New to Steel Shot - most useable choke for ducks?

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Rick

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Yes, I know that is an impossibly general question. I don't need that explained to me.

But the last time I hunted waterfowl, lead shot was still legal. I refuse to shoot steel through my Superposed and other Brownings, and I refuse to pay the exorbitant prices for soft "non-toxic" shot. I am up to my ears in pheasants, huns, and sharpies, and with two good Griffs working in front of me, I don't miss hunting ducks much (although I sure did enjoy it back in the day). Thus, I have no experience, nada, with steel shot. And I can comfortably predict I never will.

However, my wife had been bugging me she wants to go duck hunting with the dogs, so she can watch the dogs retrieve from water (???? WTF ????). Well, far be it from me to ever discourage hunting, even if it isn't something I'm interested in. So I went and bought her some of the soft "non toxic" shot for her over and under and let her have at it. But her motto is "conservation through incompetence" - she is a lousy wing shot. And keeping her in non-toxic shot is killing me... she pulls the trigger with great enthusiasm.

I was almost on the verge of buying her a new shotgun, and then recalled I have Dad's old Winchester Model 25 (economy version of the Model 12), which he put a Cutts Compensator on the end of. The problem is, it was Dad's goose gun, and the only tubes I have for it are full and extra full. Points of constriction don't even come into it, as by the time the wad and shot column get to the choke, they have flown through the bulbous compensator "cage".

But this is certainly going to eliminate any fears of damaging barrels, as there is no way any restriction is going to cause a pressure buildup at the choke. Not with all those slots behind the shot charge as it enters the choke.

Problem is, choke tubes for the Cutts Compensator (Lyman) are difficult to find these days.

So, you steel shooting guys, being as I assume the wife is going to be either shooting over dekes or jump shooting ducks, what is GENERALLY the best choke for shooting steel?

I'm thinking Improved Cylinder is the Cutts choke tube I should be looking for. Would I be wrong? (And yes, I realize the only way to tell how it will actually pattern is to pattern it, no matter what is marked on the choke tube/barrel).
 
Its not a gas pressure build up that causes barrel damage.but the fact that steelshot does not compact together like lead shot as it goes through the full choke.most if not all manufactures will recomend using nothing tighter than a modified choke for steel.
 
rembolt said:
Its not a gas pressure build up that causes barrel damage.but the fact that steelshot does not compact together like lead shot as it goes through the full choke.most if not all manufactures will recomend using nothing tighter than a modified choke for steel.
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Yes, steel does not flow through tight chokes like lead, and it is also susceptible to bridging.

What do you believe causes the plastic deformation of the barrel to go to the extent that a nice, consistent ring is left in the barrel if it isn't pressure caused by that temporary traffic jam at the choke?
 
Fenix.NZ said:
i find that Full with lead shot = Mod with Steel shot

so if you prefer to use mod with lead, i would lean on the IC for Steel
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Yep, seems like IC gets the general vote of approval.

And, as it happens, I have just found somebody with a Cutts IC choke for sale, new in the packaging, for $30.

Done!

Maybe I'll have to shoot a few ducks myself, just for old times sake. Shot my first ducks with that shotgun and Dad, back in the early 60's. Kicked the crap out of me back then...
 
Rick said:
What do you believe causes the plastic deformation of the barrel to go to the extent that a nice, consistent ring is left in the barrel if it isn't pressure caused by that temporary traffic jam at the choke?
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The repeated impact of the steel shot as it collides with the area of the bore where the choke begins is what causes the ring. It is the hardness of the steel that causes the rings. The problem is not as rampant now because of the advances in wads which essentially prevent the shot from touching the bore in most cases.
 
Turkeyslayer 1300 said:
The repeated impact of the steel shot as it collides with the area of the bore where the choke begins is what causes the ring.
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I have heard that version as well as the pressure bump theory.

So if it is the impact of the steel shot, why does it not look like peening, instead of a nice, regular ring?

The few ringed barrels I have looked at have looked remarkably consistent, almost as though put there with maching, including one which had exactly two shots fired out of it before the owner retrieved it from the loser he momentarily had loaned it to.

