My New M1 Garand! -- Opinions Welcome -- * Pics added* 1943 matching What's it worth?

student of history

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Hey guys,

Just picked this M1 Garand up last week! It's a beautiful WWII manufactured Springfield Armory variant. Serial number dates it to September of 1943. The rifle has all of its wartime parts most notably the original 43 dated barrel, a beautiful GAW stock set and lock bars. What do you guys think? Oh, and just out of curiosity, what do ya'll figure a rifle in this condition is worth? I'm not looking to get rid of it, I'm just kinda wondering.

Here are a few pics.

As always, thanks for everyone's time!

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That sure is nice, really beautiful stock as well! As for value somewhere starting at 1k and up is my guess. My M1 knowledge is limited to loading/unloading and firing though :p
 
950 - 1100 with the sling. Nice piece. Oh and that's pending bore condition.

my opinion is that if it's ALL matching like you said, given it's condition it would be like CMP collector's grade garands, and would be worth like upwards of $1500 in that condition. The sling alone is worth like $70 bucks

I bought mine last year for $900, it's a shooter in excellent condition, one of the Danish returns. Has a danish barrel in excellent condition but parts are from various years so it's nowhere as nice as yours

I've seen garands in rough condition getting $1000... they are only going to go up in value

also I would agree with Bart that barrel condition being important. Even collectors are only interested in a serviceable rifle
 
Thanks for the responses guys! I actually bit the bullet and got this one imported from the US so it's not the conventional Danish refurb that we're used to up here. Like I said, it's period correct. I believe the TE is between 3 and 4 so I'd say that's pretty servicable.

I didn't realize that the M1907 slings were worth that much. I've got two from WWII and one with a 1918 date on it.
 
my opinion is that if it's ALL matching like you said, given it's condition it would be like CMP collector's grade garands, and would be worth like upwards of $1500 in that condition. The sling alone is worth like $70 bucks

I bought mine last year for $900, it's a shooter in excellent condition, one of the Danish returns. Has a danish barrel in excellent condition but parts are from various years so it's nowhere as nice as yours

I've seen garands in rough condition getting $1000... they are only going to go up in value

also I would agree with Bart that barrel condition being important. Even collectors are only interested in a serviceable rifle

My Opinion is that anyone can put together a fake! Been around any American Boards????

I have and read plenty of posts from the ex marines and ROTC guys. They all say the same thing. Whenever their platoons were cleaning their rifles all the parts went into one pile and were mismatched after the first cleaning SAs, Winnies, H&Rs, IH etc. From reading that first hand knowledge I'd have to say if anyone says that they have an "Original" all matching Garand it's because someone along the road has faked it. Period.

No such thing of an "All Matching Garand" only if it's buried in the cornerstone in springfield straight off the line.

Edit: Just saw the 43 on the barrel ... Does it match the Serial? If so I'd have to agree with ceilingcat
 
I have and read plenty of posts from the ex marines and ROTC guys. They all say the same thing. Whenever their platoons were cleaning their rifles all the parts went into one pile and were mismatched after the first cleaning SAs, Winnies, H&Rs, IH etc. From reading that first hand knowledge I'd have to say if anyone says that they have an "Original" all matching Garand it's because someone along the road has faked it. Period.

No such thing of an "All Matching Garand" only if it's buried in the cornerstone in springfield straight off the line.

I completely disagree. Not all originals have been "faked" and there is still lots of nice stuff out there! I have seen in private collections many original Garands, M1 Carbines, M1911A1's, ect. ect. here in Canada and in the United States. I own some pretty nice original USGI stuff myself.

*edit: Also, not all USGI weapons have been subject to the cleaning parties your friends have described. The CMP sold many original M1 Garands that were never even issued!

An experienced collector will be able to determine if the gun is original with the gun in hand. Some good pictures would probably be able to detemine almost everything as well. Every part of these guns have distinguishable features, and with experience you can tell if wear patterns on the parts are matching and original. There are Garand experts here on CGN who would be able to tell you relatively easily if this is the real deal.

