Need advice on H4198 in 500 S&W cast reload

[M1Garandfather]

Hello... I have bought one of the H&R Handi-rifles in 500 S&W cal... I am starting out with some cast bullets , the Lee 501-440 mold... They seem like a good bullet , come out right at .501" ... With the gas check installed and usung a soft alloy mix , they weigh in around 462 grs.

Now I want to reload some with H4198 powder I have here... I realize this is not a normal powder for this cal , but should be okay for a reduced velocity load which I am after for the first go round...

I can't seem to locate any reliable info on the net with this powder , and Hodgdon does not have any listed on their website either....

Anyone try this powder in the 500 S&W?

Thoughts & comments?

Thanks

Bob

 

[Gibbs505]

Then I would say that noone has tried it and, unless you have a pressure gauge, maybe you shouldn't either!

 

[Boomer]

Normally switching to a slower powder reduces pressure. IMR 4227 is a commonly loaded powder in the .500 Smith and IMR 4198 is a step slower than 4227. I don't think it would be an unreasonable choice for your heavy bullet loads. I would try a mid range 4227 load and work up from there.

 

[Johnn Peterson]

X2 on Gibbs505 take on the bullet/powder combo. I shoot a 500 S&W and the 440grGC is one of the cast bullets I use. I haven't found mention made of H4198 used with a 44ogr cast in any of the info I have. You may be able to use it but for heavy loads, I'd be tempted to go with something more like H110, Lil' Gun or Win296. Even at that, with say some of the slower burning powders like H110 there can be ignition problems with some of the older cases that take large pistol primers. H4198 has a slower burn rate yet. A lot of the newer cases/brass, such as Starline, now accept large rifle primers to correct that. For something a little lighter, I find Unique to be a good choice.

 

[mbogo3]

H-110 and Win 296 are one and the same and should have mag primers.Not what most books reccomend for cast but worth a go. As stated Unique would be a gooder.......................Harold

 

[Johnn Peterson]

H-110 and Win 296 are one and the same and should have mag primers.Not what most books reccomend for cast but worth a go. As stated Unique would be a gooder.......................Harold

Even with CCI 350 Large Pistol Magnum primers, I was still getting the odd 'fizzle' or partial burn using H110. Any of the old cases I have, primarily Hornady, that are made for LP primers I save and use in my lighter loads. For the heavier loads, I've never experienced that same problem when using Starline brass and CCI 200 Large Rifle primers. I believe now the majority of component manufacturers make their brass to accept Large Rifle Primers, just to eliminate that problem.

 

[Boomer]

This discussion got me interested enough to look for evidence that 4198 is a suitable powder for the .500 S&W. Cartridges of the World lists a round called the .50 Carbine in the obsolete cartridges section. This case was a shortened .50/70, which was 1.75" for the full length cartridge case. While the .50 Carbine is listed without dimensions, they say only to trim .50/70 or .50/90 Sharps to the correct length, it was probably similar to the .50-50 Maynard cartridge which had a length of 1.37" and was made in the same fashion and produced similar ballistics. While this is shorter than the .500 S&W's length of 1.625" the thicker walls of the modern round would result in a similar case volume. The factory load for the .50 Carbine was a 400 gr bullet pushed to 1200 fps, and the smokeless equivalent is 22 grs of 4198 for the same velocity. This would be pretty mild fired from a rifle. Your modern H&R is doubtlessly stronger than the Trapdoor Springfield so it would appear that 4198 would produce reasonable velocity without any pressure issues in the modern cartridge. Based on this, and the load data for 4227 and a 500 gr bullet from the Hornady manual, I would consider 22 grs a good starting load for the 462 gr bullet with 4198.

 

[Johnn Peterson]

Boomer, what you say sounds very reasonable. But again, the only thing I'd be tempted to watch out for is to use cases that are made to accept the large rifle primers when going for top end loads with slower burning powders. Admittedly, I've been pushing mine out of an 8 3/8" barrel so the longer barrel of a rifle 'may' do better with some of these slower burn rate powders.

When I first acquired my 500 S&W and started reloading for it, components and info were both pretty scarce. A very good source of info was John Taffin of the American Handgunner. He did an extensive amount of testing but again, his findings were formed on a basis of that cartridge in a handgun.

Also from the American Handgunner, Mark Hampton took the 500 S&W and used it on Elephant and Cape Buffalo in Zimbabwe, but again, in a handgun configuration.

 

[Johnn Peterson]

Boomer, what you say sounds very reasonable. But again, the only thing I'd be tempted to watch out for is to use cases that are made to accept the large rifle primers when going for top end loads with slower burning powders. Admittedly, I've been pushing mine out of an 8 3/8" barrel so the longer barrel of a rifle 'may' do better with some of these slower burn rate powders. I maintain however, for reliable ignition with slower burning powders like H110 in top end loads, large rifle primers are a definate requirement. I assume that for even slower burning powders, like H4198, the same would hold true.

When I first acquired my 500 S&W and started reloading for it, components and info were both pretty scarce. A very good source of info was John Taffin of the American Handgunner. He did an extensive amount of testing but again, his findings were formed on a basis of that cartridge in a handgun.

Also from the American Handgunner, Mark Hampton took the 500 S&W and used it on Elephant and Cape Buffalo in Zimbabwe, but again, in a handgun configuration. I'd dearly love to have that cartridge in a lever action, say like a Marlin 1895 GS.