New Deer Hunting Regulations Proposed for Ontario

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C Broad Arrow

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Attention Deer Hunters (and moose and turkey hunters)


The MNR has released proposed changes to the Hunting Regulations for the 2009 season. Most of these regulations pertain to deer hunting. There is a new proposed “Hunters Choice” tag (Sounds like the name of a popular hunting show on Wildtv.)

There is a new late season archery opportunity for Southern Ontario bow hunters, and a couple of other changes to streamline the regulations.

A summary of the changes can be found at http://www.mnr.gov.on.ca/en/Newsroom/LatestNews/263526.html

The Minister welcomes your comments on these proposed changes.

There are also some additional opportunities for moose and turkey hunters.

Details on all of the changes can be found at http://www.mnr.gov.on.ca/en/Business/FW/2ColumnSubPage/261742.html

Please take the time to read the proposed changes and submit your comments to the Minister.

Deer hunting and hunting in general are under a great deal of pressure in Ontario. We have already lost the spring bear hunt. And while these proposed changes expand the opportunities and seasons for deer hunting, we need to express the positive nature of these changes in order to compete with the other voices in our society that will take a complete opposite view of this matter.

Speak to your friends and neighbours about the problems - in urban and rural areas - that have been casued by the growing deer numbers - and get them too to voice their opinions.

We have an unique opportunity to have the public see hunting as a positive force in solving the problems caused by the growing deer population - crop damage and car/deer collisions.

Take this opportunity to stand up for our sport and the preservation of our deer-hunting heritage.
 
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We'll see where the numbers are after this winter, it's been a tough one so far up this way the snowfall and low temps.
While the press release states a population can go up fast it can also crash pretty quick.
It seems like the perception is that numbers are already on the way down, there were several threads about groups having a tough time seeing and harvesting any deer.
I think the ministry may be caving to the lobbyists for the insurance companies and working towards screwing things up even more:(
 
Campbery said:
We'll see where the numbers are after this winter, it's been a tough one so far up this way the snowfall and low temps.
While the press release states a population can go up fast it can also crash pretty quick.
It seems like the perception is that numbers are already on the way down, there were several threads about groups having a tough time seeing and harvesting any deer.
I think the ministry may be caving to the lobbyists for the insurance companies and working towards screwing things up even more:(
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Generally speaking, deep snow and cold temperatures do not adversely effect herd size. The biggest problem for deer is freezing rain or too many thaws and then freezing where the snowpack becomes hard and prevents them getting to the browse.

As far as groups having problems, it really depends on where you are in the province. In areas in where the Ministry is proposing the changes they are in Souther Ontario where there are mainly bow and shotgun(and muzzleloader) seasons. The bow and muzzelloader seasons are generally controlled hunts only. So in areas around Toronto, Hamilton,London,and Oshawa where the herds have increased is where the new regs are being proposed.

There is a great deal of crop damage due to the increase in the deer populations and with higher populations come more deer-car collisions. So I think there is a legitimate public safety concern and thankfully a tacit recognition that bow hunting is a legitimate means of deer herd population control. I think we should be applauding the Ministry for that.

As far as the influence of "lobbyist for the insurance companies" goes who knows.

You could be right.

But if their "lobbying" opens up more opportunities for bow hunters in Ontario, and the public come to recognize that bow hunting is a legitimate deer management tool, then we all benefit.

And further to your point, if the insurance companies are so powerful to have lobbied the government successfully to add an additional bow hunting season, then this is one of the best things to have happen to hunting in general in Ontario for quite some time. Further if this is the case then the hunters in the province have a new friend that has stepped up to the plate to help them.
 
7.62mm said:
Any new hunting opportunity is fantastic, however it came about. Can't wait to freeze my butt off in January!:D
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Right on 7.62... Any new hinting opportunity is a fantasic one... Please take the time to register a comment with the Ministry.