The Garand posted above looks really nice from what I can see! It's getting tougher to find the WW2 examples with original barrels up here, and I understand why the OP decided to import.

Unfortunately it's very hard to determine true value until the gun is actually for sale and price is determined with the next owner. This one is unquestionably worth somewhat more than the typically pretty rough post-war re-work M1 Garands we are seeing on the EE for $900-1100. I've noticed a disturbing trend in these threads where often the posters replying will give very low estimates, perhaps these folks are hoping it will get listed and they can pick it up for a good price ;-)

-Steve
 
Depending upon condition of course but that it has what appears to be the correct barrel for 1943 SA receiver makes it worth more than the run of the mill Garand. Same with cartouches visible on the stock although cartouches can be faked.

There was a good thread in the Milsurps.com forum at one time on spotting fake cartouches.
 
I completely disagree. Not all originals have been "faked" and there is still lots of nice stuff out there! I have seen in private collections many original Garands, M1 Carbines, M1911A1's, ect. ect. here in Canada and in the United States. I own some pretty nice original USGI stuff myself.

*edit: Also, not all USGI weapons have been subject to the cleaning parties your friends have described. The CMP sold many original M1 Garands that were never even issued!

An experienced collector will be able to determine if the gun is original with the gun in hand. Some good pictures would probably be able to detemine almost everything as well. Every part of these guns have distinguishable features, and with experience you can tell if wear patterns on the parts are matching and original. There are Garand experts here on CGN who would be able to tell you relatively easily if this is the real deal.

The Garand posted above looks really nice from what I can see! It's getting tougher to find the WW2 examples with original barrels up here, and I understand why the OP decided to import.

Unfortunately it's very hard to determine true value until the gun is actually for sale and price is determined with the next owner. This one is unquestionably worth somewhat more than the typically pretty rough post-war re-work M1 Garands we are seeing on the EE for $900-1100. I've noticed a disturbing trend in these threads where often the posters replying will give very low estimates, perhaps these folks are hoping it will get listed and they can pick it up for a good price ;-)

-Steve

I'm willing to bet that most, if not all those garands went through a rearsenal at one point aswell ;), not making them original. An original is probably 1 in 100,000.

For a WWII example there is no way a Garand used in WWII never went through a rearsenal. Maybe the Barrel on this one was still good enough to not be rebarreled after the war. When I first saw the post I thought I saw a 48 not a 43 which if it is the original barrel good for the owner, However, It would have been stripped down at rearsenal with all parts thrown in the bins of the same and when it got the the gauges and gauged good wouldn't have been rebarreled. as for the rest there are a few guys here who are great at verifying all numbers stamped. would be interesting to see what they have to say.

You seen the prices of the latest Garands for sale on the EE here. Fawk I thought the might just be JFKs Garand with a price tag of $2500. There's also another one up there at $1800. :rolleyes:
 
I'm willing to bet that most, if not all those garands went through a rearsenal at one point aswell ;), not making them original. An original is probably 1 in 100,000.

For a WWII example there is no way a Garand used in WWII never went through a rearsenal. Maybe the Barrel on this one was still good enough to not be rebarreled after the war. When I first saw the post I thought I saw a 48 not a 43 which if it is the original barrel good for the owner, However, It would have been stripped down at rearsenal with all parts thrown in the bins of the same and when it got the the gauges and gauged good wouldn't have been rebarreled. as for the rest there are a few guys here who are great at verifying all numbers stamped. would be interesting to see what they have to say.

I agree where you are coming from that MOST of the M1 Garands on the market have gone to the arsenals at some point, but there is still some nice originals as well that have managed to stay original for various reasons, and they do occasionally come along without any faking.

You seen the prices of the latest Garands for sale on the EE here. Fawk I thought the might just be JFKs Garand with a price tag of $2500. There's also another one up there at $1800. :rolleyes:

This I can agree on! :)

-Steve
 
You need to check drawing numbers and lot codes to find out how original it is. And as Steve suggested - wear patterns. The garand experts can tell you better what to look for or you can get Scot Duff's book.

