Hi, can those of you Nagant experts tell me, which manufacturers made M1891/30 rifles with full (not laminated) stock and with one piece (not split/two-piece) wood stocks? Also can you tell me which manufacturer made the best quality M1891/30s (in terms of metal & wood usage), the Tula or Izhevsk, or were there others? Thank you and my apologies for so many questions, I'm just ready to buy one, and although I am willing to spend more, I hope to buy one that is really good in quality. Thank you, please educate me
Hmm... some good info in this thread, along with some misinformation. Let me try to clear things up for you somewhat.
For starters, there are only three ww2 era manufacturers of the M1891/30. They are:
-Tula
-Izhevsk
-Tikka (Finland).
There are other rifles around from ww2 from other makers, but in general, these are Finnish creations using cannibalized barrels from earlier rifle makers that never made the M91/30.
Both Tula and Izhevsk made the M1891/30 with 1 piece stocks. Both also made the M91/30 with 2 piece, 3 piece and laminated stocks at one time or another.
Tikka made the M1891/30 with either captured Russian stocks or newly made 2-piece stocks joined just behind the rear band with a finger-splice. No Tikka has ever surfaced with a laminate stock.
In general, it is accepted that ww2 laminate stocks were issued with the Carbines (i.e. M38 and M44). Virtually all laminate M1891/30 stocks you are likely to encounter were fitted to their respective rifles POST-WAR during a rebuild.
In general, the only non-refurbished M1891/30 rifles you are likely to encounter in Canada (or in the US for that matter) are Finnish captured rifles from ww2. These guns may or may not be Finn marked. Not all Finn captured rifles were refurbished which accounts for the originals that are around.
M1891/30's tat have recently been imported are all from either Balkan states or the Ukraine. They have ALL (yes, every last one of them) been refurbished. This refurbishment program was a public works project in the Soviet Union circa 1960's and 1970's. Some of the rifles we see are on their 3rd or 4th refurb, as refurb programs also took place during ww2 and in the decades between ww2 and the comprehensive rebuild program of the 60's ad 70's.
The commonly available refurbs had mixed parts. PERIOD. Sometimes (rarely) bolts may be originals to the receivers (it takes a trained eye and lots of experience seeing refurbed bolt bodies to spot the difference). Barrels are generally the originals. The rest of the parts are most certainly random replacements from the bin and the majority of the bolt bodies are renumbered.
Start of production for the Soviet M891/30 was June 10, 1930. Rifles prior to that date started life as M1891 Dragoon rifles and may subsequently have been updated to the M1891/30 standard. Tikka started production in 1944. The M1891/30 receiver was changed from octagonal (erroneously referred to as "hex" receivers) in 1936 at both Izhevsk and Tula, while both types were used at Tikka throughout production. Production quality remained equal and of high standard at all factories until the spring of 1941.
June 22, 1941 marked the German invasion of the USSR. Production shortcuts were immediately implemented and the fit and finish of all M1891/30 rifles fell off dramatically until the second half of 1944 when it started to gradually improve. The worst year for production quality at both Soviet factories was 1942.
Much is made of production quality differences between Tula and Izhevsk. This is total BUNK. Both factories produced rifles to the same standard throughout production and quality lowered as the government relaxed specifications to speed production. If you want a top quality rifle, sick to 1940 and earlier or a 1945 dated example. Octagona receivers are more collectable and Tula rifles are more collectible than Izhevsk because Tula made less of them in most years. Tula rifles also have nicer markings in term of aesthetics.
The rarest M1891/30 rifles are 1941 Tulas. Tula began making the SVT40 that year and so made very few 91/30's. Additionally, the plant was moved which slowed production dramatically.
I hope that helps.
