shorter hunting ranges?

Just my opinion, but using your 308 / 30-06 example to hunt deer sized game at average distance, I would say no, the premiums don't really offer any great advantage unless you are trying Texas heart shots. This type of rifle / bullet has been killing deer for a long time and will continue to for many years to come.

I think the premiums have an advantage when larger game or high velocity rifles (3000 fps + like other guys have already mentioned.) come into play. I always use premiums now because the cost isn't that much more (I load my own ammo), and where I hunt in Alberta, deer, elk, moose and bear might be on the menu. They also are a bit reassuring when I hunt in grizzly bear country.

 

[Gatehouse]

well for the purposes of this thread, lets assume a .30-06/.308, which is something most people own or have owned at some point.

i was referring to any advantage in using something like a 180gr Winchester XP3 ($40) over a simple Winchester Super-X 180gr Power Point ($15) for deer at average hunting distances...

Deer at average distances aren't hard to kill, so the power points should work just fine.

do the premium bullets only offer advantages for high-velocity rifles and/or large game, or do they have any advantage/disadvantage on smaller stuff such as deer at shorter hunting ranges?

Premiums offer a few advantages

Can use lighter bullet for less recoil
Opens up shot angle opportunities

Some bullets expand too fast, and I've seen a couple of blow ups on deer from 7mmRM cartridges and Ballistic Tip bullets, but for the most part I'd feel fine hunting deer wiht a Power Point in a 3006...

its difficult for the layman, which is why im asking. often the only information you can find is from the bullet manufacturer, or from gun rags which make their living from praising every new product that comes out regardless how effective it really is.

All products- even non premium bullets- have advertising for them

Best source of info these days is to ask on the intraweb.