But it looks very good from the pics. How's the finish on the metal parts?
 
I've noticed a disturbing trend in these threads where often the posters replying will give very low estimates, perhaps these folks are hoping it will get listed and they can pick it up for a good price ;-)

-Steve

Exactly. Lot's of Cheapskates giving poor advice for their self serving interests. You see lots of these posts over the years.

You even see where a Seller really got Low Balled and the next week the Buyer puts the said item on the EE right after he receives it for 2 to 6 times the price.
 
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I've noticed a few guys come on here, ask for a price range then try to flip whatever they've got...but that's not my intention. I just bought it a few days ago so I'm not looking to get rid of this anytime soon. People can be honest here haha. I'm just genuinely interested in a) what you guys think of it and b) what it's aprox. value is? Despite what I'm told, it's not going to surface on the EE next week :p
 
Collectors value Garands in the following sequence; unmolested original factory built rifles, US arsenal rebuilt rifles, and lastly, restorations done by individuals in their home "armoury/workshop". Within each of these categories, the value is set by condition.

One can easily determine if a rifle is "parts correct" by scrutinizing the drawing numbers and makers marks IAW the Scott Duff books and then relating these to the receiver and barrel make and date. Parts correct rifles can either be factory built rifles in original condition or restorations where the restorer has sifted through various parts to make the rifle "correct".

IMHO there are very few factory original rifles in circulation. These rifles were in service for 30-35 years, and the vast majority were rebuilt one or more times while in military use. Rebuilds continued right up to the late 1960s ( I have a very nice Letterkenny rebuild of an Oct 1942 receiver done in 1969). It is interesting to look at the rebuild flow chart which was used by the US arsenals as this offers a good insight as to why so few rifles are "parts correct". On receipt at the arsenal the rifle was completely stripped with ALL parts automatically going through an inspection and refinishing process and then into the inventory bins, except for the barrel, bolt, and op rod which followed the receiver through to the end unless any of these 3 key components were found unservicable and replaced during the inspection process. Following reparkerizing, the receiver and barrel/op rod/bolt combo (assuming these components made it through inspections) were then built up into complete, as new, rifles using either new or reconditioned parts from the bins. Any and all parts were used w/o regard to manufacturer or drawing number as all were interchangeable.

Those who carried a rifle in military service can attest to the toll taken on an individual rifle while in use by the soldier. Rifles were subjected to harsh use and weathering incl climbing in and out of vehicles, bayonet drill, hitting the ground to take up firing positions, parade square bashing etc., as well as shooting without regular cleaning. US military .30-06 ammo was made with corrosive priming compounds until 1952 and a lot of the corrosive primed stuff was used long after this date. This, as well as poor cleaning techniques, accounts for the high replacement rate of barrels. That said, original WW2 era receiver/ barrel combinations can still be found with the barrels in servicable condition, although this is the exception. Stocks and handguards were other fast moving replacement items as these were frequently cracked or broken in use. The vast majority of rifles were also re-parkerized one or more times as the finish wears off through handling and use by troops.

Time and numbers, as well as high grade appearance, persuades me that most "minty" (love that mouthwash flavor) "parts correct/matching" rifles that are seen these days are in fact restorations to one extent or another. I have restored many rifles from scratch with new barrels and wood and new or reparkerized parts and refinished wood and find it a great hobby. I have also put together a number or "parts correct" rifles, although availability of original stocks and barrels is often the limiting factor for a 100% restoration. There is absolutely nothing wrong with a restored rifle as long as it isn't falsely portrayed as a factory original with the idea of inflating it's value. As far as values are concerned, my sense is that most people prefer a nice clean shootable rifle of WW2 vintage, so this is where the money is, except for scarcer models like the M1C/M1D sniper models which have a market of their own. All said, supply and demand, coupled with condition and originality, will ultimately determine the market value.
 
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