New to the forum, New to Shooting & new[ish] to collecting

sean69

sean69

CGN frequent flyer
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Location
Oshawa
Hi All;

As the title says, I'm pretty 'new' to all of this, always had an interest in militaria & have been collecting bayonets form some time now, for some odd reason, one day I decided I needed the rifles to go with my bayonets...

Much more difficult than I thought.

First off I've been looking for a nice Kar98, been going to shows for about a year now & this morning was the first time I've even seen one in 8mm ~ it was one of the Yugo M-48BO [unmarked] models, only $400... I'm in Ontario, am I doing something wrong - I read the March purchases and see several entries about dozens of german k98's being at the recent chilliwack[?] show... I've seen them on the internet ranging from $300 [but not in stock] to over $2000 depending on condition [and greed].
What is a reasonable price to be paying for a nice WWII k98?
Lets say in the range from almost pristine all matching parts to "at least all the parts are k98 & t still shoots good"?

Second, M1 Garand.... I don't really care about arsenal or matching parts, I want a nice shooter, and again, I have not seen one in Ontario, I did see an M1 Carbine [paratrooper model - prohibited, damn!] - again I have not seen one online for less than $1500 & trying to import one from the states is 'problematic'

Finally [for now] - I have not seen at a show nor I believe online [in Canada] - an early 'as complete as possible' Type 99 Arisaka - and darn tootin I need it with mum intact... :)

So basically I don't have a real good baseline for what these rifles should be costing me, looks like any of them will be well over $1000 in Ontario, am I just looking in the wrong places somehow? [been to over a dozen show & early, there no more than 1/2 hour after the doors open.... ]

Any advice? pointers? Did all the nice milsurp really migrate to B.C. somehow?

-thanks
-sean
 
Milsurps are everywhere. You could find a K98 mauser, and a type 99 Arisaka right here on CGN. Just put up a WTB add in the Equipment exchange.

I did, and found both of those rifles easy.

I Dont Care about "mum intact" Type 99's "numbers matching" K98 mausers. Those are best left to high roller collectors. I Prefer condition because I'm a shooter. Matching numbers and intact mums usually just raise the price.

A Mauser with matching numbers won't out shoot a K98 without them

For prices just watch what these rifles sell for.
 
Mums and matching numbers are for collectors. Expect to pay at least a $1000 plus for numbers matching K98. But a mismatched piece can still shoot well and has all the same history. Sometimes a mismatch has more documented history, as in russian capture.

And gun shows in ontario dont seem to be so great, it where im from too and i dont see many K98s.
 
M1 carbines shouldnt be prohib, just restricted.

And you need to understand something, asking for an early type 99 with mum is asking for a collector piece, so expect to pay accordingly.
 
Check the milsurp EE regularly and you will find anything eventually. You are not the only one waiting to pounce on a decently priced M1 Garand, so be ready to make your decision quickly when you do see one.
 
Thanks for all the replies and pointers guys, I didn't realize that there was a dedicated exchange on this site!

CanadianAR
Mums and matching numbers are for collectors
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I am a collector ;) I guess I'll just have to divert some of my tattoo funds over to my armament fund. :)

CanadaianAR
M1 carbines shouldnt be prohib, just restricted.
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They had it labeled as such - I was assuming it was because it had a collapsible stock that put it under that magic 660mm [or whatever it is] - if that was the case then it was a screaming deal at $1200.00 [really nice condition]
 
There have been some very nice M1s come through here recently, both carbines and Garands. There was a Garand listed as 'new', a very nice Danish naval issued one as well. I think prices on them were both right around $1800. There have been some very nice restricted M1 carbines too around $700 or $800.
 
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Welcome to the recreational firearms community.

First of all, I would recommend that you investigate the Gun Shows in your area. Toronto (I shudder at the thought of recommending anyone going to Toronto, but you are young and should be able to survive,) Toronto has several Gun Shows each year, and other smaller communities have them too. Hamilton, Brantford, London, and others within a reasonable drive of your location.

Make your face known around the Milsurps people. If you show a genuine interest, these guys will gladly help you all they can.

Before you make ANY purchase you should read up on it, ask questions, and be aware of the things that are "ODD" that could be on a rifle but are not supposed to. Also, pay attention to what is happening in the Milsurps, and what newly made items are available as "add ons."

To give you an example, there are newly manufactured Paratrooper Stocks available to bolt onto a M1 Carbine. And that can double the price if an unsuspecting buyer gets it, thinking it is original.

Probably the best advice is to Buy A Book For Every Rifle You Buy. Even better, get a good book on the intended purchase rifle, and take it with you while you are looking at the rifle so you have a reference.

Unfortunately, there are a very few unscrupulous people who misrepresent their products so that they can get a higher price for them, and there are quite a few who are "creative" when it comes to describing the item that they are selling. Facts and History can take a back seat at times.
.
 
flying pig said:
There have been some very nice M1s come through here recently, both carbines and Garands. There was a Garand listed as 'new', a very nice Danish naval issued one as well. I think prices on them were both right around $1800. There have been some very nice restricted M1 carbines too around $700 or $800.
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$1800 - ouch, pricey. I guess there is a point where cost and desire meet, $1800 is pushing the envelope for me. Maybe Marstar will get a hold of those 700,000 Korean M1s the US does not want....

