Moly Bullets Question

mmattockx

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I was looking for some 168gr .308 Amax bullets last weekend, but WSS only had the moly coated ones. These were to be used in my Garand, but I passed on them because I was uncertain of the effects of the moly coating.

1) Can I shoot both uncoated and coated bullets interchangably without problems?

2) Any problems with using a moly coated bullet on game?

Thanks,
Mark
 
If you are going to switch between coated and uncoated bullets it is always best to clean the barrel right down to a bare barrel before switching.
Moly coating will not be a problem with a hunting bullets. That being said I hope you are not thinking of using AMax bullets for hunting. They are a great bullet for punching holes in paper but they should not be used for game.
 
That being said I hope you are not thinking of using AMax bullets for hunting. They are a great bullet for punching holes in paper but they should not be used for game.

Well, Hornady lists them as suitable for medium game and I was contemplating trying them for deer in the Garand. Velocities are low and deer are pretty thin skinned critters overall. It is not my first choice, but I have been having issues finding a suitable bullet that the M1 likes and this was more of a last resort. My first choice was the 165gr SST, but I can't find them anywhere locally or online and I have been looking since May at least.

Thanks for the answers gentlemen, if I need to go down this road at least I now know that the moly won't be a problem.

Mark
 
You will not be disapointed using an A-max on game. For those of us that have actaully shot them into animals, have found them to be very effective.

R.
 
Moly is OK for crtain things. I use them on my Bravo-51. But that is only to reduce the barrel wear and tear. I do find at distances over 600m that the moly does increase the accuracy. I personally do not use them for hunting.
 
1- yes

2- no

Amax work VERY WELL for hunting. I have a friend that uses 7mm 162 Amax's for long-range sheep hunting. They are high BC and accurate, and their terminal effects are devastating on sheep/deer sized game.
 
Thanks for the help, guys. I went and picked up the moly Amax's this afternoon and will do some load testing this weekend. I also picked up some 6.5mm Amax's for testing in my 6.5x55. If it likes them I may use them for deer this fall as well.

Mark
 
Just remember that some barrels need ALOT of shooting before the moly layer is embedded in the steel. Once the layer is established, you can do alot of shooting before fouling becomes an issue.

But if you need to clean the bore - got wet/dirty - you will need to re establish this layer before your loads will shoot the same.

I stopped using moly because of this. I found moly to really help in rough bores.

Keep impact velocity at 2500fps or SLOWER and you will get very nice on game performance. Not a bone breaking bullet of course but works just fine on boiler room shots.

YMMV.

Jerry
 
Since this is the Precision Forum rather than the Hunting Rifle forum, I would suggest you pass on the Moly coated bullets unless you intend to use them exclusively.

To obtain the best results with Moly coated bullets, the bore must be treated. But this is pretty simple really and there are a number of ways to do it. A light grease with Moly suspended in it like the product sold by Miss Molly is one example, it can be applied from an aerosol Moly spray, or the messy way is to simply use a funnel and dump Moly into the bore making sure it does not coat the chamber. Moly adheres readily to metal surfaces such as barrel steel or bullet jackets, and no special hoops must be jumped through to obtain good results . . . with one exception. The barrel must be clean and dry. No lube can be present. Using a bore brush or a tight fitting patch on a jag, to work the Moly back and forth, 10-20 passes will do it, which burnishes the barrel.

Treating the bore by shooting Moly coated bullets doesn't work and the results will be poor. Shooting naked bullets through a Moly coated bore doesn't work either. The logic goes like this; when loose Moly is observed through a microscope, it appears as almond shaped particles. When it is pushed under pressure through the bore of a rifle barrel, it layers out not unlike pushing on the top of a deck of cards across a table. The Moly adheres to the metal under little pressure, and fills in voids in the metal surface resulting in a uniform and slippery surface. If there is copper fouling in the barrel, that too will be coated and will leave a lump in the bore surface which will prove very difficult to remove at a later date. Should you attempt to treat the bore by shooting Moly coated bullets through it, the moly will be stripped off the bullet and will be laid down on the barrel, but only for a very short distance because the thickness of the Moly on the bullet is so thin. Once the bullet has been stripped of its Moly, it will foul the remainder of the bore as would a naked bullet. A subsequent shot will now place moly over that fouling for another short distance, then that bullet will foul the remainder of the bore, this will continue as long as you continue to shoot and the bore surface will be lumpy and inconsistent. Conversely if you shoot naked bullets through a Moly treated bore, the bullet will pick up moly from the bore leaving bare spots in the bore which will be fouled by the passage of subsequent bullets, again leaving a very uneven and inconsistent bore surface.

