Looking for a new black rifle to replace my AR15...**New Update: Answer in post #33**

Which rifle is best to replace my AR15?

  • SL-8

    Votes: 22 8.6%

  • FS2000

    Votes: 21 8.2%

  • Tavor

    Votes: 43 16.8%

  • XCR

    Votes: 63 24.6%

  • Piston AR15

    Votes: 21 8.2%

  • None of the above

    Votes: 21 8.2%

  • Keep the original AR15

    Votes: 65 25.4%
  • Total voters
    256
dizzy said:
put an ad in the ee for a SAN classic green for 2800 you may find one. Esq had a heck of an idea, you can really make that colt very very accurate with the right barrel. Don't forget SAN's hold their value so when you have had your fun you should be able to get what you paid or only slightly less. If you can swing it do, great triggers and accurate with the right ammo. I have not shot the HK TAVOR or XCR so can't comment, but can comment on the SAN, I think you'd be happy if you could swing one.
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I definedly agree, go for Sig, Nothing beat it, not even plastic HK, if you wanted HK, get the Metal one, Like I say, Noting beat metal, not even Good plastic.
 
beltfed said:
A little off topic, and I'll pre-appologize for my rant,
but those rules are assinine.

1) The SL-8 is as close to a civilian version of a G-36 as the FS-2000 is to the F-2000.
2) If the Sigs are issued and fielded by NATO countries, how do they not qualify?
3) Why would it matter if it is used or fielded by a NATO or Commonwealth:jerkit: country? Isn't it about getting more shooters into the sport?
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I agree!

Also - nice choice Master-G - I like the look of those guns.
 
Master-G said:
I had managed to find some pretty good deals on the SL-8's but I found out that these are not eligible NSRA's Service Arms competition. The rule is that the rifle needs to be a current or past NATO or British Commonwealth-issued rifle, and neither of those two met that category --- the SL-8 isn't close enough to the G36 to qualify.
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So let me get this straight: This, a G36 (G36K), is eligible to compete:

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This, however, being an SL8 (yes, I know it is engraved as G36 (G36K) and looks identical, but go to HK with the serial and they will tell you it is SL8) is not:

10hpojm.jpg


Wow, the NSRA is no better than the liberals, judging a firearm by it's looks. What bollocks.

And if the SL8 in the above configuration is eligible, then where do you draw the line on similarity? Can a stock-block conversion qualify, or does it have to be identical, including the barrel?

When does an AR-15 variant stop being close enough to the M4 or C8? Is a non-restricted FS2000 close enough to the F2000, even though the barrel is about 8 cm longer?
 
You can use AK and VZ58 - Czech, hungary and Poland are NATO.

In addition, India, as a commonwealth, is fielding limited number of TAVOR as well as a large number of AK. Maybe you can run INSAS at NSRA???

And you can also run Galil since Latvia is NATO as well, and South Africa(R4) is commonwealth.

Also, Sri lanka is commonwealth - this mean chicom weapons such as Type 56, Type 81 and Type 97 bullpup are good to go!

Interesting enough, you can also run SAR21 and ultimax since Singapore is commonwealth.

All else fails - run HK 223, as Norway is a founding member of NATO and HK 416 is the new standard assault rifle.
 
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greentips said:
You can use AK and VZ58 - Czech, hungary and Poland are NATO.

In addition, India, as a commonwealth, is fielding limited number of TAVOR as well as a large number of AK. Maybe you can run INSAS at NSRA???

And you can also run Galil since Latvia is NATO as well, and South Africa(R4) is commonwealth.

Also, Sri lanka is commonwealth - this mean chicom weapons such as Type 56, Type 81 and Type 97 bullpup are good to go!

Interesting enough, you can also run SAR21 and ultimax since Singapore is commonwealth.

All else fails - run HK 223, as Norway is a founding member of NATO and HK 416 is the new standard assault rifle.
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When the fudds at the range argue with you about this, just tell them that Greentips from the internet told you it was OK :p :D.
 
If you ran that SL8 conversion, how would they know it isn't a G36? ;)

Unless they want to see the reg card. Another good reason to eliminate the registry!
 
greentips said:
You can use AK and VZ58 - Czech, hungary and Poland are NATO.
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LOL I'm bad enough as it is without using 1950's technology :).

ESQ said:
If you ran that SL8 conversion, how would they know it isn't a G36? ;)
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I suspect I could've swung it -- I saw Uncle Walther had a very authentic conversion he posted for a friend on the EE I was considering. The FS2000 is just weird and unique enough to appeal to me --let's hope it won't be a (expensive!) disappointment!
 
beltfed said:
A little off topic, and I'll pre-appologize for my rant,
but those rules are assinine.

1) The SL-8 is as close to a civilian version of a G-36 as the FS-2000 is to the F-2000.
2) If the Sigs are issued and fielded by NATO countries, how do they not qualify?
3) Why would it matter if it is used or fielded by a NATO or Commonwealth:jerkit: country? Isn't it about getting more shooters into the sport?
Click to expand...

1) The FS2000 is a fairly close variant of the issued F2000 to Slovenian forces, that utilize a normal picatinny rail on the top. The only visual difference is select fire and the military version's rail is slightly raised. Except for the fire control mechanism they're both identical.

The SL8 has had some permanent modifications done by the HK factory. The stock is the obvious modification however the receiver was also altered from the G36 specification to make it incompatible with the NATO standard G36 pistol grip and folding stock (the ones that we use to make a G36 look alike are specific to the SL8). In addition, the magazine well was modified to accept only SL8 specific magazines, not G36's. Should these disqualify the SL8? No idea... it's sorta like bringing a 24" bull barreled free floated AR15 to a service rifle match as well. It's iffy. In this case they said not allowed.

2) As far as I know it has to be a standard issue service rifle. Weapons given to military police and special forces don't qualify, as if that was the case then every weapon in existence would qualify, defeating the purpose. The Swiss are the only ones to issues the STGW 90 as their standard issue rifle and they are not a NATO country.

3) Their competition, their rules. I think the DCRA is more open to what it considers a service rifle, so who knows.



Edit: And I just realized the post I was responding to is over 4 months old. :D **smacks self**
 
SL8 is the civilian counterpart to the G36 - same operating system. To say SL-8 is not qualified based on the look, then all these AR15 space guns with round FF tube, missing front sight base, adjustable stock , giant stainless steel barrel with muzzle brake and stubby mag with a chuck of wood attached to the base plate should be ejected as well.

The old rule on NATO and common-wealth weapons is outdated and rendered meaningless after the break up of Warsaw Pact. The world has changed. I can shoot a Galil, AK47 AK74, Tantal, VZ58.....as they are all NATO. The numober of commonly available non-Nato and non common wealth weapons are extremely limited, probably SG55X, SKT SR21, Daewoo K1/2 and some exotic russian weapons that won't be exported any wyas.
 
Seeing as how this thread has been brought back to life I thought I'd give an update. After a brief springtime fling with the FS2000 I've gone back to an AR. The FN was a neat, unique rifle but I missed shooting the AR -- I just like them better. I still think a 20" HBAR with and Elcan sight is way too heavier than an AR should be so I've got to something a little easier handling:

AR_7_June-a.jpg


AR_7_June-c.jpg
 
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