Its time we start to see our deer as a valuable resource that can generate economic and social benefits beyond just the deer camps of the past.
 
late season hunt seems dumb to me. Why not have an earily season in like Sept so we can maybe try for a velvet buck???? Late season everyone will be shooting shedded bucks thinking they are does. January hunt doesn't interest me at all, Im too busy snowmobiling and coyote hunting anyways.
 
Don't get me wrong, I'm all for expanded hunting opportunities and using hunters to manage wildlife. What I'm against is the government managing people and accounts not animals. Selling extra tags for $40 a pop when guys with primary tags aren't getting drawn for antlerless:confused: Most of these WMU already have as many as 6 extra tags, I find it hard to believe these decisions are in the best interests of managing this valuable resource for the long term.
 
Campbery said:
Don't get me wrong, I'm all for expanded hunting opportunities and using hunters to manage wildlife. What I'm against is the government managing people and accounts not animals. Selling extra tags for $40 a pop when guys with primary tags aren't getting drawn for antlerless:confused: Most of these WMU already have as many as 6 extra tags, I find it hard to believe these decisions are in the best interests of managing this valuable resource for the long term.
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Campbery... not sure if I totally understand your point here. I agree that the tag system could be improved, especially when it comes to anterless deer. But having said that, the only way to manage the herd is through people. And there is a need to attach an economic value to it in order to ensure it is treated as a valuable resource.

I think there is an argument that they should let more tags for anterless in the first draw, before they sell additional ones in after the fact. But that is why we should express those ideas at this stage of the consultation phase.

Put pencil to paper and let the MNR know what you are thinking.

Or if you are not comfortable expressing your thought on paper, join one of the conservation groups and let them express your thoughts for you. There is strength in numbers. The anti's did not get the spring bear hunt banned over night. They did it incrementally.

We now have an opportunity to expand the deer season due to the increase in numbers, the number of deer/car collisions and the damage done to crops.

Lets use this opportunity to make hunting - bow - rifle - shotgun - crossbow - muzzelloader - a real alternative to solve the problem in Southern Ontario of deer over-population.

They have given us an opportunity... lets seize the moment!
 
I dont agree with extending seasons past Dec31's I was hunting on the 30th and passed two deer up thinking they were big does but wait what are those hanging between their legs??? they were both bucks but they both had shed their racks already.

If anything a 2week muzzle loader season right after rifle/shotgun season would be good or extend the current rifle/shotgun seasons by a week or two and include muzzleloader but no dogs the second two weeks.
 
srt4u2nv said:
I dont agree with extending seasons past Dec31's I was hunting on the 30th and passed two deer up thinking they were big does but wait what are those hanging between their legs??? they were both bucks but they both had shed their racks already.

If anything a 2week muzzle loader season right after rifle/shotgun season would be good or extend the current rifle/shotgun seasons by a week or two and include muzzleloader but no dogs the second two weeks.
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Well I think we are all glad that you had the opportunity to see something "hanging between their legs" and made the right ethical decision. Legally you would have been ok to shoot one of them if it had dropped their antlers.

In the research it seems that it is very unusual for deer to drop their antlers that early, but on occasion it does happen, especially in the northern areas.

But most deer do not drop their antlers until February according to most of the research.

I think as I meantioned earlier, we should welcome the new season, but you make a good suggestion and you should submit it to the MNR.
 
oh well looky here, again only southern ontario is mentioned, here in NORTHWESTERN ONTARIO apparently our farret faced prickmier has forgotten us, first he ruined our moose population by cancelling our spring bear hunt and allows more bears to reach maturity in an already densely populated area ( we have bears coming right into town and eating garbage and apples from our trees and forcing the police to dispatch them) and now he screws us over again with deer tags (anterless only) and now we have deer everywhere forcing the moose out (the one that live from not being eaten by bears) very high motality rate on yearlings here now. leave well enough alone...when will they learn you can't make decisions that effect us all from an office in toronto or a window seat on a plane at 25000 feet. i'd love to get him out in our neck of the woods but he'd probably break a leg and i would just have to leave him there and go get help, yeah go get help...
 
