MAS 49/56 century arms conversions thoughts

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Webley No.5

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Like the title says I’m looking for owners of MAS 49/56 that were converted by century arms to 7.62x51. How did it cycle? Did it have lots of issues? A few? None? We’re they ammo picky or over gassed? For reference I’m interested in semi auto milsurp from that era and I like to shoot my collection to having it in 7.62nato would make it cheap to shoot but if it’s going to malfunction I’d rather start loading 7.5 French. So I’m wondering which MAS I should be on the look out for. Bonus points to anyone that owns both a conversion and an original for comparisons.
Thanks
 
Forgotten Weapons talked about them a bit in a video, if I remember correctly it was a episode about a official french experiment to convert them to 7.62 Nato. There conclusion I seem to recall was the design isn’t really well suited for 7.62 Nato and the conversions (both official and Century Arms) don’t work nearly as well as the 7.5 ones.
 
Webley No.5 said:
.... Bonus points to anyone that owns both a conversion and an original for comparisons.
Thanks
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I know a fellow who has a MAS 44 and a MAS 49/56. The first is original 7.5 and the second is a 7.62 conversion. They use the same mags. They both have similar ergonomics, namely sized for a 1940s French recruit. The black rubber buttplate falsie is a good idea. The sights are incrementally better in the later model, and it has the dovetails for a scope base. This one was a bear for my friend to find. It is uniquely French.

French 7.5 ammo is incredibly hard to find in any consistent quantities, hence the reason why he got the 7.62 rifle. The problem of late is the firing pin is free floating, and it sometimes has slam fires. That is a problem. The interwebs say to get a special lightweight titanium firing pin, or round off the tip a little bit more and have at it. I'm not sure what he'll be doing. It is possible to shorten, reneck and load 7.5 from .308 or 30-06, but any that my friend has done have splits on the shoulders.

The MAS family is remarkably simple. There is nothing to go wrong. The MAS36 bolt action has maybe 50 total parts, and most of them are in the trigger and stock hardware. The rifle was not designed for user maintenance, but to be regulated by an Army armourer with a full spare parts bin to exchange rear sight leafs and scrape away ill-fitting wood. The 44 and 49/56 are clearly related to each other, and share many of the same characteristics.
 
Webley No.5 said:
Like the title says I’m looking for owners of MAS 49/56 that were converted by century arms to 7.62x51. ... Were they ammo picky or over gassed? .....
Thanks
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Further to the other posts, the 49 and 49/56 have a grenade sight that includes a gas cut-off cylinder in the path of the gas port-to-gas tube. In the open position, the gas has a simple path. A machinist could make a new gas cut-off (or find a surplus one), and thread insert screws from the outside ends. Screws in all the way, only a little gas gets into the gas tube. Screws backed out all the way, as much gas as planned goes into the gas tube. That will address the gas volume, but not the pressure curve. As mentioned Ian The Gun Jesus, details how the French found the problem with their NATO conversions was not the rifles but the differences of powder between NATO 7.62 ball and French 7.5 ball. They were not the same.
 
They worked just fine with Nato spec ammo. Shot a few crates through the unit I had and not one malfunction. Didn't try commercial spec ammo.

I also purchased one of the MAS36 bolt rifles from them at the same time, total FTR with a new barrel chambered for the 7.62x51

Both rifles were very accurate and very well made.

Both were mixmasters, after the FTR but they looked and operated as if they were brand new.
 
maple_leaf_eh said:
I know a fellow who has a MAS 44 and a MAS 49/56. The first is original 7.5 and the second is a 7.62 conversion. They use the same mags. They both have similar ergonomics, namely sized for a 1940s French recruit. The black rubber buttplate falsie is a good idea. The sights are incrementally better in the later model, and it has the dovetails for a scope base. This one was a bear for my friend to find. It is uniquely French.

