Need help on using lee powder measure kit

kinggeorge168

kinggeorge168

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Hello, ALL
Anyone Know how is the Lee Powder Measure and slide chart works?!. I am loading 22-250 using the lee powder chart. The powder type I picked are Hodgdon H4198 and H4831...also picked Alliant powder reloader7. OKAY
The Lee loading tools come with a powder measure scoop#141...when I use the powder measure number 141 on all three powder type I picked...the amount of g in powder are different base on the slide chart.
Hodgdon H4198 shown 29.0g
Hodgdon H4831 shown 32.0g
Alliant reloader7 shown 29.5g
The loader Manuel shown to use fill scoop of powder...is the chart wrong?, how can 29.0g fit the same size scoop when using 32.0g of powder?!

Thanks in advance for the help.
 
so...32g of hodgdon H4831 powder, 29g of hodgdon H4198 and 29.5g of Reloader7 powder are the same amount of powder measures in one full scoop?
 
Yeah you got the hang of it. Its like a litre of water vs a litre of sand vs a litre of lead. The same measuring cup of different substances has a different weight depending on the density/mass of the substance.
 
kinggeorge168 said:
so...32g of hodgdon H4831 powder, 29g of hodgdon H4198 and 29.5g of Reloader7 powder are the same amount of powder measures in one full scoop?
Click to expand...

I think you are starting to get this stuff! :D
Pretty much for the same reasons that a cubic foot of styrofoam is lighter than a cubic foot of granite. They are not the same materials.

Buy or borrow a scale that you can use for a while. Spend some time checking your charges, to see how consistent you are able to throw them with the dippers. You should be able to get to .2 of a grain with reasonable caution. That is to say, they all come out very close to matching each other. Whether they match what the charge weight is supposed to be, that's another story to look at.

I shot an awful pile of gophers, and a fair few deer, loading without a scale, using dippers. The ammo worked fine and shot well enough. Steer clear of minimum and maximum loads, and you'll be fine.

You can build a conversion chart to hit weights that are not on the chart, by correlating the volume of the dipper, with the weight given on the chart for a given powder. Simple calculator work. Done some loading where I had to do two laps through the cases to fill them, once with one size dipper, once with another.

Cheers
Trev
 
My two cents

If you are as picky as I am about the charge you're going to load, I wouldn't go by volume, because it just isn't accurate enough. I have a set of the lee dippers I bought when I first started reloading. Back in the days when I didn't have much money. I still use the dippers, but only to draw a scoop of powder out of a container, which I promptly empty into the scale pan for an accurate weight. I do this when I'm feeling lazy and don't want to set up the powder measure for a new powder. I trickle in some powder for the final weight and then into the casing it goes. I think a scale is the only way to go.
 
Quigly said:
I still use the dippers, but only to draw a scoop of powder out of a container, which I promptly empty into the scale pan for an accurate weight. I do this when I'm feeling lazy and don't want to set up the powder measure for a new powder. I trickle in some powder for the final weight and then into the casing it goes. I think a scale is the only way to go.
Click to expand...

Exactly.
 
All the scoops that come with the lee powder measure kit have a number on each one of the scoops...like020, 108, 205...and so on. I knew as a fact, each number on the scoops represent an amount of powder for a caliber,...but how can you tell which number is for which caliber? for example, how can I tell which scoop to use for 30.06?
Thanks.
 
In theory, to determine the number of grains the scoop will give you (by volume), you need to read the chart that goes along with the measures. I don't mean to be rude, but you should also read the instructions carefully, if you do so, you will understand better the whole process.
You take your chart, select the right powder, then, you look at "MEASURE NUMBER" column, and, at right, the "GRAINS POWDER" column. Say you want to use 59 grains RL19, you match this number with the measure # you see on the left side. You may need either to split your charge or to give or add some fractions of grains to make a "perfect" match. Never exceed and never start at your loading manual maximum.

I don't follow whatever LEE is giving, I just take, say, the 1.0 CC cup, then, fill it with your chosen powder, drop it in a balance, and look how many grains it gives you. The weight ratios LEE charts are giving do not always match reality.

Now, there are also tables giving the internal volume of each commercial cases (average), and you can also measure it yourself in filling up your fired cases with water and weighting the water content.
 
kinggeorge168 said:
All the scoops that come with the lee powder measure kit have a number on each one of the scoops...like020, 108, 205...and so on. I knew as a fact, each number on the scoops represent an amount of powder for a caliber,...but how can you tell which number is for which caliber? for example, how can I tell which scoop to use for 30.06?
Thanks.
Click to expand...

I bought a set of scoops a couple of months ago. Mine are all labeled with cubic centimetre amounts instead of the numbers you've listed. From what I've read, all the scoops from now on are going to be listed in CCs.

The published data from Modern Reloading 2nd edition lists the CC scoop you can use for a safe load, but there isn't really a 30-06 scoop. It's just the scoop that gets you in the ball park with the typical case capacity and the typical density of the powder listed. That same scoop should work with other similarly sized cartriges, with that powder.

