me and my big mouth

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lonesalamander

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Does anyone know the legality regarding a handgun conversion kit? (in this case a Kadet kit for a CZ75)

I know it doesn't qualify as a firearm and thus doesn't have to be registered, but do I have to update my registration certificate to indicate the original firearm can also shoot .22lr?

I just moved to Vancouver Island and was told that the Malahat range gets spot checks from the RCMP from time to time. I wanted to double check that all my ducks were in a row, so I called the CFC simply to ask if my 9mm CZ needed its registration changed for a conversion kit. The lady I spoke with said that "I should." Whatever that means. She was indelicate about trying to find out if the barrel had been shortened to prohibited length, so I really don't think I impressed it upon her enough that it was a factory, drop-in conversion kit and that it would still be able to shoot 9mm. Like an idiot, I agreed to changing the registration just to avoid future hassles..

Today I recieved a letter requesting "digital images of the barrel with a caliper or micrometer reading," among other things. They even went to the effort to highlight the important bits. However, it also says that if I don't comply within 30 days the application will be denied. Anyone know what happens then?
 
Go to Pullens, with your CZ and Kit - explain the situation and have him verify it for you. John is a gunsmith and verifier. Next time don't be silly.

PS; the only police I've seen at Malahat in 7 years have been using the range, they might want to shoot your Cz, but I've never seen anyone asked for paper. The local detachment doesn't have the personnel, time or interest to waste time investigating legal shooters.
 
Hey lonesalamander,

VFG members have been warned about RCMP spot checks. I've never had one, or seen one happen, but best to be prudent, and have everything in order, and on your person.

As for your situation with the registration of your conversion kit, I'd say you're in for the ride now...not much you can do, but follow it to it's logical (or illogical) conclusion.

Cheers,
Cal.
 
'Course, to avoid any hassle, you could just "sell" your conversion kit and thereby avoid any need to go through the hoops.

As you know, since, it is a "conversion kit" and not a "receiver" or "firearm" itself, under the law it does not require registration unless permanently used on a receiver to change the cartridge [if different than the original cartridge on record for that receiver/firearm].

So, if in the "future" you were to acquire "another" conversion unit, [or even reacquire this particular unit from the person you sold it to ;) ] what I would do is, keep the firearm assembled as it is registered [ie 9mm]. Then when you take the conversion unit with the base firearm to the range, assemble & use it there with the conversion unit, then change it back over when you leave again.

Since, the "conversion" is not "permanent" there is no need to re-register or add the conversion unit to the registration of the primary firearm.

That's how I understand it.

I've been using Colt .22 conversion units for years with various 1911A1 [.45ACP] receivers.

:canadaFlag:
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NAA.
 
Last edited:
NAA said:
'Course, to avoid any hassle, you could just "sell" your conversion kit and thereby avoid any need to go through the hoops.

As you know, since, it is a "conversion kit" and not a "receiver" or "firearm" itself, under the law it does not require registration unless permanently used on a receiver to change the cartridge [if different than the original cartridge on record for that receiver/firearm].

So, if in the "future" you were to acquire "another" conversion unit, [or even reacquire this particular unit from the person you sold it to ;) ] what I would do is, keep the firearm assembled as it is registered [ie 9mm]. Then when you take the conversion unit with the base firearm to the range, assemble & use it there with the conversion unit, then change it back over when you leave again. Since, the "conversion" is not "permanent" there is no need to re-register or add the conversion until to the registration of the primary firearm.

That's how I understand it.

I've been using Colt .22 conversion units for years with various 1911A1 [.45ACP] receivers.

:canadaFlag:
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NAA.
Click to expand...

Our gun laws are so twisted up it isn't even funny.

Let us know what comes of this OP.

J
 
Here is some relevant legislation pertaining to "conversion units":

Firearms Registration Certificates Regulations:
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-98-201/index.html

Relevant part "Conditions":


Section 4(2) Subject to section 5, the Registrar shall attach to a registration certificate that is issued in respect of a firearm the condition that when the type, action, calibre or gauge of the firearm is modified, the holder of the certificate shall advise the Registrar of the modification,
  • (a) if the modification is intended to be permanent, within 30 days after the modification; and
  • (b) if the modification is not intended to be permanent but still exists 30 days after it is made, without delay after that period.
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So, for discussion, since the modification of your firearm [9mm pistol] is not meant to be "permanent" [by adding & occasionally using a .22 conversion unit with it] then there is no requirment to advise the "Registrar" of the "modification" [addition & occasional use of the .22 unit with it].

:canadaFlag:
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NAA.
 
NAA said:
Here is some relevant legislation pertaining to "conversion units":

Firearms Registration Certificates Regulations:
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-98-201/index.html

Relevant part "Conditions":


Section 4(2) Subject to section 5, the Registrar shall attach to a registration certificate that is issued in respect of a firearm the condition that when the type, action, calibre or gauge of the firearm is modified, the holder of the certificate shall advise the Registrar of the modification,
  • (a) if the modification is intended to be permanent, within 30 days after the modification; and
  • (b) if the modification is not intended to be permanent but still exists 30 days after it is made, without delay after that period.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So, for discussion, since the modification of your firearm [9mm pistol] is not meant to be "permanent" [by adding & occasionally using a .22 conversion unit with it] then there is no requirment to advise the "Registrar" of the "modification" [addition & occasional use of the .22 unit with it].