-sean
 
buffdog said:
.
Welcome to the recreational firearms community.

First of all, I would recommend that you investigate the Gun Shows in your area. Toronto (I shudder at the thought of recommending anyone going to Toronto, but you are young and should be able to survive,) Toronto has several Gun Shows each year, and other smaller communities have them too. Hamilton, Brantford, London, and others within a reasonable drive of your location.
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Thanks for the welcome ... what's wrong with TO?? ;)
I have been to most of them within a couple of hours driving distance Pickering has one once about every 3 months or so, Markham has 3 or 4 year as well as about the same number of militaira shows, there is a big militaria show in Etobicoke this weekend but the biggest one I went to was in Orangeville - a couple hours north, probably 200+ tables, but mostly hunting.

There is one in Cornwall within the next couple of weeks, I think it is fairly large, but it's a 4 hour drive for me - though Cornwall is a 'border town' - it may be my best bet to find a Garand? [just looked it up - Sunday, May 27, 2012]

Make your face known around the Milsurps people. If you show a genuine interest, these guys will gladly help you all they can.
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I am working on that :) every time I see that guy that sold me my kropatschek bayonet he tries to sell me the rifle that goes with ....

Before you make ANY purchase you should read up on it, ask questions, and be aware of the things that are "ODD" that could be on a rifle but are not supposed to. Also, pay attention to what is happening in the Milsurps, and what newly made items are available as "add ons."

To give you an example, there are newly manufactured Paratrooper Stocks available to bolt onto a M1 Carbine. And that can double the price if an unsuspecting buyer gets it, thinking it is original.
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All sound advice. I expect I will have a couple of 'hard learned' lessons along the way as well...

Probably the best advice is to Buy A Book For Every Rifle You Buy. Even better, get a good book on the intended purchase rifle, and take it with you while you are looking at the rifle so you have a reference.
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Good point, I'm a web developer & can vouch that good documentation is worth 10x it weight in gold!

Unfortunately, there are a very few unscrupulous people who misrepresent their products so that they can get a higher price for them, and there are quite a few who are "creative" when it comes to describing the item that they are selling. Facts and History can take a back seat at times.
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I have seen this frequently buying bayonets, though usually they are just overpriced waiting for that sucker with too much cash - I actually have a DAF marked bayonet that I still can't verify...
pix312963051.jpg



Thanks again for your input..

-sean
 
I've been collecting seriously for a couple of years now but have purposely stayed away from K98K's and Garands. These are highly sought after weapons in part because they were two of the most iconic weapons in world history. Both expert collectors and the uninitiated have driven the prices of these into the stratosphere and it's all to easy to get caught up in the excitement and get burned. At the Chilliwack gun show I saw both a Brazilian M954 and VZ24's misrepresented as K98k's. Both in fair to poor condition with $600+ price tags. I've seen post war mix master Garands in fair condition listed for $1,200+. There are plenty of other much safer milsurps to cut your teeth on while learning the ropes. For the price of one collector grade K98K I can buy three numbers matching South American contract Mausers! Some of these often overlooked pieces have great potential for appreciation. A true collector obsesses about the history and little details about the pieces he is after. When in doubt research research and then research some more. The search is half the fun. Once you buy you're out looking for the next one!
 
I'm starting to Think it Be easier to get a nicely priced Czech M24 or Yugo M48 and just enjoy shooting the extra ammo you can afford to buy afterwards. Still wouldn't mind getting a nice shooter German K98 maybe sometime in the future when I can afford to pay more.
 
BigC396 said:
I'm starting to Think it Be easier to get a nicely priced Czech M24 or Yugo M48 and just enjoy shooting the extra ammo you can afford to buy afterwards. Still wouldn't mind getting a nice shooter German K98 maybe sometime in the future when I can afford to pay more.
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Funny you should mention - I just got off the phone with Frank @ Marstar & he was kind enough to put aside both an M-24 & an M-48BO ... He was also able to give me some info on the Cornwall show, looks like it is really not worth 4 hours of driving for me.. ! [Thanks Frank!!]
 
Yeah they look nice, and not a whole lot different then a Kar 98K some interesting history in and of themselves. Damn once I gets some money saved up in couple of months I might have to order something myself. Anyway so if I hijacked the thread.
 
BigC396 said:
Yeah they look nice, and not a whole lot different then a Kar 98K some interesting history in and of themselves. Damn once I gets some money saved up in couple of months I might have to order something myself. Anyway so if I hijacked the thread.
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Actually I had sent them an email inquiring about availability ~ I wanted to know if they would have any left in about a month & the answer back was "extremely unlikely" So if you can, I would jump on it. BTW, the M-48BO I saw at the show was for all purposes a 'new' rifle, bolt was still sticky with packing grease, stock was unfinished & still rough to the touch - no signs of any handling or use at all. [for some silly reason I did not look down the bore.... ]

-sean
 
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