French 7.5 ammo is incredibly hard to find in any consistent quantities, hence the reason why he got the 7.62 rifle. The problem of late is the firing pin is free floating, and it sometimes has slam fires. That is a problem. The interwebs say to get a special lightweight titanium firing pin, or round off the tip a little bit more and have at it. I'm not sure what he'll be doing. It is possible to shorten, reneck and load 7.5 from .308 or 30-06, but any that my friend has done have splits on the shoulders.

The MAS family is remarkably simple. There is nothing to go wrong. The MAS36 bolt action has maybe 50 total parts, and most of them are in the trigger and stock hardware. The rifle was not designed for user maintenance, but to be regulated by an Army armourer with a full spare parts bin to exchange rear sight leafs and scrape away ill-fitting wood. The 44 and 49/56 are clearly related to each other, and share many of the same characteristics.
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the slam fire is real had a guy with one beside me at the range WITH the new firing pin and it fired 3-4 rnds at once he was shooting commercial ammo he had fired several rnds prior with no problems
 
contact148 said:
the slam fire is real had a guy with one beside me at the range WITH the new firing pin and it fired 3-4 rnds at once he was shooting commercial ammo he had fired several rnds prior with no problems
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I noticed with my MAS 49 it could potentially slam fire if the trigger group was not seated properly. What would happen was sometimes when the bolt was traveling rearward it would not make enough contact with the hammer for the sear to catch it. I believe I had to put a shim between the trigger guard and stock to correct the problem. It is a really strange design flaw that the wood itself could change the geometry of the action causing unsafe usage.

MY4F9to.jpg
 
i do remember that i shot the frf2 in the army with 308 and we had issues to extract or even performances but we had issues with the 7.5 as well and the iwi ammo in the famas 1st serie.

did not recall the 49-56 officially given to us in 308 caliber nor scope. the 7.5 and the 49/56 was the perfect match.
 
conversion in 308 are not very good. barrel are cut and gaz pipe same. The result is not good. i understand for the 7.5 ammo that it's difficult to find but a MAS 44/49/49/56 are product for this munition.

For 7.62 nato the MAS has made 150 rifle in this caliber and it's different to any points to the 7.5 french ( magazine, fire pin, barrel, gaz pipe,...) . If you find this rifle you must broken your bank account.

You can buy a mas 36 in 308 because it's more easy to transform and the result are good.
 
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mauser71 said:
No problem with 7,62 NATO with a MAS 49/56 in the past.

Probably a lucky man ?
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I had the same results, as did several friends. Not one failure to feed/fire and accuracy was acceptable.

One fellow told me that his rifle didn't appreciate Turk surplus 7.62 Nato, but everything else worked fine, including commercial loads

The fellows above are talking about their personal experiences, so I believe what they're saying

However, they didn't state the condition of the rifles they used nor where the ammo came from.

Both of my rifles were CIA conversions and my ammo was either IVI or FA
 
My issue right now is it seems people either say they had no issues and others say they had nothing but issues. I have read that by shortening barrel and gas system caused higher operating pressures but this was solved easily on the 49/56 with an adjustable gas plug by many users after the fact. That’s not a new problem to me as most old semi autos are over gassed/made for a specific powder/bullet combo. My concerns are more about the fact that this rifle was not designed around 7.62, so magazines, feed angles and such that I don’t want to deal with given the unavailability of parts. So for those that don’t like the rifle, what was your experience? Was it multiple issues with multiple ammo’s? And what was it? Failure to feed, eject, pulling rims off etc. The firing pin issues seems like it needs to be addressed either way whether it’s a conversion or original so not really a point either way.
 
Have you gone online or looked at a book with the specifics concerning dimensions???

Other than the original French 7.5x54 case head diameter there is very little difference between the cartridges.

The bolt faces are slightly larger than they need to be, but nothing that going to cause issues with feeding or firing.

A few thousanths of an inch doesn't seem to make much difference.

As with most military conversions, there were likely some teething issues that needed to be dealt with.