I really don't have that much invested in the "why" beyond academic curiosity, as my older shotguns will never see a round loaded with steel shot.
 
i just tried out some new ammo last weekend that shot at 1700 fps i tried a few with a full choke but did not like it so went back to mod jumped a pont with 5 teal in it and got 3 teal with 3 shots so im sticking with mod good luck
 
"But her motto is "conservation through incompetence" - she is a lousy wing shot. And keeping her in non-toxic shot is killing me... she pulls the trigger with great enthusiasm."

Okay, step ONE before anything else is to get your wife to be able to hit a flying bird. She has to learn to shoot and practise. Hit the skeet field, if your ultimate intention is ducks over decoys. This is just an exercise in frustration otherwise. Is she flinching due to recoil?

Otherwise, 2-3/4" shells firing #3 or #4 steel from an IC tube work very well for me over decoys. I've even used an Open Cylinder barrel with equally good results.
 
Grouse Man said:
Okay, step ONE before anything else is to get your wife to be able to hit a flying bird. She has to learn to shoot and practise. Hit the skeet field, if your ultimate intention is ducks over decoys. This is just an exercise in frustration otherwise. Is she flinching due to recoil?
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Yes. She does have to learn to shoot and practice. And she is doing lots of practicing. But some learn faster than others, and she - so far - can't get away from getting caught up with aiming as though she was doing her competitive FITA archery thing.

I guess I could tell her she has to stay home until she can shoot better, but I don't think that would go over so good.

She does pretty good when a bird surprises her - not so good on a range or flushing a bird the dogs have pointed and she knows she's about to get a shot. Eventually she will click in that this isn't the same as launching arrows at targets 70m away with her recurve.

The shotgun is fitted to her, and the loads are light. She shoots her .358 Win very well, so recoil isn't the issue.

I have a younger brother who can shoot well with anybody who wants to try their luck with the heavier calibers like his .416 Rigby. He doesn't do much better than her with a shotgun.

I have often seen good shots that can't seem to wrap their head around shotguns - just as I have seen shotgunners who couldn't hit anything with a handgun if their life depended on it. I think for a lot of those in both camps, it is the mental game they're having problems with.

Otherwise, 2-3/4" shells firing #3 or #4 steel from an IC tube work very well for me over decoys. I've even used an Open Cylinder barrel with equally good results.
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That seems to be what she will be trying once the IC gets here.
 
Rick said:
Yes. She does have to learn to shoot and practice. And she is doing lots of practicing. But some learn faster than others, and she - so far - can't get away from getting caught up with aiming as though she was doing her competitive FITA archery thing.

I guess I could tell her she has to stay home until she can shoot better, but I don't think that would go over so good.

She does pretty good when a bird surprises her - not so good on a range or flushing a bird the dogs have pointed and she knows she's about to get a shot. Eventually she will click in that this isn't the same as launching arrows at targets 70m away with her recurve.

The shotgun is fitted to her, and the loads are light. She shoots her .358 Win very well, so recoil isn't the issue.

I have a younger brother who can shoot well with anybody who wants to try their luck with the heavier calibers like his .416 Rigby. He doesn't do much better than her with a shotgun.

I have often seen good shots that can't seem to wrap their head around shotguns - just as I have seen shotgunners who couldn't hit anything with a handgun if their life depended on it. I think for a lot of those in both camps, it is the mental game they're having problems with.


That seems to be what she will be trying once the IC gets here.
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Butt,Belly,Beak, BANG!
 
My son has Trulock Precison hunters in his 12 gauge 3.5" O/U - they are marked SKT1 and SKT2 .
he takes geese at insane distances with that gun.
I use the same chokes in my 20, but they are marked different ly IC/MOD
Constriction is the same however.
Cat
 
Just a thought, but Mossberg 500s are relatively low cost and work great. You are looking at under $300 new easy and they come with choke tubes so no steel shot worries. Even a Maverick 88 can be had for near $200 new, again with choke tubes.
 
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