If you are going to measure volumetrically using the scoops, I would email Lee Precision to ask if your scoops match directly to the now standard CC scoops and go from there. Both Trevj and Baribal have already given you good advice if you have access to a scale.

I don't have a scale, so I've been staying short of the listed max loads with the scoops - I'm looking for moderate velocity anyways.

The technique you use to scoop the powder will probably change the values a bit too. Are you scooping through the powder or pushing down into it? Are you then shaking the scoop to level off or sliding a card across the top?

I just did a quick check with an online conversion calculator and it looks like your scoops might be listed in thousands of a cubic inch, but ask Lee Precision for sure - it might just be coincidence that the values match up.
 
Lee scoop's designed to throw 10% below the max.
If you use them according to the instruction's you'll be safe.
DO NOT shake them to "get a little bit more in".
 
to further complicate matters, there's a SECOND set of scoops out there with just the lee numbers on them, like they're from the old set of lee loaders- these are RED in colour, and EVEN LEE HAS NO IDEA WHAT THE CAPACITY IS- i've written and asked them- i suppose i could do some math or use a scale , but why bother- i use a scale and measure
 
Just how old is this set of powder scoops anyway? New? Really old?

My scoops are marked in CC's as are the new ones listed on midway.com.

Wouldn't surprise me if the scoops were marked in cubic inches, though.

Seems to me I can recall some mention of a conversion chart between the old and new style Lee scoops. Can these be the 'old' style?

Danged if I can find a copy online though.

AFAIK, the loads listed for use with the scoops are all pretty moderate, no matter how hard you work to ram in more powder. As stated, technique matters. try to get same same same, with each scoop full, and you will be fine.

If you have access to a hypodermic syringe, you could measure the cc's of water it takes to fill the scoop, and see if that matches the cubic inch conversion of the scoop number

Cheers
Trev
 
That is the set of lee powder measure kit I am using. All scoops are in red color, in total of 13 scoops in the set, and each scoop have a number range from 020, 039,052,065,069,108,129,141,167,190,205,230 and 258. The slide chart dated back to 1966.
The lee rifle loader also dated back to 1966...body,sizing die,lock nut, stop collar,bullet seater,priming chamber,decapping chamber,decapper,priming rod and the powder measure scoop(also in red with a number141 list on the handle of the scoop (it look still like new!).
The lee rifle loader I have can only load one carliber. The one I am using is for 22-250 and the kit come with a red powder measure scoop #141....so I believe the other 12 scoops on the kit are for other 12 different carlibers....but the powder chart only listed the measure number (all 13 numbers on the scoops) and the powder type, then the charge. It not list what carlibers the other 12numbers are!. for example, because scoop#141 come with the lee loader...now I know scoop#141 is for loading 22-250 powder charge.
Now, I would want to know what carlibers the other 12 scoops are for! and where can I get the information.
Thanks.
 
The other scoops are for use with the slide chart, to load any caliber that requires a charge that falls between the min and max charges listed in the load data. You will not find a list of the 'other 12 calibers' because there is not one, as far as I have ever come across.
You may be able to find out what scoop was used with some calibers by chasing through old catalogs and all that, but it's hardly worth the effort.

But.

These scoops, and the load data, are over 40 years old. Can you even get all the powders that are listed on the chart these days?
Times have changed, what was considered acceptable may no longer be considered safe data. Some up to date load data would be a good idea.

Save yourself some misery. If you are going to use scoops, drop $10 on a new set, with a current slide chart full of powders that are all still available (mostly) as well as a Lee Reloading manual (~$30) and maybe consider a cheapish scale, as well.

Cheers
Trev
 
trevj said:
These scoops, and the load data, are over 40 years old. Can you even get all the powders that are listed on the chart these days?
Times have changed, what was considered acceptable may no longer be considered safe data. Some up to date load data would be a good idea.

Save yourself some misery. If you are going to use scoops, drop $10 on a new set, with a current slide chart full of powders that are all still available (mostly) as well as a Lee Reloading manual (~$30) and maybe consider a cheapish scale, as well.

Cheers
Trev
Click to expand...

+1

The powder formulations are probably different and that data might not apply anymore. I picked up my copy of Modern Reloading from Wholesale Sports for $20, the set of scoops (I think there are 15 now) with slide chart was ~12. If you don't have them, I'd also recommend a powder funnel and primer pocket cleaner. They are between $2-$4 depending on where you shop.

I also have a red scoop with my Lee-loader for .303 British, but I have not used it. The person I got it from did use it, but found the loads were really hot using today's powders (can't remember specifically which powder it was, but he stopped using the Lee-Loader after that batch)

If you are not planning to buy the updated scoops, you should contact Lee Precision to see what they recommend. Their website is at www.leeprecision.com
 
trevj said:
The other scoops are for use with the slide chart, to load any caliber that requires a charge that falls between the min and max charges listed in the load data. You will not find a list of the 'other 12 calibers' because there is not one, as far as I have ever come across.
You may be able to find out what scoop was used with some calibers by chasing through old catalogs and all that, but it's hardly worth the effort.