The rifles I'm talking about were converted by Century International Arms. Not sure if they were done in Europe or the US.

If you're looking for a 100% guarantee, pass on the conversion.

Mine gave zero issues over a couple of thousand+ rounds of "good" quality surplus ammo.

The IVI was loaded for Canada's FNC1FAL and the US Frankford Arsenal was loaded for the US M14

The US ammo was quite a bit hotter but still within NATO specs
 
Webley No.5 said:
My issue right now is it seems people either say they had no issues and others say they had nothing but issues. I have read that by shortening barrel and gas system caused higher operating pressures but this was solved easily on the 49/56 with an adjustable gas plug by many users after the fact. That’s not a new problem to me as most old semi autos are over gassed/made for a specific powder/bullet combo. My concerns are more about the fact that this rifle was not designed around 7.62, so magazines, feed angles and such that I don’t want to deal with given the unavailability of parts. So for those that don’t like the rifle, what was your experience? Was it multiple issues with multiple ammo’s? And what was it? Failure to feed, eject, pulling rims off etc. The firing pin issues seems like it needs to be addressed either way whether it’s a conversion or original so not really a point either way.
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The fellow I mentioned with the MAS 49/56 had no failures or issues, except the slam fire, when shooting Canadian mil-spec FMJ made by IVI. Yes the x51 is overall shorter than 7.5x54 by 3mm. That is negligible because the two rounds are effectively the same shape. No feed issues. Parts however, are almost all now in the US. From time to time if you trawl the interwebs deep enough you'll find some gunshop with bins of them. The one place I found was Apex, and they were not the least bit interested in selling to Canada. So, I found another route. But remember, these are remarkably simple designs! The gas system is a block on the barrel, a cut-off, and a tube. There is no piston, plug, regulator or springs like you might find on an SAFN. I am envious of my friend's good taste.
 
bearhunter said:
I had the same results, as did several friends. Not one failure to feed/fire and accuracy was acceptable.

One fellow told me that his rifle didn't appreciate Turk surplus 7.62 Nato, but everything else worked fine, including commercial loads

The fellows above are talking about their personal experiences, so I believe what they're saying

However, they didn't state the condition of the rifles they used nor where the ammo came from.

Both of my rifles were CIA conversions and my ammo was either IVI or FA
Click to expand...

i cant recall the ammo used will it be for the frf2 (a newer version of the mas bolt 36) or the mas 49-56 and i never shot a 49-56 in 308 as it was never issued to the french army in the unit i was (maybe the 2nd rep got some when they got the 49-56 with scope). i shot a lot the 49-56 in the original caliber 7.5 and part of the shooting process was very clear: shooting then cleaning and cleaning cannot be avoided but it was army time.

we got ammo from france and israel (maybe others) and i cant recall which led to issues for the frf2 (again not a semi) in 308.

the israel ammo was also a problem for the famas 1st gen: french gvt was so clever to shut down the french plant that made great ammo in those days.

i do think the 7.5 and the 308 are very close but not exactly the same.

as of today i wish all the users of 49-56 will it be the 308 or 7.5 the fun i had to shoot it and being paid ...
 
Israeli 7.62 Nato is HOT. Likely very close to maximum.

The Israelis fielded FALs/M14s and a few other rifles chambered for the cartridge, as well as machineguns.

They all require different operating pressures to function properly.

So, they just loaded everything to the standard that would operate all of their weapons without excessive wear or damage.

I had a few crates of Israeli 7.62 Nato and traded it for a couple of crates of South African 7.62x39. That stuff beat the heck out of everything I shot it in, from bolt actions (No4 conversion) to a Garand I had at the time.

Recoil was very noticeable as was muzzle blast.
 
Thanks everyone for your thoughts. I recently acquired a MAS 49/56 in 308/7,62. Functions very well, just shot 30 rounds with only one failure to feed (follower got stuck did not appear to be issue as a result of 308). Very soft shooting rifle, lot of fun to shoot.
 
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