We know that treating the bore is easy, so if you intend to shoot Moly, you might as well do it properly. Treating bullets is equally simple, although some folks make it sound complicated. Get a pill bottle, like a large Tylenol or Vitamin bottle, a 100 capsule bottle will hold a 100 ct box of .224 or 6mm bullets, which should be poured into the bottle without touching. To this add about an eighth of a teaspoon of Moly powder, I use the .7cc powder measure from my Lee spoon measure kit. Now put the bottle in a vibratory tumbler, and allow it to run for about 2 hrs. Dump the bullets onto a clean rag and rub the excess Moly off, then dump onto a second clean rag and repeat. Thats it. The finished product will really impress you.

The quality and grade of the Moly is all important. I use super fine, 1.5 micron, 100% pure Molybdenum Disulfide that I obtained from Rose Mill in Hartford Conn. I bought a 1 pound container which will probably last me the rest of my life.
 
If you are going to switch between coated and uncoated bullets it is always best to clean the barrel right down to a bare barrel before switching.

Why?

The one thing to keep in mind when using Moly is that it is hygroscopic (will absorb water) so it is important to wet patch after shooting to give the bore a coating of oil and thus prevent potential corrosion.

I have been using Moly for the better part of a decade and it does work. It just requires that you understand its limitations and potential downside (corrosion).

I have a 6BR barrel that has several thousand rounds through it and still looks factory new inside.
 
I have had nasty results using moly on chromoly barrels rain and even the humidity from the air could ruin the barrel it will etch the bore .
If you live in an area with high humidity or hunt when it is raining you will wan't to clean it often.
Moly is only used in my stainless barrels now I ruined a few steel barrels before I was aware of what was happening.
 
Moly-coated bullets have shot extremely well in my Rem 40X F-Class rifle (223 Rem with a 1:8 twist MacLennan Heavy Palma barrel) and I have the results to prove it. I shoot factory 80 gr Sierra Match King Molys.

My observations:
- no barrel treatment carried out;
- very little cleaning required (however, I do clean the barrel after each match); and,
- I can shoot at least 250 rounds or more and not even worry about cleaning.
 
You are justified to be concerned with 'moly ring' especially in a milsurp rifle.
If I were you I would stay away from moly bullets in your Garand. You likely have some measure of throat erosion or frost in the grooves which is an issue for moly bullets and irregular moly deposits. If you were running bench rest grade barrels that would be a different story.

Having said that if you have fouling issues you may want to consider moly paste to line the whole bore and then run standard copper jacket bullets out of her.

I've done this with a few lee enfields now and I've reduced copper fouling in them by about 50% which is considerable if you are into competition. My personal experiences of reduced copper fouling over a month straight of shooting every day are considerable enough for me to warrant it as a recommendation.

The process requires making a lead bore plug and lapping the rifling and grooves before the moly paste treatment but has big benefits to militrary surplus service rifles that are a little tired. The moly layer is about one micron thick - makes your bore nice and slipery :) . I'll likely be writing an article on this process this winter and displaying it on my blog (Riflechair's Lounge).

Enjoy your Garand. I've taken blacktails with my old garand. Great rifles. Just make sure you lube it lots - especially if you're in driving rain. And always give your bore a good coat of oil for storage.
 
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Just an update.

The moly Amax's didn't shoot very well in the Garand, so I tumbled them to remove the moly (suggested to me in a PM) and tried again. Got superb groups that way (less than 3" repeatedly at 200yds, with iron sights) and loaded my hunting ammo with these.

Yesterday was opening day of my season and I shot this mulie doe late in the afternoon at about 125yds on the run. One shot put her down after a short run, with a through and through wound and no signs that the bullet blew up or otherwise performed poorly. The little guy with me is my youngest, on his first hunt ever. He got quite the experience, up to helping hold the deer while I gutted her.

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Thanks to all for their help on this subject, it worked out very well in the end.

Mark
 
What velocity are your amax's shooting at? I have a great load for my .308 that I shoot well and would love to be able to hunt with.

I don't have a chronograph to confirm (yet), but they shouldn't be much over 2600fps, maybe 2650fps at most. I am loading with 48.0gr of IMR4064, which is a light 30-06 load.

The bullet entered at the second last rib and angled forward, exiting mid rib cage on the far side and taking a rib with it. No signs of the bullet breaking up, but I didn't hit any substantial bone, either. The exit hole is about the size of my thumb, not a huge gaping crater as many of the super high velocity magnums will leave.

If my 2600fps muzzle velocity is correct, the impact velocity at 125yds would be under 2400fps, explaining the lack of meat damage and no bullet explosion.

Mark
 
Your experience with having the bullet stay together is interesting. I've taken a few deer with the 208 A-max and they have all exploded. The longest at 385m didnt make it through the tissue on the front side....ripped the front shoulder off with impact though. I send them out at 2840fps out of a 300wsm so they are'nt going all that fast either.
 
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