Need a bear gun...Marlin Lever?

mdbuckle

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I really need a bear gun and I am narrowed down to a big bore lever gun. I do not handload. I would like to have a .45-70 "guide" rifle, but seeing that I do not handload, factory ammo leaves a lot to be desired. Should I just go with a .444 instead? Ammunition for these calibers is not availiable here so I will have to get it shipped in. What about this leverevolution ammo...is it availiable anywhere in canada? Lots of questions I know...:D

I need a bear gun that is all I want. Newfoundland bears can be very much on the large side. I will be hunting close cover over bait and shots will be under 200 for sure.
 
How about the 450 Marlin? That oughta work as well. And don't discount the 45-70 even in the factory loads. Those big bullets really do the job. It doesn't have to be going a million miles an hour to get the job done.
 
both reccomendations of the 450 Marlin & 350 Rem Mag are spot on. Also Browning BLR levers in 358 Win

Recoil with 450 is more than factory loaded 45/70 or 444. Big thump, but nothing that cant be mastered with practice. There lies a bit of a problem, as 450M ammo is $$$$ and can be hard to find. Only one load out there too, but it's a good'un, 350 grain Hornady flat point @ 2000+ fps.

even though shots are going to be usually moderate like you said, I like a bit more reach than the Marlin levers. Something that is pushing 2400-2600 fps with a heavy for caliber bullet, like a 338 Win Mag w/ 250s, 35 Whelen or 350 Rem Mag w/ 250s, or 375 h&h w/ 300 gr. :) Rock em hard
 
I have two 1895 Marlin's, one in 444 & the other 45-70 GS. Both are good choices. To pick 'one' I would have to go with the 1895GS in 45-70. I can't really comment on the 450 Marlin but from the reloading manuals, there isn't much difference between that & the 45-70. Perhaps a slight edge of 100 f/sec going to the 450. If you don't reload it becomes a different 'kettle of fish' as factory 45-70 is loaded down for safety concerns of older firearms. That being the case, if I didn't reload my choice would be the 450.
 
I have a Marlin 1895GS in 45-70 that I load to 450 Marlin velocities. It is an excellent stopper but as you said you do not reload so that leaves the GS series out for you.

Browning makes a stainless steel, laminate stocked, detachable mag BLR chambered in 450 Marlin. Marlin has the new 1895MXLR 450 Marlin, which has a 24" barrel that may be longer than you are looking for but it can always be cut shorter if it is too long for your hunting conditions.

If you choose either of these rifles I would install an after market recoil pad, either a Limbsaver or my personal choice a Kick-Eez Magnum model pad.

I would also recommend that you do not get the barrel ported.

I also installed 2 piece Warne nickle bases and mount a 2-7X Leupold Compact series scope with Leupold quick detach rings. When I don't want the scope on I just remove it and install my XS Ghost Ring Backup sight system. This sight system is a must for close in fast shooting. :)
 
I'm a handloader so I'd go with the 45-70. But seeign as you aren't I'd say get the 450 in either the 1895 Marlin or the Browning BLR (OK, I wouldn't get the BLR but I know that just saying it will make Amphib crazy!).
 
280_ACKLEY said:
Remington M7 CDL in 350 Rem Mag topped with a little 2-7x33 VXII or 4X Leupould... now THAT'S a bear gun!

280_ACKLEY

now that's an off the shelf bear gun combo of the highest order...more range than any pumpkin chucking lever gun.....:D

I type this as I sit here admiring my Ruger M77 350 mag with 2.5-8X Leupold......now this is a bear gun too......

ruger350_edited.jpg
 
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todbartell said:

There lies a bit of a problem, as 450M ammo is $$$$ and can be hard to find. Only one load out there too, but it's a good'un, 350 grain Hornady flat point @ 2000+ fps.



$28 a box at wholesale...that is not bad at all. Like I said, I will have to order my own ammunition as there is no place in town that stocks big bore rifle ammo. .450 ammunition is still cheaper the the .350 Rem Mag. You guys may have me sold on the bigger .450 cartridge.