coldfire said:
oh well looky here, again only southern ontario is mentioned, here in NORTHWESTERN ONTARIO apparently our farret faced prickmier has forgotten us, first he ruined our moose population by cancelling our spring bear hunt and allows more bears to reach maturity in an already densely populated area ( we have bears coming right into town and eating garbage and apples from our trees and forcing the police to dispatch them) and now he screws us over again with deer tags (anterless only) and now we have deer everywhere forcing the moose out (the one that live from not being eaten by bears) very high motality rate on yearlings here now. leave well enough alone...when will they learn you can't make decisions that effect us all from an office in toronto or a window seat on a plane at 25000 feet. i'd love to get him out in our neck of the woods but he'd probably break a leg and i would just have to leave him there and go get help, yeah go get help...
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Did you even bother to read the changes?

Northwest Region

1. New resident deer seasons created in the following WMUs:
• WMU 18A - Archery and Archery-Muzzleloader-Shotgun-Rifle deer
hunting seasons concurrent with existing moose hunting seasons in that
WMU.
• WMUs 2 and 19 – Archery deer hunting season to open on September 1st
matching deer archery seasons within Cervid Ecological Zone (CEZ) B
and creation of an Archery-Muzzleloader-Shotgun-Rifle deer hunting
season concurrent with existing moose hunting seasons in those WMUs.
• WMUs 1C, 16A, 16B, 16C, 17 – creation of Archery-Muzzleloader-
Shotgun-Rifle deer hunting seasons concurrent with existing moose
hunting seasons in those WMUs.
• WMU 18B – an Archery-Muzzleloader deer hunting season followed by an
Archery-Muzzleloader-Shotgun-Rifle deer hunting season matching
existing moose hunting seasons in that WMU.
2. Create a non-resident Archery-Muzzleloader-Shotgun-Rifle deer hunting
season in WMUs 12A & 12B to match the timing of existing non-resident deer
gun seasons in neighbouring WMUs 6, 7B, 9A, 9B, and 11A.
3. Re-instate an early non-resident early archery deer hunting season in WMU
11A.
4. Harmonize the deer hunting seasons in WMU 8 with surrounding WMUs 7B,
9A and 9B (both WMU 8 resident and non-resident seasons will close on Dec
15).
5. Create a non-resident moose archery-only hunting season in WMU 11B to
run concurrently with the resident archery-only moose hunting season.

Seems like they are trying to do something to me about the very issue you describe by trying to reduce the deer in various WMU's.

Sometimes we are our own worst enemies.
 
CanadianLawman said:
Campbery... not sure if I totally understand your point here. I agree that the tag system could be improved, especially when it comes to anterless deer. But having said that, the only way to manage the herd is through people. And there is a need to attach an economic value to it in order to ensure it is treated as a valuable resource.
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My point is that I don't agree that deer populations are at the highest levels, that extra tags are being used to boost revenue and play out a political agenda. I believe that deer numbers are down in most areas of the province over the last couple years. To me it's backwards logic that if we're not meeting harvest expectations and issueing more tags than ever we should expand the seasons and issue more tags to meet a harvest goal instead of looking at why harvest numbers aren't being met in the first place.
While I agree that expanding hunting opportunities and using people to manage herds is a good thing it can also be bad if the government is relying on stats from insurance companies and public perceptions to implement policy. Any CO I have talked too in the last couple years has had a tough time putting gas in there truck let alone keeping tabs on population trends. Most processors I have spoken with state business was way down the last couple years, 30-40% less deer being cut. From my own observations hunting areas 4, 43, 80, 82, 83 and 84, we are seeing less deer since this new program of extra tags has been implemented.
 
