My 'new' Winchester 1886 range results (photos)

Win 38-55

Win 38-55

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Last week I picked up an original Winchester Model 1886, 45-70, received in the warehouse July 1, 1890. Some of you who have been at the gun shows in Eastern Canada may have seen it at some of them. It's a nice rifle, with still a bit of case color here and there on the receiver, and a bore that is bright with strong rifling and zero pitting. Here's a photo of the old classic.

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I want to develop a load for this rifle that has the same ballistics as the original BP load, which means 405 grain cast bullet leaving the barrel at around 1,300 fps or slightly less. I've been trying a few different powders and it looks like SR4759 and 2400 will be my two powders of choice. Both of them have similar pressure curves to BP for the same bullet and ballistics. Today I tried 2400 for the first time, putting 21 grains behind a plain base cast bullet of 405 grains. It gave 1,254 fps with an extreme spread of 77 fps. I'd like to boost this up another 40 fps but here's the results, 5 shots into 2 & 5/16" at 100 yards. I was shooting with open iron sights, so I'm sure the limiting factor is me, not the rifle. Here's a photo of the target ....

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My SR 4759 load put 4 shots into 1 & 1/4" at 100 yards, but the fifth was a flyer that went in about 2" low, so I don't know about that load. I've got some more loaded up and will try it again, just in case the flyer was me. This rifle is going Whitetail Deer hunting this fall, along with my original Winchester Model 1873 38-40.
 
The old BP rule is to decrease your charge if you're seeing horizontal spread. That said, you're getting pretty good results. What mould are you using? I've had good success with Lyman 457193 and 1:20 alloy.

That's a beautiful rifle. Good find.
 
BigUglyMan said:
The old BP rule is to decrease your charge if you're seeing horizontal spread. That said, you're getting pretty good results. What mould are you using? I've had good success with Lyman 457193 and 1:20 alloy.
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These are cast bullets that I bought from someone else a few years ago before I started casting my own. I still have 500 of these old bullets to use up. I don't have a 405 grain mould yet, so your recommendation is good info for me. I'll be doing some more load tweaking.
 
Rcbs 405 fn gc, Lyman 457193, are both good. I like the gas check. The 500 kick like hell. I have a Tom Ballard adjustable with many greese groves,it works well. Nice rifle it will be lots of fun.
 
a j cave said:
Rcbs 405 fn gc, Lyman 457193, are both good. I like the gas check.
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I try to stay away from gas checks to save money. Gas checks usually give better accuracy for sure, but if I fool around with the load enough, I can usually get by without them and save myself some $$.
 
John Y Cannuck said:
By the way, what are you using for loads and bullets in the 38-40?
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I'm using 13.5 grains of 2400 under a soft cast (pure wheelweights) 180 grain RCBS .40-180-CM bullet. This gives traditional black powder velocities at almost the same pressure as the black powder pressure curve. I know that nowadays, fellows are used to 338 Win Mag or 7 mm Rem Mag power for deer and my load seems way underpowered, but I know a number of fellows who hunt with the same load, and it typically yields one-shot kills on Whitetail Deer, if the shot is placed properly.
 
1:20 doesn't lead much in my 1885 running at 1950 FPS. 1350 shouldn't lead at all. 457193 is a very traditional 405 mould, though my mould drops them at 418gr.
 
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