If I could get my hands on some leverevolution ammunition, I would probably get a .45-70. As it is not readily availiable yet, I am at a loss.
 
I have to say that the Hornady Leverlution bullets don't really do anything for me. I have learnt that a good hard cast gas checked .458" bullet with the widest meplat that I can find that still gives reliable feeding is what does the job for me in my 45-70.

A spitzer in a 45-70 doesn't really translate into much of a retained velocity/flatter trajectory gain @ 200 yards.
 
Well, I would also highly recommend a medium bore bolt, or, failing that, a Marlin GS in 45-70 with handloads. But the only thing I can recommend within your criteria is the 450 Marlin or 444. You're pretty much going to have to suck it up and pay the premium on the hard-to-find ammo, and probably mail-order it in, maybe a year's supply at a time.
 
I live in Prince George. there are 2 gunshops. both carry .450 marlin. they will rape me for $50 a box.

if I order from wholesale/russels it's $36 a box. 20 rounds lasts a long time. how much is a box of premium .350mag? cheap .338mag at crappytire is almost $40 a box......

I don;t think ammo availablity or price will be much of an issue. if you want chep ammo buy a .308.
 
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I prefer the .458 Winchester to the .45-70, as it can be loaded to any power level you like, but you can't beat the Marlins for for handiness. The .444 rates much lower in my estimation as it is commonly loaded with pistol bullets. A good hard cast .429 bullet in the 300-350 grain range would help this round significantly. The factory loaded .458 Winchester is either too powerful or has unsuitable bullets for your needs, the .45-70 is anemic as factory loaded, and the .444 suffers from bum bullets - so if you choose anything from this selection you do need to handload your ammo.

I find myself in reluctant agreement with those who champion the M-7 350 Magnum. I have owned several 700 Remingtons - some fed well, some fed poorly - my .350 mag was one which happened to feed well. If I was going to go this route I would be more inclined to have a gunsmith built bolt gun - probably on a '98 Mauser - rather than an off the shelf model that I would have to tweak into shape by trial and error. A Remington custom shop rifle should do as well, but this is an assumption - I've never owned one.

A medium bore round which is getting more North American attention these days is the 9.3X62. With it's moderate velocity, light recoil, and heavy for caliber 286 gr. bullet, it would be an excellent bear/moose gun, with a bit more horse-power than what is available from the .350 magnum.

My person favorite in the medium category is the .375. It combines flat trajectory, moderate velocity for good bullet performance, and manageable recoil - if at the upper end of manageable for a seasonal shooter. There are nearly as many bullets available in .375" as there are in .308". There are an incredible number of .375 H&H rifles to choose from - for all budgets from poppers to sultans - in all sorts of configurations from long barrel African plains rifles to Mannlicher carbines. If you are in a part of Newfoundland which has the occasional visiting white bear, a .375 might be your best option.

If the rifle is to be scoped, I prefer a fixed power scope less than 3X, but a variable in the 1.5-5X, 2-7X or 1.75-6X are all compact with generous eye relief. If the rifle is only going to wear metallic sights, a ghost ring and post is my preference. The ghost ring should have a very thin rim and a aperture of about 1/4". If the aperture sight you buy has thread-in thick rim apertures, sighting without them will provide an aperture of approximately the correct size. The post can be had from any number of commercial suppliers, but I had mine made from a piece of brass stock, which appears white when set against a dark background and black when set against a light background.
 
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The .444 rates much lower in my estimation as it is commonly loaded with pistol bullets.

While its true that pistol bullets can be loaded in the .444 and Remington does still sell .444 ammo with hollowpoints designed for the 44 mag there is good hunting ammo/bullets available for the triple 4. I'd go with Hornaday's 265 grain flat points designed for the 444 which uses interlock bullets.

But what am I talking about :rolleyes: I went with the 45-70 for my lever thumper of choice. I would still like a 444 some day and if I didn't hand load I'd probably have one...
 
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