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Campbery said:
My point is that I don't agree that deer populations are at the highest levels, that extra tags are being used to boost revenue and play out a political agenda. I believe that deer numbers are down in most areas of the province over the last couple years. To me it's backwards logic that if we're not meeting harvest expectations and issueing more tags than ever we should expand the seasons and issue more tags to meet a harvest goal instead of looking at why harvest numbers aren't being met in the first place.
While I agree that expanding hunting opportunities and using people to manage herds is a good thing it can also be bad if the government is relying on stats from insurance companies and public perceptions to implement policy. Any CO I have talked too in the last couple years has had a tough time putting gas in there truck let alone keeping tabs on population trends. Most processors I have spoken with state business was way down the last couple years, 30-40% less deer being cut. From my own observations hunting areas 4, 43, 80, 82, 83 and 84, we are seeing less deer since this new program of extra tags has been implemented.
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I'm sure we all know that there has been NO shortage of deer in our hunting grounds, at least in Southern Ontario.
 
Campbery said:
My point is that I don't agree that deer populations are at the highest levels, that extra tags are being used to boost revenue and play out a political agenda. I believe that deer numbers are down in most areas of the province over the last couple years. To me it's backwards logic that if we're not meeting harvest expectations and issueing more tags than ever we should expand the seasons and issue more tags to meet a harvest goal instead of looking at why harvest numbers aren't being met in the first place.
While I agree that expanding hunting opportunities and using people to manage herds is a good thing it can also be bad if the government is relying on stats from insurance companies and public perceptions to implement policy. Any CO I have talked too in the last couple years has had a tough time putting gas in there truck let alone keeping tabs on population trends. Most processors I have spoken with state business was way down the last couple years, 30-40% less deer being cut. From my own observations hunting areas 4, 43, 80, 82, 83 and 84, we are seeing less deer since this new program of extra tags has been implemented.
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Campbery

My experience in the area around Toronto and north as far as Barrie and west as far as London has been the opposite. It is rare that I do not see 2 dozen deer in a 60 minute road trip.

I have seen deer at Yonge and Bloomington next to the MNR offices...5 pm during rush hour. I have lived in that area for 20 years and the frequency that I see deer are increasing.

I do not think that the number of licenses even at the curent price will make a big difference to the treasury in Ontario, and I do not see what "political agenda" is being played out. If you would care to share your view I am willing to listen and learn.


One of the main reasons harvest numbers are not being met is not because of a lack of deer...but because of a lack of deer hunters.

We as hunters are shrinking in numbers for a multitude of reasons too numerous to discuss here, but the gun registry and changes regarding the age at which young people can hunt, along with declining birthrates wihtin cultures where hunting has been a tradition, have all contributed.

So expanding opportunities for a contracting and aging pool of hunters and adding seasons in areas of abundance seem to me to be logical and good management.

There is also a eco-tourism benefit to the Ontario economy. When hunters go afield they tend to spend more than other groups such as "bird watchers". Bow hunters in recent years in Southern Ontario are buying seed, developing food plots, improving habitat and buying more tree stands than in any previous period. When hunters travel to their hunting lands they buy food, gas and lodging...typically outside of the regular tourist seasons, thereby helping the small operator in the various areas generate a little more business that they would not have had the season not existed.

As far as CO's not having gas etc that is a separate issue. Poor budget management in the MNR is my guess. Too many chiefs, not enough indians and not enough cash being allocated to the CO's to do their job. Frankly there are not enought CO's.

But our biggest concern should be the lack of deer hunters...not the abundance of tags. That is why processors are also seeing a decline in numbers.

Insurance companies keep good records on collisions, especially when they have to pay out. So if they are seeing a rise in the problem, along with farmers reporting more and more crop damage, there is a high percentage chance it has to do with the existence of more deer.

I think what we all would like to see is a solution that brings forth a good balance of good quality deer and low negative impact with crops and cars. The way to do that is to improve the quality of the deer population.

Reduce the number of does, work to remove bucks with poor genetics, plant food plots to improve deer quality and educate our youth that deer hunting is a lot of fun and a proud tradition in order to increase the number of new hunters. These steps will all help to ensure that hunting remains a viable and effective management tool for the deer herd.
 
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