New to reloading pistol rounds- 38 s&w

[bgcameron]

I just got my gear together to reload for my Enfield revolver. I'm new to reloading pistol rounds, so I've got a few questions...

I am using Berry's .357 158grn plated FP bullets, with a start charge of 2.2 grains of bullseye.


OAL- I've noticed the trend for rifles is to have the bullet seated close to maximum OAL to prevent bullet "jump", and seated enough to grip the bullet properly. Max OAL for 38 s&w is supposed to be 1.24", but in my speer manual all the loads are between 1.055" and 1.065". The instructions on my Lee die set say a MINIMUM of 1.24" - ??. Where do I start with pistol rounds? Is there a certain percentage of the bullet's width that should be used as a measurement for seating depth? How does seating depth affect pressures?

Neck Expanding- How much is enough and how much is too much? What should the inner diameter of the case mouth be in relation to the bullet size? (this goes back to my concern about pressure)

Loads- Anyone have any good load recipes with Bullseye?

Thanks!!! I'm REALLY looking forward to shooting my revolver.

 

[bgcameron]

Another question in regards to the LEE 38 s&w die set. Why do they come with a .38 Auto sizing die?

After looking through cartridge specs it would seem that if anything, 9mm would be a better substitute. The length and diameter are much closer to the 38 S&W.

 

[480ruger]

stay within the specs of your manual.. And if you seat your bullet too far in, you will have a pressure spike....do not load your enfield hot!!! it may not handle the pressure do too the design of the break-open action...i have loaded mine with 2 grains of bullseye,and all is well... You want too expand the case mouth to exept the bullet without shaving it....and if you seat the the bullet so your oal is on the long side it may stick out past the cylinder

 

[bgcameron]

I shot my first dozen reloads today. I seated the bullets roughly .260" into the cases, and used 2.2 grains of Bullseye. OAL was 1.14".

The shots left a few flakes of unburnt powder in the cases and barrel. I was a bit surprised because no shots hit the paper at 15 yards. My guess is that they were low.

 

[sunray]

"...Where do I start with pistol rounds?..." A manual. Lee gets their data from the powder makers. They don't do any load developement.
Plated bullets use cast bullet data. My old Lyman book gives 1.8 to 2.5 of Bullseye for a 158 grain cast bullet. Mind you, the Brits used a 200 grain cast bullet in Enfield revolvers. Tried to give the cartridge more 'thump' by using the heavy bullet. The .38 S&W uses a .360" bullet.
OAL's are about the heaviest bullet available. Lyman gives 1.150" for a 158 cast bullet. Speer OAL's are about their bullets only.

 

[hunter64]

I had a custom made mold by Mountain Molds in the US to duplicate the 200 grn round nose and had it sized to .362 so that it would take into account for worn older .38 S&W revolvers. I get great accuracy out of the properly sized bullet and they are fun to shoot when you can actually hit something with it.

I tried the .357-.358 bullet routine but really couldn't get any accuracy out of the 4 revolvers I have, your experience my vary. I was lucky to get 2 bullets out of 6 on the 8"x11" target at 25 yards with any .358 bullet. I size most of mine .361 and I can keep all 6 in the black at 25 yards from the bench double action. With my police positive I can get about 2" at 25 yards single action from the bench.

The enfield revolver is regulated with a 200 grn bullet at about 650 fps (if I remember correctly) at 25 yards. With this combo you will get point of aim and point of impact the same.

 

[bgcameron]

"...Where do I start with pistol rounds?..." A manual. Lee gets their data from the powder makers. They don't do any load developement.
Plated bullets use cast bullet data. My old Lyman book gives 1.8 to 2.5 of Bullseye for a 158 grain cast bullet. Mind you, the Brits used a 200 grain cast bullet in Enfield revolvers. Tried to give the cartridge more 'thump' by using the heavy bullet. The .38 S&W uses a .360" bullet.
OAL's are about the heaviest bullet available. Lyman gives 1.150" for a 158 cast bullet. Speer OAL's are about their bullets only.

I couldnt find any data relating to the bullet I am using. Perhaps I'll try play a little with different OALs. I understand that you must not seat too deep, but i still dont know how far is too deep...

How far in do you guys seat your 38 s&w bullets?

 

[BCRider]

All the bullets for .357 that I've loaded had a clear marking on them for seating. Do the ones you have not have such a ring? On the jacketed ones there was a ring and on the cast ones a tapered shoulder indicating where the case rim was to be crimped into place. This gave all the bullets about a .25 to .30 seating depth. OAL varied depending on the shape of the bullet and weight. I know this is from .38Spl and .357 loading but since you're using .357 bullets the comments are valid to some extent.

If you don't have any such crimp rings on your bullets then my guideline so far has been to run them in so that there is just a little bit of parallel side showing above the case lip so the crimp actually bears down on something instead of reaching in to the tapered sides. But you'd want to temper this by checking what the OAL comes in at so it's not too short or overly long. Generally long is less of a risk than too short. As long as the bullet doesn't stick out past the front face of the cylinder. Too deep runs the risk of rising pressure unless the charge is cut back. Too long reduces it but means you may not reach the velocity you're after.

The real issue is that you're working with bullets that are sized from 3 to 4 thou smaller than what your gun requires. This means you either need to source a mold and cast your own bullets or you need to come up with a supply of cast .357 and then make up or get made a swaging die that you can put a .357 into and then drop in a swaging mandrel and with a sharp rap from a hammer swage, otherwise simply called "crush" the bullets out to .361 to .362 to suit your gun. This will make them slightly shorter but not enough to matter. But at least they'll fit the bore and develop a proper spin. Shooting .003 to .004 undersize bullets means that they likely tumbled and that is the reason for your terrible accuracy results.