:canadaFlag:
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NAA.
Click to expand...

x2

Don't install the 22 kit for longer then 30 days and tell them to pound sand.
 
He's golden. Just keep your CZ75 as a 9mm when stored or in transport. Only use the 22 kit at the range and switch it back. No issue here. The CFC misunderstood. You are not permanently altering the firearm.
 
The last time I ran into Police up at the range, they showed up and started shooting off a few shotguns for fun. Then, when they ran out of ammo, one walks over to me and tries to bum some 12 guage off me so they could keep shooting. Serious.
 
lonesalamander said:
Does anyone know the legality regarding a handgun conversion kit? (in this case a Kadet kit for a CZ75)

I know it doesn't qualify as a firearm and thus doesn't have to be registered, but do I have to update my registration certificate to indicate the original firearm can also shoot .22lr?

I just moved to Vancouver Island and was told that the Malahat range gets spot checks from the RCMP from time to time. I wanted to double check that all my ducks were in a row, so I called the CFC simply to ask if my 9mm CZ needed its registration changed for a conversion kit. The lady I spoke with said that "I should." Whatever that means. She was indelicate about trying to find out if the barrel had been shortened to prohibited length, so I really don't think I impressed it upon her enough that it was a factory, drop-in conversion kit and that it would still be able to shoot 9mm. Like an idiot, I agreed to changing the registration just to avoid future hassles..

Today I recieved a letter requesting "digital images of the barrel with a caliper or micrometer reading," among other things. They even went to the effort to highlight the important bits. However, it also says that if I don't comply within 30 days the application will be denied. Anyone know what happens then?
Click to expand...
Just a thought; How is a switch barrel pistol like the Thomson Center series or the Valmet double rifle registered? (when the registry was still alive)
Do we have to register auxiliary cartridges as well?
 
So if you have a receiver (with no slide) and a conversion kit stores seperatly, that's use occassionally, then what's the protocol?
 
Why have you got your panties in a knot. Caliber isn't listed on your reg cert. if your checked they are going by the serial no on your frame.
 
I think the OP is naive but really, he represents the ideal we should all be able to strive for. He is trying to play by the rulez I.E. he's a law abiding firearms owner.
Its unfortunate that our laws are so unclear and the people charged with administering them actually punish people that are trying to do the right thing.
 
Toto said:
So if you have a receiver (with no slide) and a conversion kit stores seperatly, that's use occassionally, then what's the protocol?
Click to expand...

As long as the 'receiver' [which is considered the firearm under the law] is registered [if it is classed as 'restricted' ie. as in a handgun].

There is no legal obligation to register a conversion unit unless the conversion unit fits the description of the law in my post # 7 above [ie. that the conversion is permanent on the receiver].

:canadaFlag:
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NAA.
 
NAA said:
'Course, to avoid any hassle, you could just "sell" your conversion kit and thereby avoid any need to go through the hoops.

As you know, since, it is a "conversion kit" and not a "receiver" or "firearm" itself, under the law it does not require registration unless permanently used on a receiver to change the cartridge [if different than the original cartridge on record for that receiver/firearm].

So, if in the "future" you were to acquire "another" conversion unit, [or even reacquire this particular unit from the person you sold it to ;) ] what I would do is, keep the firearm assembled as it is registered [ie 9mm]. Then when you take the conversion unit with the base firearm to the range, assemble & use it there with the conversion unit, then change it back over when you leave again.

Since, the "conversion" is not "permanent" there is no need to re-register or add the conversion unit to the registration of the primary firearm.

That's how I understand it.

I've been using Colt .22 conversion units for years with various 1911A1 [.45ACP] receivers.

:canadaFlag:
--------------
NAA.
Click to expand...

Perfect response. To add to this I bought a complete used .40cal slide/barrel assembly for my M&P 9MM. Cost $100. The frame is registered. I shoot the gun at our range in either 9MM or .40cal. I don't see any reason to have the gun re-registered as a 9MM/.40cal.

Take Care

Bob
 
The cz is still a 9mm not a .22cal...............

the woman you were talking to dosent know that once you "convert" it to .22cal you can put it back to 9mm..........


ignorance on her part imo

the gun is still 9mm, the kit is 22

why change the registration?

it isnt a permanent "conversion"
 
NAA said:
As long as the 'receiver' [which is considered the firearm under the law] is registered [if it is classed as 'restricted' ie. as in a handgun].

There is no legal obligation to register a conversion unit unless the conversion unit fits the description of the law in my post # 7 above [ie. that the conversion is permanent on the receiver].

:canadaFlag:
-------------
NAA.
Click to expand...

Thanks NAA.
 
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