But.

These scoops, and the load data, are over 40 years old. Can you even get all the powders that are listed on the chart these days?
Times have changed, what was considered acceptable may no longer be considered safe data. Some up to date load data would be a good idea.

Save yourself some misery. If you are going to use scoops, drop $10 on a new set, with a current slide chart full of powders that are all still available (mostly) as well as a Lee Reloading manual (~$30) and maybe consider a cheapish scale, as well.

Cheers
Trev
Click to expand...

oh yea, as a matter of fact MOST of them- 231 and 748 have been around at LEAST that long- as far as up to date data is concerned, a lot of the data in the manuals has been LAWYERIZED to the point of where it JUST BARELY pushes the slide back to compress the spring enough to chamber another round- i go by my speer 11, which is a 1990 version as well as some others-and there are some calibers in the old manuals that aren't listed anymore- the 7.62 mauser isn't in my speer, but it is in an old ideal book- ie my favorite 200 grain bowling pin load( 6.2 of 231) is now considered as a MAXIMUM load- the top end is 6.0- and i would advise AGAINST getting a CHEAP scale- get something like a rcbs 505 or other QUALITY scale- it's one of the MOST BASIC parts of your reloading kit - look at how many people on this board aren't satisfied with their lee scale- and that's the cheapest out there- i use an old BONANZA (20 bucks at the time) and it's never let me down yet- but bonanza is pacific , which is HORNADY- just like the ohaus 505 turned into the rcbs 505- -but if you want ,you can interpolate by taking a scoop of a known powder and weighing it on a scale- but that's REDUNDANT- you already know the weight as you're weighing it anyway-the larger scoops would be for rifle powders, i should think
 
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[ and i would advise AGAINST getting a CHEAP scale- get something like a rcbs 505 or other QUALITY scale- it's one of the MOST BASIC parts of your reloading kit - look at how many people on this board aren't satisfied with their lee scale- and that's the cheapest out there-




Yup, they're cheap. And they work great. I love my Lee scale. Hated it at first, but it grew on me (like a fungus). I got rid of the rest of the Anniversary kit, kept the scale. Absolutely nothing wrong with it.

I've got a 5-05 on the shelf, it's very dusty.
The main two reasons are-1. I don't own a calibration weight set to test my 5-0-5 is in brand newish shape except for being in the bottom of a box, the beam is slightly bent, and I just don't trust it.

The Lee beam will SHATTER instead of bend. So if it's in one piece, it's good to go. And it's capacity is only 110 gr., smaller range of measurement= more accurate on smaller charges.
 
Thanks for all the information on the Lee loader. Now I am ready and fully equipped to start do some serious reloading and I went to pick up some powder....guess what?...NO stores have them(varget/H380 etc.)I was told they having see it in months!..lol...WOW!...NICE!.
CHEERS.
 
kinggeorge168 said:
That is the set of lee powder measure kit I am using. All scoops are in red color, in total of 13 scoops in the set, and each scoop have a number range from 020, 039,052,065,069,108,129,141,167,190,205,230 and 258. The slide chart dated back to 1966.
The lee rifle loader also dated back to 1966...body,sizing die,lock nut, stop collar,bullet seater,priming chamber,decapping chamber,decapper,priming rod and the powder measure scoop(also in red with a number141 list on the handle of the scoop (it look still like new!).
The lee rifle loader I have can only load one carliber. The one I am using is for 22-250 and the kit come with a red powder measure scoop #141....so I believe the other 12 scoops on the kit are for other 12 different carlibers....but the powder chart only listed the measure number (all 13 numbers on the scoops) and the powder type, then the charge. It not list what carlibers the other 12numbers are!. for example, because scoop#141 come with the lee loader...now I know scoop#141 is for loading 22-250 powder charge.
Now, I would want to know what carlibers the other 12 scoops are for! and where can I get the information.
Thanks.
Click to expand...

it doesn't work like that - the scoops give different VOLUMES , NOT DIFFERENT CALIBERS- - 039 came with my 38 super, 190 comes with 308 winchester- your 141 measure typically will throw 36 grains of h335, which is the same as ww748 ( supposedly) now dig out your RELOADING MANUAL AND SEE WHAT CALIBER uses 34-36 grains ofww748 with what bullet etc- it's GOING TO REQUIRE SOME SLEUTHING on your part- for instance, if i want to load a 70 grain 223 , with 748, i can look on the chart and see that 069 throws 16.8 grains ( too low by a long shot) and 108 throws 26.2- a little too warm by a grain and 2 tenths- so i KNOW that NEITHER of those 2 scoops are usable in that application- however , if i was to WEIGH the powder charge out of 108 , i WOULD PROBABLY find that i COULD USE the 108 and be fairly close to what i want which is 25 grains IN THIS APPLICATION
 
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